Off Topic The Politics Thread

[Staines R's]

Again, that's not how I read it. I took it to mean giving agency workers rights to holiday and sick pay.

With respect mate, that wasn’t what I asked.
Am I being cynical to think that the EU, in my opinion, being hand in hand with big business, would want to make it slightly more attractive in the short term to get people onto short term “agency” contracts, therefore being in danger of being exploited as cheaper labour later on, as they would surely have less protections ?

 

[Stroller]

More from Wiki


The Rosella or International Transport Workers Federation v Viking Line ABP (2007) C-438/05 is an EU law case, relevant to all labour law within the European Union, including UK labour law, which held that there is a positive right to strike. However, it also held that the right to strike could infringe a business's freedom of establishment under the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union article 49 (ex Article 43 TEC). The decision has been criticised for the Court's inarticulate line of reasoning, and its disregard of fundamental human rights

Im guessing things can be interpreted in different ways, however in my eye, if many on the left are saying that judgements such as this are giving employers then chance of bringing in cheaper labour, thus being detrimental to said employers current workers, it’s plain wrong and morally corrupt.

Again, it seems to me to be a flawed judgment in one case.

Anyway my argument is not that the EU is a better protector of workers' rights than Unions, it's that it's better for workers to have EU protection against a Thatcherite Tory government than not.

 

[Staines R's]

Again, it seems to me to be a flawed judgment in one case.

Anyway my argument is not that the EU is a better protector of workers' rights than Unions, it's that it's better for workers to have EU protection against a Thatcherite Tory government than not.

Again I would respectfully disagree……the fact that we have now got rid of an anti-worker, pro big business organisation…can only mean that it’s gives more strength to the fight against the Tory Government.
In fact it’s one that’s already being fought on the picket lines today.
The tide is turning……

 

[Stroller]

With respect mate, that wasn’t what I asked.
Am I being cynical to think that the EU, in my opinion, being hand in hand with big business, would want to make it slightly more attractive in the short term to get people onto short term “agency” contracts, therefore being in danger of being exploited as cheaper labour later on, as they would surely have less protections ?

I know it wasn't what you asked, but I just don't see the statement about protections for agency workers the same way you do.

As I suggested in my last answer, I see the EU as being less hand-in-hand with big business than the Tories. That's all.

Here's some EU propaganda on stuff they've introduced...

How the EU improves workers’ rights and working conditions | News | European Parliament (europa.eu)

We wouldn't have got any of that from a Tory government outside the EU.

 

[kiwiqpr]

So no one worked more than the maximum 48 hours per week
Fantastic
What were nurses complaining about

 

[Staines R's]

I know it wasn't what you asked, but I just don't see the statement about protections for agency workers the same way you do.

As I suggested in my last answer, I see the EU as being less hand-in-hand with big business than the Tories. That's all.

Here's some EU propaganda on stuff they've introduced...

How the EU improves workers’ rights and working conditions | News | European Parliament (europa.eu)

We wouldn't have any of that from a Tory government outside the EU.

We are just gonna have to disagree I guess…..I see the EU as being just as much in the pocket of big business as the Tories are……and in some ways more so.

Anyway bed for me now…..one last shift to go and hoping not to have me or my crewmate assaulted, like we were today. It’s great to put laws in place that someone can be imprisoned for assaulting an ER worker….but totally meaningless and unworkable in practice.

Nice to have a sensible conversation, however much we might disagree.

 

[Staines R's]

Half way through todays shift and after attending yet another drunk, on the floor and unable to look after themselves…..I’m kinda wondering if I might have found part of the reason there are no ambulance.
And so another 2 hour wait at hospital beckons…..

 

[Wherever]

Half way through todays shift and after attending yet another drunk, on the floor and unable to look after themselves…..I’m kinda wondering if I might have found part of the reason there are no ambulance.
And so another 2 hour wait at hospital beckons…..

Go easy on him, it may be kiwi

 

[Staines R's]

Go easy on him, it may be kiwi

It’s an easy job…can’t complain. Better than yesterdays joy who decided to try and strangle my crew mate…..Some strong words were exchanged

 

[Stroller]

Half way through todays shift and after attending yet another drunk, on the floor and unable to look after themselves…..I’m kinda wondering if I might have found part of the reason there are no ambulance.
And so another 2 hour wait at hospital beckons…..

I thought it was now 45 minutes max then chuck them out?

 

[Staines R's]

I thought it was now 45 minutes max then chuck them out?

Well that’s the thing……..if your patient is on a trolly bed and there is no hospital bed to transfer them to…then the said guidance is quite unworkable. If pts can walk and aren’t “big sick” they would go in the waiting room anyway for triage. And of course if they don’t need to go to hospital..I really don’t take them

 

[Sooperhoop]

So no one worked more than the maximum 48 hours per week
Fantastic
What were nurses complaining about

Up to my 'retirement' working in Local Government in 2012, services would have totally collapsed if the 48 hour maximum was enforced. Sub-contracting and 'flexible contracts' bypassed much of that...

 

[YorkshireHoopster]

That Sunak is a clever s@d.

Just realised he said nothing about sorting out the current NHS crisis, which is dependent on increasing social care to get people out of hospital, staffing, which depends on training, and pay and conditions or having more a and e facilities which depends on building and developing new facilities. He is going to cut waiting times for procedures.

There will be lot more putting surgery and certain treatments out to private firms...depleting the finances of the NHS further.

He has just promised to further privatise the NHS, and we are suppose to be happy

Well he has learned from the best and has worked out that the way to a true Tory's heart is to promise everything to everyone. I won't waste my time holding my breath and closing my eyes in the hope any of it will come true. There'll always be a ready -made (almost said oven ready) excuse why he fails to deliver on any of those promises.

 

[sb_73]

That Sunak is a clever s@d.

Just realised he said nothing about sorting out the current NHS crisis, which is dependent on increasing social care to get people out of hospital, staffing, which depends on training, and pay and conditions or having more a and e facilities which depends on building and developing new facilities. He is going to cut waiting times for procedures.

There will be lot more putting surgery and certain treatments out to private firms...depleting the finances of the NHS further.

He has just promised to further privatise the NHS, and we are suppose to be happy

Having listened to Starmer his promises around the NHS are identical, including using private firms, all about massive investment in training which will take years to work through the system and is pointless unless terms and conditions for NHS staff provide decent living standards and careers. Personally I don’t blame doctors and nurses who seize control of their own lives by opting for agency work or locum posts where they earn more and can decide when and where they want to work in the slightest.

All wrapped up in a promise not to spend more than the Tories overall.

Still, can’t expect anything more. I have to remind myself that Labour stopped even pretending to be a socialist party back in 1995. Why don’t the fringe MPs and members who say they have socialist principles join a party which is more explicitly in line with what they say they believe? Good example is Great British Energy, which is not a nationalisation of energy resources in the U.K., it’s simply a new, govt funded (if Labour gets in) ie taxpayer funded player in the energy market, which will also form partnerships with private sector firms - doubtless on the projects which are high risk and which the private sector wouldn’t touch without a safety net. In other words Starmer is proposing a way to insure the private sector against risk. Neat.

 

[Stroller]

Having listened to Starmer his promises around the NHS are identical, including using private firms, all about massive investment in training which will take years to work through the system and is pointless unless terms and conditions for NHS staff provide decent living standards and careers. Personally I don’t blame doctors and nurses who seize control of their own lives by opting for agency work or locum posts where they earn more and can decide when and where they want to work in the slightest.

All wrapped up in a promise not to spend more than the Tories overall.

Still, can’t expect anything more. I have to remind myself that Labour stopped even pretending to be a socialist party back in 1995. Why don’t the fringe MPs and members who say they have socialist principles don’t join a party which is more explicitly in line with what they say they believe? Good example is Great British Energy, which is not a nationalisation of energy resources in the U.K., it’s simply a new, govt funded (if Labour gets in) ie taxpayer funded player in the energy market, which will also form partnerships with private sector firms - doubtless on the projects which are high risk and which the private sector wouldn’t touch without a safety net. In other words Starmer is proposing a way to insure the private sector against risk. Neat.

Labour under Corbyn came pretty close to having a Socialist agenda.

 

[Staines R's]

The Tories are now proposing to propsing to


Labour under Corbyn came pretty close to having a Socialist agenda.

Sadly he was stabbed in the back by the same people that the centre-left now call leader.

 

[sb_73]

Labour under Corbyn came pretty close to having a Socialist agenda.

Clause 4, the Blair version, was and is still in place. Corbyn was a rebel against his own party constitution. Bizarre stuff. He lost two elections, albeit with one surprisingly good performance, coupled with one total destruction, he was clearly never a credible leader with the electorate and certainly had the majority of his own MPs against him - they won’t make the mistake of nominating someone of his ilk ‘for balance’ again. Not really important any more, Labour is definitely New Labour again.

 

[Staines R's]

Clause 4, the Blair version, was and is still in place. Corbyn was a rebel against his own party constitution. Bizarre stuff. He lost two elections, albeit with one surprisingly good performance, coupled with one total destruction, he was clearly never a credible leader with the electorate and certainly had the majority of his own MPs against him - they won’t make the mistake of nominating someone of his ilk ‘for balance’ again. Not really important any more, Labour is definitely New Labour again.

Labour/Conservative…….2 cheeks of the same arse

 

[kiwiqpr]

Labour/Conservative…….2 cheeks of the same arse

Keeping the snout in the trough is all that matters

 

[Staines R's]

Keeping the snout in the trough is all that matters

Four legs good……two legs bad