The Toffee's up next....

[Nuggets]

I think the difference between winning and losing so far has been first touch. Opposition players invariably have a great first touch, it sets them away rapidly, it’s deadly in the box and it’s the difference between a defensive howler and a counter attack.

Even Hutchinson, one of our better footballers, takes the ball down a little bit sloppily and then has to do more work to be able to pass it. It gives the opposition every opportunity to win back possession.

Other than that and our problems at right back over the last two games, I don’t think we’ve got too much else wrong.

Agreed. Despite going eight games without a win, I think we have acquitted ourselves fairly well. We’ve picked up credible draws against both Brighton, Fulham, and Villa - all good teams and arguably deserved wins against the latter two.

The last two results and performances have been poor though. But we knew going in that this league is tough - and the step up to the Premier League is a mountain when you haven’t played in it for a number of years. The disruption to the back line haven’t helped - particularly with Tuanzebe missing. Hopefully Harry Clarke can step up, he looked bright coming on yesterday. Hopefully we can get Greaves back in the side too. I’d like to see other players given the opportunity ahead of Phillips, Burns, and Jack Clarke.

 

[Nuggets]

How much of the emphasis on the new signings is due to McKenna possibly trying to appease the owners? I mean, if they invested £100+ million on our summer signings, they would expect those signings to start/get prominent playing time to justify the money spent. Not saying I agree with it (as the results are showing that it isn't working out), but perhaps McK (or even Ashton) is feeling some pressure to give those new players every opportunity to show they are worth what we paid for them.

If McKenna had said “I feel the players we’ve got from last season are good enough for the Premier League”, the owners would be rubbing their hands and banking the money. It’s essentially what Luton and Sheffield United did last season and they both went straight back down. I definitely feel like one of the conditions of McKenna turning down the likes of Brighton was for us to open the chequebook and improve the squad. We’ve signed well - players we can feasibly make a profit on and ones who are young and were mostly key players for their old clubs (Greaves and Szmodics immediately spring to mind). I do think we completed some of our business too late, when it would’ve been better for the new players to have more of a pre-season.

Is there a pressure to start some of the more expensive signings? Possibly so, although I don’t believe our owners would get involved in decisions or influencing the manager. McKenna certainly doesn’t seem the type to stand for that.

I think our model is try and stay up, but if we do go down, we’ve got players capable of taking us back up, even if McKenna departs. Ristac (the Leeds fan) touched upon it earlier - the players we had last season achieved promotion through excellent coaching and a brilliant, never-say-never team spirit. Possibly only Davis was linked to a move away - which plays into the perception we’re an underdog team who overachieved. But it was a great team - probably the best promotion campaign we’ve ever played, when you take the context of all the teams in that league who benefitted from parachute payments.

McKenna’s got a real challenge on his hands. Does he change the formation and style of play as he fears the opposition know us too well? Everton pressed us high and forced us into making mistakes. Other teams will take note. Does he start bringing in more of last season’s players and trust in them to start getting points on the board? The likes of Harry Clarke, Woolfenden, Burgess, Taylor, and Chaplin look up for it. Or does it keep faith with the current system and make small tweaks. We haven’t got the win yet, but we have played some good football and picked up some impressive points. My starting eleven choice, with four at the back, would be:

Muric
H Clarke
O’Shea
Greaves
Davis
Morsy
Taylor
Hutchinson (on the right)
Chaplin
Szmodics
Delap

 

[Nuggets]

So, start with Chappers, Hutch, Broadie and Delap up top?

I’d swap out Broadhead for Szmodics. We’ve got last season’s Championship top scorer (in a struggling team) sitting on the bench. He needs minutes. I’d go for Hutchinson (on the right), Chaplin down middle, and Szmodics on the left.

 

[itfcptc]

I'm not sure who I'd play now as feel like we're quite a way in and none of the combinations up top have really worked so far. And others who used to be in our front line haven't played consistently in nearly 6 months. I'm not sure chucking Broadhead in after so many months without playing is a good thing.

To be fair we've had a few injuries in those positions anyway but just feel like we've broken up things which were working unnecessarily and what does it say to those players who've done nothing wrong. I feel particularly for the likes of Hladky, Burgess, Woolfenden, Chaplin and to a degree Walton and Luongo who have done nothing wrong yet find themselves out of a team being replaced by players who've made mistakes.

 

[YorkieLancsHampyLondoner]

Tell you what fellas… there are some absolute meltdowns on social media and other sites. We should have stayed down and had another season to build. That’s nonsense even if we get relegated, but it’s far too early in the season for that kind of talk. We’re in for a battle we know, but who ever thought we would just turn up and walk the division?

 

[Evesham]

Tell you what fellas… there are some absolute meltdowns on social media and other sites. We should have stayed down and had another season to build. That’s nonsense even if we get relegated, but it’s far too early in the season for that kind of talk. We’re in for a battle we know, but who ever thought we would just turn up and walk the division?

You should see the melt down on the Saints match day thread.

 

[Nuggets]

Tell you what fellas… there are some absolute meltdowns on social media and other sites. We should have stayed down and had another season to build. That’s nonsense even if we get relegated, but it’s far too early in the season for that kind of talk. We’re in for a battle we know, but who ever thought we would just turn up and walk the division?

I don’t get supporters who think like that. No guarantee we were going to get promoted this season had we lost in the play offs. Last season was a magnificent achievement with some great memories. After 22 years, we are at the top table playing some of the best sides in the world. This club and our manager want to be ambitious - damn right they should be.

Yes, this season is likely going to be a slog. We will lose more than we’ll win - that’s just the nature of the beast when you’re competing with state run clubs and a massive financial divide. But it’s a challenge we’re meeting head on and I think the club are doing things the right way. We’ve also managed to invest in Portman Road and bring it up to a better standard than the previous owner.

Relegation wouldn’t be the end of the world. Unlike last time we got relegated from the Prem, we’ll benefit from parachute payments and we’ve got a wiser ownership that won’t gamble on the club’s future. My main concern would be losing McKenna - who might lose a bit of shine if we’re relegated in a bad fashion. He’s not turned into a bad manager overnight. Hopefully he’s got an idea of what his best starting eleven is because we’re going to need a settled side. Having stressed the importance of a settled side, I think we definitely need to play Harry Clarke at right back - hopefully he’s fit enough for a full 90. I think O’Shea and Greaves are more solid at the back - if Calvert-Lewin was a better finisher, he’d have had a hat trick yesterday (Muric made some good saves to be fair, but his distribution is a bit suspect). Phillips and Jack Clarke could do with dropping and let’s give Taylor and either Szmodics or Chaplin a start.

 

[Mike_Holmes1990]

Lots of good discussion here.

I think whatever 11 we field we would encounter big problems. The squad has definitely been negatively affected by broadly being assembled after the first match of the season, but the recruitment was necessary and injuries to last season's squad have accelerated having to start the newbies. I'm not surprised fans on social media are having a meltdown, not all fans are as good as recalibrating expectations. The bottom of the table isn't as punishing of defeats as trying to stay at the top. I remain surprised we're not actually in the bottom 3, pending what Palace do tomorrow. I remain hopeful that if we're within a touching distance of safety going into January then we'll be well placed to survive.

 

[Nuggets]

Lots of good discussion here.

I think whatever 11 we field we would encounter big problems. The squad has definitely been negatively affected by broadly being assembled after the first match of the season, but the recruitment was necessary and injuries to last season's squad have accelerated having to start the newbies. I'm not surprised fans on social media are having a meltdown, not all fans are as good as recalibrating expectations. The bottom of the table isn't as punishing of defeats as trying to stay at the top. I remain surprised we're not actually in the bottom 3, pending what Palace do tomorrow. I remain hopeful that if we're within a touching distance of safety going into January then we'll be well placed to survive.

I don’t think Palace will be down there for too long. Selling Olise and Anderson in one window might’ve been too much without bringing in reinforcements, but they’ll definitely spend in January if they must.

Is it too early to write Southampton off? A new manager there might give them a bump. Wolves unlucky to lose today, but they have been poor defensively so far.

Hopefully we can stem the losses with an away point at Brentford and beat Leicester at home. If we don’t get a win soon, I’d start to get concerned whether we can keep pace from 18th.

 

[YorkieLancsHampyLondoner]

Just seen the highlights. Jack Clarke just can’t do the defensive side yet. Gets done and then done again for the second goal.

 

[Nuggets]

Just seen the highlights. Jack Clarke just can’t do the defensive side yet. Gets done and then done again for the second goal.

I don't think he combines well with Leif Davis - who is an attacking player himself. Clarke was partly at fault for the second goal, but I thought both Morsy and Phillips must do a lot better stopping that pass on the edge of the box. Both went in far too slow and got completely bypassed.

For me, the worst thing Clarke did on Saturday was that early miss from 10 odd yards from the Burns cross. We have to take those type of chances at this level. The fact he couldn't even hit the target was the most glaring. Sunderland fans had been bigging him up, and no doubt he did well for them in the Championship, but he's not doing enough to stay in the starting eleven for me.

I've also just seen the news that Greaves is sidelined for a few weeks (late to that story I think). That's a big blow for us. With that in mind, I'd give Woolfenden and Burgess another start together for the Brentford match, as we'll benefit from their partnership. However, they need to do a lot better than what they put out in that Everton first half.

 

[Southcoastoldgaffer]

One of the things that fascinates me is that we know MacKenna is a bright talented young manager, and of course has seen everything on the pitch that we have, albeit closer than my view from Amsterdam.

He is intelligent and knows that those partnerships, style of play, patterns and goals havent yet worked. He has seen the fall away of our passion, energy, die for the club spirit that propelled us from L1 to the Prem. He must know that several new players havent performed as well as expected.

Its a difficult balancing act, also knowing that many didnt have a long pre-season to settle.

But we must trust in him, many of us would like to see more of our Top Team start. Injuries will mean many will this Saturday.

Just give us a win soon, and the mood will change.

 

[YorkieLancsHampyLondoner]

One of the things that fascinates me is that we know MacKenna is a bright talented young manager, and of course has seen everything on the pitch that we have, albeit closer than my view from Amsterdam.

He is intelligent and knows that those partnerships, style of play, patterns and goals havent yet worked. He has seen the fall away of our passion, energy, die for the club spirit that propelled us from L1 to the Prem. He must know that several new players havent performed as well as expected.

Its a difficult balancing act, also knowing that many didnt have a long pre-season to settle.

But we must trust in him, many of us would like to see more of our Top Team start. Injuries will mean many will this Saturday.

Just give us a win soon, and the mood will change.

Hutchinson didn’t come in as a starter at the last season and it eventually served him and us well. I don’t understand why certain players get all that game time when they are not delivering the goods, yet Cajuste and Ogbene are barely being given any minutes.

 

[YorkieLancsHampyLondoner]

I do have faith in McKenna - even if we get relegated there’s nobody I’d rather have in that dugout this season. And it’s a good job - because with his £20m contract we can’t afford to sack him.

 

[Roystonblue]

1 other thing I noticed on Saturday that was a bit worrying was players arguing with each other. Noticed this most with Burgess and Leif - not sure if it was because Burgess wasn’t playing the ball quickly enough or Leif not doing his defensive duties but it was noticeable. Hopefully, it’s just the pressure of trying to get that elusive 1st win but something to keep an eye on moving forward

 

[YorkieLancsHampyLondoner]

1 other thing I noticed on Saturday that was a bit worrying was players arguing with each other. Noticed this most with Burgess and Leif - not sure if it was because Burgess wasn’t playing the ball quickly enough or Leif not doing his defensive duties but it was noticeable. Hopefully, it’s just the pressure of trying to get that elusive 1st win but something to keep an eye on moving forward

I noticed it too and I'm not concerned by this. These players are more comfortable with each other - the new ones don't know each other well enough to give back yet. We want to be worried when we defend like that and they are not vocal about it.

 

[San Diego]

1 other thing I noticed on Saturday that was a bit worrying was players arguing with each other. Noticed this most with Burgess and Leif - not sure if it was because Burgess wasn’t playing the ball quickly enough or Leif not doing his defensive duties but it was noticeable. Hopefully, it’s just the pressure of trying to get that elusive 1st win but something to keep an eye on moving forward

I thought it came from Leif's side mostly, complaining about the quality of the passes out to him after he took up great positions in space a couple of times but Burgess didn't get the pass right.

 

[San Diego]

Just seen the highlights. Jack Clarke just can’t do the defensive side yet.

He shouldn't need to, that's what the double pivot is for, covering the full back positions so you can keep your FBs and wide players higher up the pitch. That's how the high press works and obviously it's better to have your defensive midfielders doing the defending, not a winger.
If one full back is pushing on, the other stays home, creating a lopsided back three with two in front. At any time, one of those two should be able to cover a full back while having one stay central. If we start asking the wide front players to track back as well, we're leaving no option for out balls and will come under sustained pressure as it allows the other team to throw more bodies forward without fear of counter attack.

 

[Nuggets]

1 other thing I noticed on Saturday that was a bit worrying was players arguing with each other. Noticed this most with Burgess and Leif - not sure if it was because Burgess wasn’t playing the ball quickly enough or Leif not doing his defensive duties but it was noticeable. Hopefully, it’s just the pressure of trying to get that elusive 1st win but something to keep an eye on moving forward

A good observation. I remember the Villa game after we conceded to go 2-1 down and the players' heads all dropped. It was Tuanzebe going around lifting players up and giving a positive pep talk. I do expect a bit more from Morsy (as the captain) and Phillips (as the most experienced Premier League player on the pitch) in those situations to be more positive and try to bring back that 'never say never' attitude from last year.

I guess the main impediment to that mindset is the superior class in opposition. This team have played fairly well in several games, but a lapse in concentration gets punished so brutally in the Premier League. Don't get me wrong, there were lapses last season that did get punished - we conceded loads of goals - but sometimes we'd away with individual errors and we had the confidence to break down the opposing defences. Teams are set up so much better in this division.

A couple of really noticeable things that strike me watching Premier League opposition at Portman Road is that generally a) players have a great first touch and b) they're all a lot effing quicker! For many of our players, it's their first experience playing Premier League football. It must be quite eye-opening!

 

[YorkieLancsHampyLondoner]

He shouldn't need to, that's what the double pivot is for, covering the full back positions so you can keep your FBs and wide players higher up the pitch. That's how the high press works and obviously it's better to have your defensive midfielders doing the defending, not a winger.
If one full back is pushing on, the other stays home, creating a lopsided back three with two in front. At any time, one of those two should be able to cover a full back while having one stay central. If we start asking the wide front players to track back as well, we're leaving no option for out balls and will come under sustained pressure as it allows the other team to throw more bodies forward without fear of counter attack.

Don’t agree at all. This season even more than last season we will have spells with pressure coming into us or rapid counter attacks where the wingers have to track back. Our success so far has been built on intensity. We kept sides like Blackburn at bay last season penned into our own half for large periods because everybody worked with the same intensity.