Off Topic this is the end

[Commachio]

You must log in or register to see media

The right to die.

Or who decides?

After the chat on the other thread...

Many put their pets to sleep. But should it be the same with us?

We;re all gonna go anyway, what's the point in being a mess and a burden to others?

 

[Sweats]

Pasting my comment from the other thread..


The other thing that bothers me about it. Is the social care.. you end up with parents/ grandparents who have saved their whole lives to let their kids inherit something.. yet we keep them alive and put them into care homes and force the sale of the homes and spend their savings to pay for keeping them in a vegative state then the family get**** all.

 

[NSIS]

So long as a person is mentally competent to make the decision, and there’s good medical reason too - if life has really become that intolerable, then there shouldn’t be any legal impediment to it, imo.

 

[PINKIE]

Brilliant song

As for the topic. As I said on the other thread. I'm an advocate of the right to die. As long as people sign a living will when they have capacity stating their intentions. The decision needs to come from the person themselves prior to them being non communicative, so it needs some forward planning.

What I wouldn't want to see is that decision being taken by family members without the consent of the person. As that is fraught with legal issues, financial issues and emotional turmoil.

 

[PINKIE]

Pasting my comment from the other thread..


The other thing that bothers me about it. Is the social care.. you end up with parents/ grandparents who have saved their whole lives to let their kids inherit something.. yet we keep them alive and put them into care homes and force the sale of the homes and spend their savings to pay for keeping them in a vegative state then the family get**** all.

I agree. But you could set a dangerous precedent allowing somebody to die to save the family having to pay for their care.

 

[DerekTheMole]

You must log in or register to see media

The right to die.

Or who decides?

After the chat on the other thread...

Many put their pets to sleep. But should it be the same with us?

We;re all gonna go anyway, what's the point in being a mess and a burden to others?

I've always believed in the right to die the way you want and at the right time. As you say we put our pets out of their misery because it's humane, yet we let or even force humans to suffer.

 

[Commachio]

It's a folow on from the other thread, interesting...

Many are devastated by putting animals down,

That alone is like acting God, the right to live or die.

So are humans any different?

 

[Sweats]

I agree. But you could set a dangerous precedent allowing somebody to die to save the family having to pay for their care.

Think it depends on what’s wrong with them..

If they’ve had multiple strokes and sit there dribbling in a chair all day then whats the point..

I also think there should be new rules of what the council/government can take or force a sale. I’d say if you’re worth more than £1m then take it. But how many families whose parents paid off their mortgages on their 200k house and say had 50k in the bank when they became vegatative the council force the sale and spend their savings til they have 20k left. No human wants that to happen for their families. Yet the same rules apply to to people who can actually afford it. It’s totally not fair.

 

[Stan]

If a person is suffering or knows they are going to suffer and makes the decision when they are of sound mind then I think they should be able to choose.

 

[PINKIE]

Think it depends on what’s wrong with them..

If they’ve had multiple strokes and sit there dribbling in a chair all day then whats the point..

I also think there should be new rules of what the council/government can take or force a sale. I’d say if you’re worth more than £1m then take it. But how many families whose parents paid off their mortgages on their 200k house and say had 50k in the bank when they became vegatative the council force the sale and spend their savings til they have 20k left. No human wants that to happen for their families. Yet the same rules apply to to people who can actually afford it. It’s totally not fair.

The most legally that can happen at the moment is a Do not resuscitate order, which is usually taken by a doctor (or the patient prior to their illness) or somebody with power of attorney. And yep I agree, what's the point if somebody's quality of life is so poor that they have basically none.

As for paying for care. This is an issue that my family are going through at the moment with my Dad. He's going to end up in residential care at some point this year, he will have to pay a contribution towards that as he's been assessed as having a high income and assets. My parents aren't rich, they bought their council house in the 80's, sold it for a mint and then bought a nice house in sussex before they moved here. My Dad has a good company pension too, so they are well over the threshold.

I've got legal power of attorney over my dad (and mum) so I've split their ownership of their house into equal 50/50 share. Before that they owned 100% jointly, so they would have taken the full value of the house to pay for my dad's care. Now they can only take up to 50%, but yes it does feel like a kick in the teeth for somebody who has worked his whole life, paid his taxes and been a decent hard working man to suddenly have what he was going to leave to his kids, suddenly taken away from him to pay for his care.

 

[Sweats]

If a person is suffering or knows they are going to suffer and makes the decision when they are of sound mind then I think they should be able to choose.

So many people don’t have proper wills though.

If I was 85 and my standard of life revolves around a nurse getting me out of bed washing and dressing me then being hand fed what is the point.

These care homes cost about £500 a week to not really be looked after very well.

 

[PINKIE]

So many people don’t have proper wills though.

If I was 85 and my standard of life revolves around a nurse getting me out of bed washing and dressing me then being hand fed what is the point.

These care homes cost about £500 a week to not really be looked after very well.

It's more like £1000 per week mate.

 

[Commachio]

I did a similar thread maybe 5/6 years ago on the sunderland board @Tel @brb

where we focused on death, the right to die, and, suicide...

It was probably one of the most gripping reads ever.

Right to die, and suicide....It probably affects us all at one point in our life.

 

[Commachio]

So many people don’t have proper wills though.

If I was 85 and my standard of life revolves around a nurse getting me out of bed washing and dressing me then being hand fed what is the point.

These care homes cost about £500 a week to not really be looked after very well.

It's more like £1000 per week mate.

And there is the other problem, the cost of keeping them alive, and for what?

 

[PINKIE]

I did a similar thread maybe 5/6 years ago on the sunderland board @Tel @brb

where we focused on death, the right to die, and, suicide...

It was probably one of the most gripping reads ever.

Right to die, and suicide....It probably affects us all at one point in our life.

This whole issue with my old man has sharpened my focus on this issue. I'm writing a living will this year that will state I do no wish to be resuscitated and should the law on Euthanasia change, then I want to have the right to decide when I want to die, or if I am unable to communicate then for my wife/daughter to have power of attorney to make that decision.

Failing that I've told my missus already that if I end up like my dad, to take me out for a walk, push me off a cliff and make it look like an accident.

 

[Sweats]

The most legally that can happen at the moment is a Do not resuscitate order, which is usually taken by a doctor (or the patient prior to their illness) or somebody with power of attorney. And yep I agree, what's the point if somebody's quality of life is so poor that they have basically none.

As for paying for care. This is an issue that my family are going through at the moment with my Dad. He's going to end up in residential care at some point this year, he will have to pay a contribution towards that as he's been assessed as having a high income and assets. My parents aren't rich, they bought their council house in the 80's, sold it for a mint and then bought a nice house in sussex before they moved here. My Dad has a good company pension too, so they are well over the threshold.

I've got legal power of attorney over my dad (and mum) so I've split their ownership of their house into equal 50/50 share. Before that they owned 100% jointly, so they would have taken the full value of the house to pay for my dad's care. Now they can only take up to 50%, but yes it does feel like a kick in the teeth for somebody who has worked his whole life, paid his taxes and been a decent hard working man to suddenly have what he was going to leave to his kids, suddenly taken away from him to pay for his care.

I don’t think putting someone’s pension toward their care is bad. But taking their equity in their house and savings is wrong.

Inheritance tax is wrong too. The money has already paid its tax yet to transfer it to someone else they tax it again. This country truly looks after those with money already and takes it from people and families who have a modest amount.

 

[Commachio]

This whole issue with my old man has sharpened my focus on this issue. I'm writing a living will this year that will state I do no wish to be resuscitated and should the law on Euthanasia change, then I want to have the right to decide when I want to die, or if I am unable to communicate then for my wife/daughter to have power of attorney to make that decision.

Failing that I've told my missus already that if I end up like my dad, to take me out for a walk, push me off a cliff and make it look like an accident.

And at what point does suicide come into it, so you don't become a burden?

 

[PINKIE]

And there is the other problem, the cost of keeping them alive, and for what?

It all depends on what quality they have though, it can be a tough call to make. If somebody can't eat, drink, wash, feed themselves, are incontinent etc then most people would say they have no quality of life.

The other potential problem here is that you could set a precedent that a decision is made to end somebody's life because it the family can't afford it or they don't want to spend the money on care.

 

[Sweats]

I once got approached by a family whose dad had died and the mum had to go into care. They had a shot hole of a house that was ****ed.. the grandchild was quite severely disabled. The house was worth £140k in its condition and £200k done. The family asked me if I could sell it to someone trustworthy that would pay £90k officially then £30k in cash behind closed doors.

I’ve never felt so much pressure to do it. As I needed someone I totally trusted not to just say bollox and not hand over the cash..

As it stood I did have someone I trusted.. I got the deal done and the the £30k paid for an extension on their house to enable a disabled lad have an en-suite bedroom on the ground floor. If the government did what they could that family would have had **** all.

 

[PINKIE]

And at what point does suicide come into it, so you don't become a burden?

It all depends on what capacity you have. Lots of people might say 'If I ever get that bad, then I'm ending it myself', and it all depends on the means and whether you've got access to the means to do it. Especially if you are incapacitated and immobile near the end of your life when you'd want to end it.