The QPR Tactics Discussion Thread

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rangercol said:
It was on the assumption that Sanderson isn't ours and to give balance with Barbet's left foot.
Sanderson is the better player imo.
Click to expand...
From what I've seen so far of him I'm not overly impressed at all, looks nothing special to me. Makes far too many rash tackles and gets caught out of position alot. I won't mention his temper as that might have been a one off aberration but he doesn't look the brightest to me.
 
So are we in agreement that playing wing backs dies but play to our strengths
 
My favourite formation is 4-3-3/4-2-3-1.
However, I also like a wing back formation, but not in 3-4-3, as that only gives you two in midfield.
Therefore I'd prefer 3-5-2.
Having said all that, I acknowledge that our two tens system worked well, although I'm not sure we can afford the luxury of two tens and I reckon Warbs may have come to that conclusion too.
I don't think he should change the system too fundamentally with so few games remaining.
 
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Hammersmith reborn said:
From what I've seen so far of him I'm not overly impressed at all, looks nothing special to me. Makes far too many rash tackles and gets caught out of position alot. I won't mention his temper as that might have been a one off aberration but he doesn't look the brightest to me.
Click to expand...

I think Sanderson looks a great prospect but needs too improve his decision making, concentration and possibly his temper. No doubt why Wolves loan him out to develop him as we do at at lower levels. I certainly would like to keep him if that should be possible because so far he does look a great prospect and he has that extra pace we lack in our back 3, except to a probably slighly less degree with Barbet.
 
Now that the dust has settled, I just wanted to write a few words about where I think we're at.

There has been quite a bit of criticism of players, not just on here but around the ground and elswhere online. Personally, it's hard to say if the players are applying themselves 100%, but I feel we've seen some really detirmined performances from all players this season. But players will start to look despondent if there is lack of leadership, or if leadership is proving inadequate.

The truth is, we have a very good squad, a squad that on paper belongs in the top half for sure. Granted, we've been hindered by injuries. But that's football.

Personally, I think Warburton and those immediately around have to be the ones to take responsibility. Warburton ultimately has the greatest responsibility.

I think we were eventually found out by pretty much everyone in the league. We seem to have one way of playing, and that's all. Quite frankly, we are way too slow in building up. We don't catch any teams off guard. We make teams feel comfortable and then they grow in confidence. We make it really hard for ourselves to score by allowing every team the benefit of getting back into shape by the time we try anything; we pass it around relatively slowly and have some kind of purist approach where we refuse to score in any way aside from through outpassing teams in their third of the pitch.

Although this has been an enjoyable season ultimately, there have been a lot of really frustrating moments. We seem to have a characteristics in our play which can only be seen as methods directly being given by the management team. For example, we seem to have an actual policy on getting a goal and then trying to defend that one goal lead. This very often comes back to bite us.

Another policy we seem to have is being overly careful with the ball. If there is no clear pass sideways or foreward, we pass backwards. When in our own half, this is understandable. But we do the same in the opposition half too. We don't put enough passes through to players feet or up and over. We don't take chances on through balls. In fact, we don't seem to take many chances at all! We only seem to 'go for it' when we have a clear opportunity.

Also, individual players don't seem to be being coached well. Certain bad habits are not being coached out of players and they just repeat them. Example: even though they're not the most physical, Chair and Willock do not go in for challenges. They won't try to win the ball in the air. It allows opposition defenders and midfielders so many free headers.

We don't play with guile. We don't play as if we want to dominate and lead on the pitch. We don't stamp our way of playing on matches. We seem to try and play to our opponents style/gameplan, almost like we're always responding to our opponents. And when we come up against a team who can play out their gameplan well, we get totally found out.

A great example of this was Millwall at home. That's how I want us to play. They played with a lot of purpose, went for us, put balls through and over from all sorts of angles, early crosses, tried to win every single ball. They gave our defence constant trouble and made us sweat. This is what I want to see us do: make defenses sweat and work. Even if it only works out 2 out of 5 times, just keep pushing defences, make them make mistakes, keep them away from our goal by making them defend theirs.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that Warburton has gotten us to play a very pessimistic kind of football at times. Which, for large parts of the season, has ironically been combined with players who optimistically don't give up and will snatch points away from others. But, like I said, we seem to have been well and truly found out by the other teams in this league.

For the record, I wouldn't dump Warburton this moment and I am very grateful for the real turnaround he has made. He clearly got the team really galvanised. But I don't think he has much tactical nuance and doesn't seem to be able to outsmart many other managers. Which is why I think we do need to find a new manager if we want to progress and get anywhere further. However, we should only let him go if we have found a genuine improvement. If we manage to finish strong this season, we should be able to convince a good manager to take a chance on a good squad (if we can keep our best players).

QPR Oslo said:
I think Sanderson looks a great prospect but needs too improve his decision making, concentration and possibly his temper. No doubt why Wolves loan him out to develop him as we do at at lower levels. I certainly would like to keep him if that should be possible because so far he does look a great prospect and he has that extra pace we lack in our back 3, except to a probably slighly less degree with Barbet.
Click to expand...
To me, he looks like a natural footballer. He controls the ball well and can turn well. With time, he could fit in to a very good looking back line.
 
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awjm said:
To me, he looks like a natural footballer. He controls the ball well and can turn well. With time, he could fit in to a very good looking back line.
Click to expand...

Sanderson's not our player, is he? Unless we have a purchase clause in the loan agreement, I'd assume he'll be going back to Wolves? If Sundays performance was anything to go by they're welcome to him...
 
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awjm said:
Now that the dust has settled, I just wanted to write a few words about where I think we're at.

There has been quite a bit of criticism of players, not just on here but around the ground and elswhere online. Personally, it's hard to say if the players are applying themselves 100%, but I feel we've seen some really detirmined performances from all players this season. But players will start to look despondent if there is lack of leadership, or if leadership is proving inadequate.

The truth is, we have a very good squad, a squad that on paper belongs in the top half for sure. Granted, we've been hindered by injuries. But that's football.

Personally, I think Warburton and those immediately around have to be the ones to take responsibility. Warburton ultimately has the greatest responsibility.

I think we were eventually found out by pretty much everyone in the league. We seem to have one way of playing, and that's all. Quite frankly, we are way too slow in building up. We don't catch any teams off guard. We make teams feel comfortable and then they grow in confidence. We make it really hard for ourselves to score by allowing every team the benefit of getting back into shape by the time we try anything; we pass it around relatively slowly and have some kind of purist approach where we refuse to score in any way aside from through outpassing teams in their third of the pitch.

Although this has been an enjoyable season ultimately, there have been a lot of really frustrating moments. We seem to have a characteristics in our play which can only be seen as methods directly being given by the management team. For example, we seem to have an actual policy on getting a goal and then trying to defend that one goal lead. This very often comes back to bite us.

Another policy we seem to have is being overly careful with the ball. If there is no clear pass sideways or foreward, we pass backwards. When in our own half, this is understandable. But we do the same in the opposition half too. We don't put enough passes through to players feet or up and over. We don't take chances on through balls. In fact, we don't seem to take many chances at all! We only seem to 'go for it' when we have a clear opportunity.

Also, individual players don't seem to be being coached well. Certain bad habits are not being coached out of players and they just repeat them. Example: even though they're not the most physical, Chair and Willock do not go in for challenges. They won't try to win the ball in the air. It allows opposition defenders and midfielders so many free headers.

We don't play with guile. We don't play as if we want to dominate and lead on the pitch. We don't stamp our way of playing on matches. We seem to try and play to our opponents style/gameplan, almost like we're always responding to our opponents. And when we come up against a team who can play out their gameplan well, we get totally found out.

A great example of this was Millwall at home. That's how I want us to play. They played with a lot of purpose, went for us, put balls through and over from all sorts of angles, early crosses, tried to win every single ball. They gave our defence constant trouble and made us sweat. This is what I want to see us do: make defenses sweat and work. Even if it only works out 2 out of 5 times, just keep pushing defences, make them make mistakes, keep them away from our goal by making them defend theirs.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that Warburton has gotten us to play a very pessimistic kind of football at times. Which, for large parts of the season, has ironically been combined with players who optimistically don't give up and will snatch points away from others. But, like I said, we seem to have been well and truly found out by the other teams in this league.

For the record, I wouldn't dump Warburton this moment and I am very grateful for the real turnaround he has made. He clearly got the team really galvanised. But I don't think he has much tactical nuance and doesn't seem to be able to outsmart many other managers. Which is why I think we do need to find a new manager if we want to progress and get anywhere further. However, we should only let him go if we have found a genuine improvement. If we manage to finish strong this season, we should be able to convince a good manager to take a chance on a good squad (if we can keep our best players).


To me, he looks like a natural footballer. He controls the ball well and can turn well. With time, he could fit in to a very good looking back line.
Click to expand...

Don't have time to respond fully to this great post, but agree with much of it, especially that it's not time for Warburton to go. Disappointed as we feel now, he's still doing a good job of building a platform for future success imo. The proof of the pudding will ironically be if some of Willock/Chair/Dunne/Dieng move on for good money in the summer and are replaced by equally good prospects we then develop further.

On who will replace him - I have a gut feeling John Eustace rejected the Swansea job as he has been promised a go when Warbs leaves. He seems to have a strong reputation in the game already so I'm not opposed to that idea. He would have a mandate to continue the good work Warbs has started and to improve some of the weaker aspects you articulately detail.
 
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awjm said:
Now that the dust has settled, I just wanted to write a few words about where I think we're at.

There has been quite a bit of criticism of players, not just on here but around the ground and elswhere online. Personally, it's hard to say if the players are applying themselves 100%, but I feel we've seen some really detirmined performances from all players this season. But players will start to look despondent if there is lack of leadership, or if leadership is proving inadequate.

The truth is, we have a very good squad, a squad that on paper belongs in the top half for sure. Granted, we've been hindered by injuries. But that's football.

Personally, I think Warburton and those immediately around have to be the ones to take responsibility. Warburton ultimately has the greatest responsibility.

I think we were eventually found out by pretty much everyone in the league. We seem to have one way of playing, and that's all. Quite frankly, we are way too slow in building up. We don't catch any teams off guard. We make teams feel comfortable and then they grow in confidence. We make it really hard for ourselves to score by allowing every team the benefit of getting back into shape by the time we try anything; we pass it around relatively slowly and have some kind of purist approach where we refuse to score in any way aside from through outpassing teams in their third of the pitch.

Although this has been an enjoyable season ultimately, there have been a lot of really frustrating moments. We seem to have a characteristics in our play which can only be seen as methods directly being given by the management team. For example, we seem to have an actual policy on getting a goal and then trying to defend that one goal lead. This very often comes back to bite us.

Another policy we seem to have is being overly careful with the ball. If there is no clear pass sideways or foreward, we pass backwards. When in our own half, this is understandable. But we do the same in the opposition half too. We don't put enough passes through to players feet or up and over. We don't take chances on through balls. In fact, we don't seem to take many chances at all! We only seem to 'go for it' when we have a clear opportunity.

Also, individual players don't seem to be being coached well. Certain bad habits are not being coached out of players and they just repeat them. Example: even though they're not the most physical, Chair and Willock do not go in for challenges. They won't try to win the ball in the air. It allows opposition defenders and midfielders so many free headers.

We don't play with guile. We don't play as if we want to dominate and lead on the pitch. We don't stamp our way of playing on matches. We seem to try and play to our opponents style/gameplan, almost like we're always responding to our opponents. And when we come up against a team who can play out their gameplan well, we get totally found out.

A great example of this was Millwall at home. That's how I want us to play. They played with a lot of purpose, went for us, put balls through and over from all sorts of angles, early crosses, tried to win every single ball. They gave our defence constant trouble and made us sweat. This is what I want to see us do: make defenses sweat and work. Even if it only works out 2 out of 5 times, just keep pushing defences, make them make mistakes, keep them away from our goal by making them defend theirs.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that Warburton has gotten us to play a very pessimistic kind of football at times. Which, for large parts of the season, has ironically been combined with players who optimistically don't give up and will snatch points away from others. But, like I said, we seem to have been well and truly found out by the other teams in this league.

For the record, I wouldn't dump Warburton this moment and I am very grateful for the real turnaround he has made. He clearly got the team really galvanised. But I don't think he has much tactical nuance and doesn't seem to be able to outsmart many other managers. Which is why I think we do need to find a new manager if we want to progress and get anywhere further. However, we should only let him go if we have found a genuine improvement. If we manage to finish strong this season, we should be able to convince a good manager to take a chance on a good squad (if we can keep our best players).


To me, he looks like a natural footballer. He controls the ball well and can turn well. With time, he could fit in to a very good looking back line.
Click to expand...
Good post.
Its been one of my biggest gripes, allowing the opposition time to get back in shape. Away at Barnsley was a prime example. Pointless slow passing between the back 3 and the keeper. They didnt fall for it and just allowed us to do it, knowing we werent going anywhere. There has to be a better passing intensity but to do that, the movement further forward has to be key. Austin and Dykes will never have the legs or pace for a through ball. Gray does but is often quite limited in his approach. If you get Chair and Willock constantly dropping deeper to get a touch of the ball then our options become less. Its all coaching and the buck stops with the gaffer.
 
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What do you all think we need to do to try and either outsmart Fulham or, at the least, try to cope with them?
 
awjm said:
What do you all think we need to do to try and either outsmart Fulham or, at the least, try to cope with them?
Click to expand...

Not sure it will make much difference tbh.
They are a class above everyone in this division and if they're on it, I rather think we're ****ed.
 
awjm said:
What do you all think we need to do to try and either outsmart Fulham or, at the least, try to cope with them?
Click to expand...

Press them with high energy if we can. Use Albert to get at them down their left where some Fulham don't reckon Robinson as a LB and get balls in for our strikers, 2 I hope.
 
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QPR Oslo said:
Press them with high energy if we can. Use Albert to get at them down their left where some Fulham don't reckon Robinson as a LB and get balls in for our strikers, 2 I hope.
Click to expand...
Edit. No Albert to be seen do Moses needs to have a very good game. Only 1 striker Dykes starting too.
 
What I've noticed about the tactics this season so far:
  • Gone is Warburton's high press.
  • Very clear system of containment out to the flanks.
We don't have a system of chasing down the keeper or defenders at all in any game I've seen.

As we allow the opposition to pass outwards, we drift across very slowly, getting the opposition to think they have a lot of space and good progress down 1 of the wings (which is true by this point).

Then, we seem to start compressing and one of the midfield comes across to pinch things together and either send the opposition backwards, or try to take the ball.

I've got no issue with Beale having a specific system like that. However, it seems a bit crazy to do this when we have the likes of Kakay, Hameleinen and Paal (who hasn't impressed me yet).

I wonder if Beale is trying to make it very apparent that he needs a couple of full back signings, one each side.

Attack wise, it's hard to say what the plan really is! Whatever it is, it is not being executed all that well today (Charlton - Cup). However, we are favouring the wings, and one of the central midfield seems to push up and provide an inward short pass.

When in possession on the wing today, we seem to favour inward ground passes before the box rather than crosses in.

The one striker seems to have one main job: drop, have the ball at feet, pass. We don't seem to be taking any chances by putting any looped through balls over. Striker is putting his hand up, calling for the ball. This is not being heeded much.
 
awjm said:
What I've noticed about the tactics this season so far:
  • Gone is Warburton's high press.
  • Very clear system of containment out to the flanks.
We don't have a system of chasing down the keeper or defenders at all in any game I've seen.

As we allow the opposition to pass outwards, we drift across very slowly, getting the opposition to think they have a lot of space and good progress down 1 of the wings (which is true by this point).

Then, we seem to start compressing and one of the midfield comes across to pinch things together and either send the opposition backwards, or try to take the ball.

I've got no issue with Beale having a specific system like that. However, it seems a bit crazy to do this when we have the likes of Kakay, Hameleinen and Paal (who hasn't impressed me yet).

I wonder if Beale is trying to make it very apparent that he needs a couple of full back signings, one each side.

Attack wise, it's hard to say what the plan really is! Whatever it is, it is not being executed all that well today (Charlton - Cup). However, we are favouring the wings, and one of the central midfield seems to push up and provide an inward short pass.

When in possession on the wing today, we seem to favour inward ground passes before the box rather than crosses in.

The one striker seems to have one main job: drop, have the ball at feet, pass. We don't seem to be taking any chances by putting any looped through balls over. Striker is putting his hand up, calling for the ball. This is not being heeded much.
Click to expand...
Anyone want to discuss tactics? :emoticon-0138-think Has anyone noticed patterns in Beale's methods yet?
 
awjm said:
What I've noticed about the tactics this season so far:
  • Gone is Warburton's high press.
  • Very clear system of containment out to the flanks.
We don't have a system of chasing down the keeper or defenders at all in any game I've seen.

As we allow the opposition to pass outwards, we drift across very slowly, getting the opposition to think they have a lot of space and good progress down 1 of the wings (which is true by this point).

Then, we seem to start compressing and one of the midfield comes across to pinch things together and either send the opposition backwards, or try to take the ball.

I've got no issue with Beale having a specific system like that. However, it seems a bit crazy to do this when we have the likes of Kakay, Hameleinen and Paal (who hasn't impressed me yet).

I wonder if Beale is trying to make it very apparent that he needs a couple of full back signings, one each side.

Attack wise, it's hard to say what the plan really is! Whatever it is, it is not being executed all that well today (Charlton - Cup). However, we are favouring the wings, and one of the central midfield seems to push up and provide an inward short pass.

When in possession on the wing today, we seem to favour inward ground passes before the box rather than crosses in.

The one striker seems to have one main job: drop, have the ball at feet, pass. We don't seem to be taking any chances by putting any looped through balls over. Striker is putting his hand up, calling for the ball. This is not being heeded much.
Click to expand...
The front 3 that came on at Charlton high pressed. Armstrong with his acceleration and size did it very well. He looks like he's made for the task and enjoys it.
 
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