Off Topic The Politics Thread

[kiwiqpr]

I think you're inferring something from my comments there.

My comment about the less educated wasn't referring to any individuals level of education - rather that people were inadvertently 'misinformed' or deliberately lied to as to what 'benefits' Brexit would bring i.e. those that thought it would limit immigration from non-EU countries or that the NHS would be better funded.

Clearly everyone has the right to vote, whatever their level of education.

My point is that the vote didn't actually outline what the outcomes would be other than in/out with varying degrees of sloganeering about 'taking back control' and 'sovereignty' which have been interpreted as many different things. The first vote was clouded by misinformation and outright lies. If there is to be second it should be with the full understanding of what outcomes the two options will bring. It is only in this way that the electorate will be able to make an educated decision.

who will be in charge of deciding if either sides sloganeering was true or not
assuming it wasn't only the leavers putting out misinformation and outright lies for the dimwitted racists

 

[ELLERS]

This will cheer you up Ellers.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...e-now-beginning?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Facebook

Can't see it Stroller, too many people like me would kick up a fuss. Farage's words were taken too seriously. I think he probably loves the limelight and needed something to keep the interest up. Besides, the Europeans don't want us to have another referendum. I seriously think they will be happy to see the back of us. We moan too much for them.

 

[Stroller]

Can't see it Stroller, too many people like me would kick up a fuss. Farage's words were taken too seriously. I think he probably loves the limelight and needed something to keep the interest up. Besides, the Europeans don't want us to have another referendum. I seriously think they will be happy to see the back of us. We moan too much for them.

It seems to me there is a growing anti-Brexit momentum now, which is why Farage is spooked. The justification for a further referendum is becoming undeniable. Then you can start your moaning.

 

[ELLERS]

The justification for a further referendum is becoming undeniable.

Cant agree with that
Too many MP's wouldn't want to risk their jobs trying to have another referendum. There would be mayhem if it went to another vote. Civil disorder. It will never happen. Just a load of paper talk and a few voices in the public eye.
Take it from another angle...If we had gone to the negotiations in a strong united way the EU would have respected us and lost their bottle re-negotiations. Now we have a divided nation we can never have the same level of respect/power/clout at the EU table. The EU would take the P out of us if we went back now.
Ain't gonna happen.
What needs to happen now is the whole country needs to get behind this and move forward.
TBH I have said all along that the house of cards (EU) will come tumbling down because they will never change. Hopefully, a new organization will come out of the ashes. A good European trade block without all the Stars/coins/army/integration/Brussels.

 

[ELLERS]

Another referendum?

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[Stroller]

Cant agree with that
Too many MP's wouldn't want to risk their jobs trying to have another referendum. There would be mayhem if it went to another vote. Civil disorder. It will never happen. Just a load of paper talk and a few voices in the public eye.
Take it from another angle...If we had gone to the negotiations in a strong united way the EU would have respected us and lost their bottle re-negotiations. Now we have a divided nation we can never have the same level of respect/power/clout at the EU table. The EU would take the P out of us if we went back now.
Ain't gonna happen.
What needs to happen now is the whole country needs to get behind this and move forward.
TBH I have said all along that the house of cards (EU) will come tumbling down because they will never change. Hopefully, a new organization will come out of the ashes. A good European trade block without all the Stars/coins/army/integration/Brussels.

Civil disorder, blood in the streets! You sound like Goldie now. The 'whole country' is not behind this, and we need a rethink.

 

[ELLERS]

Civil disorder, blood in the streets! You sound like Goldie now. The 'whole country' is not behind this, and we need a rethink.

Goldie is right. Not people like me but many others who will not accept it.
as Nigel would say...

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It will never happen

 

[Stroller]

Goldie is right. Not people like me but many others who will not accept it.
as Nigel would say...

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It will never happen

Oh, but it might. You seem a bit scared, Ellers. Don't be, it's just democracy.

 

[kiwiqpr]

who will be in charge of deciding if either sides sloganeering was true or not
assuming it wasn't only the leavers putting out misinformation and outright lies for the dimwitted racists

Maybe you could have Zimbabwe style Eu election scrutineers

 

[seagullhoop]

who will be in charge of deciding if either sides sloganeering was true or not
assuming it wasn't only the leavers putting out misinformation and outright lies for the dimwitted racists

Maybe we could vote on the actual deal?

That way things like - 'there is no question of us leaving the Single Market' until the penny drops that it's dependent on freedom of movement would't be an issue.

Surely you're in favour of accountability?

 

[Sooperhoop]

Surely you're in favour of accountability?

That's one thing the EU doesn't believe in, it's some 20 years since they last signed off certified accounts. The Gravy Train stops for no-one...

 

[seagullhoop]

That's one thing the EU doesn't believe in, it's some 20 years since they last signed off certified accounts. The Gravy Train stops for no-one...

Don't kid yourself... all politics is a gravy train... leaving the EU is only likely to increase the opportunity for profiteering as the country drifts towards a deregulated, low-tax, low-pay sweatshop controlled by non-dom ideologues and billionaires.

 

[Uber_Hoop]

Don't kid yourself... all politics is a gravy train... leaving the EU is only likely to increase the opportunity for profiteering as the country drifts towards a deregulated, low-tax, low-pay sweatshop controlled by non-dom ideologues and billionaires.

Yeah, but it won’t be all good though.

 

[Sooperhoop]

Don't kid yourself... all politics is a gravy train... leaving the EU is only likely to increase the opportunity for profiteering as the country drifts towards a deregulated, low-tax, low-pay sweatshop controlled by non-dom ideologues and billionaires.

Started by that great Europhile Tony Blair...

 

[rangercol]

If you like. I tried to give you a more nuanced answer but like the original question on the ballot paper we'll have to agree to disagree on whether these things can be simplified to your desired level of debate.

A bit like your comment on the "un-educated" voting to leave, you clearly feel way above me intellectually. I'll leave you to it.

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

A bit like your comment on the "un-educated" voting to leave, you clearly feel way above me intellectually. I'll leave you to it.

I don’t know why you have to take things personally. Leave voters on average were less educated than Remain voters. It’s not an insult and it’s explained to an extent by the average ages of both camps. It doesn’t mean all Leave supporters are less educated than all Remain supporters.

 

[Staines R's]

I really don't know what you want me to say - or what you're angling for.

Why would anyone change a political position based on a vote - would you stop campaigning for your party of choice because you lose an election?

What would be gained by anyone 'accepting' a position they feel to be wrong.

You really do need to rethink what you are looking for out of this conversation.

Are you ever gonna answer Col’s question clearly or am I reading this thread in vain ?

 

[Staines R's]

I don’t know why you have to take things personally. Leave voters on average were less educated than Remain voters. It’s not an insult and it’s explained to an extent by the average ages of both camps. It doesn’t mean all Leave supporters are less educated than all Remain supporters.

It comes over as pretty insulting, to be fair

 

[rangercol]

Are you ever gonna answer Col’s question clearly or am I reading this thread in vain ?

I don't think he is mate.

 

[rangercol]

It comes over as pretty insulting, to be fair

They don't get it mate.