Off Topic The Politics Thread

[sb_73]

Not throwing my toys out the pram mate. We go around in circles on here, so I figure it's best to stand back and read with interest. I certainly don't disagree with everything said by those on the left, or those in the centre or the right for that matter, but I don't share the pathological hatred of all things Tory like some appear to.
It gets a bit tiresome and I'd rather not get involved on here on this thread.

Hope you're well mate.

Pretty unfair on Jeremy Corbyn calling him a pacifist. He was a fervent supporter of the IRA when it was murdering women and children. Go Jezza!

It's not all one way traffic Col. I'm no fan of Corbyn, or any of the clique who currently run the Labour Party, but they really are up against it with the media, and a few on here echo that too. Fair enough, all part of the increasingly tedious game, and at least Labour have produced a recognisably left wing manifesto, giving us a choice. I am looking forward to seeing the Tory one, and how they will cater for both the 'just managing' and the 'already loaded'.

Four legs good, two legs bad.......................................which is not a great choice for those of us who are interested in 3, or perhaps 5, legs.

 

[Sooperhoop]

A lot of Labour's manifesto is perfectly reasonable, they say it has been costed but they don't say how they will pay for it. The reality is that it cannot be paid for without massive increases in Income Tax, Corporation Tax or VAT or all three. Just trying to 'soak the rich' will not cover anywhere near enough, until they explain how they square that circle it will be nothing more than a dream...

 

[sb_73]

Think I'll bow out of this thread now till after the election. It's like a Communist Party talking shop.
Communism has done so well historically, that I'm sure Corbyn will win by a landslide and you'll all be happy little soldiers.

Interesting comment Col. I don't think there are any communists on this thread, at least not in the terms that I understand communism, a creed that promises that the citizens own everything, whereas in fact the state owns the citizens. In return it promises to feed, house, educate them and give them healthcare, and never delivers. On the other side of the coin we really do live in the capitalist dream, where we are told that we are all free individuals, with the ability to fulfill our own ambitions, but actually the market owns us and hideous inequality in wealth, education, health and opportunity results. I think we do have a fair few democratic socialists on here, and if pushed (I don't like badges, or being pinned down) I am probably in that camp. All we want to do is knock the hard edges off of capitalism, which seems to me a laudable aim, but not one we will have much success with (though things like the NHS, subsidised housing, welfare, state education are all the result of this thinking and are now hard wired into our society, and most other 'developed' countries, so perhaps I am talking the impact down). And, as I have said before, I suspect the whole left/right thing that we seem to be stuck with is no longer relevant or helpful. But I don't really have any alternatives.

 

[QPR999]

A lot of Labour's manifesto is perfectly reasonable, they say it has been costed but they don't say how they will pay for it. The reality is that it cannot be paid for without massive increases in Income Tax, Corporation Tax or VAT or all three. Just trying to 'soak the rich' will not cover anywhere near enough, until they explain how they square that circle it will be nothing more than a dream...

Two policy announcements from Labour tonight that weren't in the 'leaked' draft manifesto ...

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[UTRs]

Two policy announcements from Labour tonight that weren't in the 'leaked' draft manifesto ...

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Sorry, not a bad idea until they mention Robin frigging Hood...

Why not name it the Flash Gordon Tax? He is my favorite as he will save everyone of us

They have missed a trick with that one!

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[sb_73]

Two policy announcements from Labour tonight that weren't in the 'leaked' draft manifesto ...

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Brace yourself for the Tory claims that all of these things are impractical and would destroy the financial services sector (even more than Brexit!), mean all the rich would run away etc etc, except for the ones they pinch.

 

[QPR999]

Brace yourself for the Tory claims that all of these things are impractical and would destroy the financial services sector (even more than Brexit!), mean all the rich would run away etc etc, except for the ones they pinch.

When I read them I thought pretty much the same. These policies will be more damaging than 'Brexit.'

 

[kiwiqpr]

Brace yourself for the Tory claims that all of these things are impractical and would destroy the financial services sector (even more than Brexit!), mean all the rich would run away etc etc, except for the ones they pinch.

Would it be a fair claim sb

 

[sb_73]

Would it be a fair claim sb

Don't think so, but I'm no expert on tax avoidance/evasion Kiwi. They seem to think a lot of MPs have cash squirrelled away. They may have a point. I have often wondered (ok, once or twice, I try not to think about him) how Liam Fox, a man who has lived off the taxpayer all his life, briefly as a GP and for decades as an MP, became a millionaire.

Tories (and Vince Cable) already having a go at the Robin Hood tax, saying that all these transactions and jobs which go with them will leave the U.K. By that logic Germany, which has a corporation tax rate twice as high as the UKs, should be an economic wasteland.

 

[durbar2003]

Any tax on the rich affects the poor. How do they think the rich stay rich, the charge the poor more!

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

By that logic Germany, which has a corporation tax rate twice as high as the UKs, should be an economic wasteland.

According to Deloitte, Germany has a corporation tax of 15% though it rises with trade taxes, so say 30%. UK is around 20%. Trump is promising 15%. Ireland is 12.5%.

https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/global/Documents/Tax/dttl-tax-corporate-tax-rates.pdf

 

[sb_73]

Are you thinking of France? According to Deloitte, Germany has a corporation tax of 15% though it rises with local taxes. UK is around 20%

https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/Deloitte/global/Documents/Tax/dttl-tax-corporate-tax-rates.pdf

Combined rate is 30-33% so I am thinking of Germany.

The fastest growing developed economy, the US, has a rate of 35%. Trump is planning to cut it to less than the reduced rate that our government is suggesting, which has my CEO almost wetting himself with excitement, and eating out of the Presidents hand, promising capital investment in the US more jobs etc, which none of the company employees think will actually happen as we don't need any more capacity and have massive capital investment in multiple different countries which would cost a fortune to shut down. Trump also saying he will offer incentives for US companies to 'repatriate' profits earned overseas and pay tax on it there rather than where it is generated.

You edited your post making mine look weird!

I guess the point is that tax rates have an impact on business, but perhaps not as big a one as politicians would like us to believe, and certainly not as much as they think. Skilled and affordable workforce, infrastructure, links to other markets and ease of trade, all more important. Oops, back on Brexit.....

 

[GoldhawkRoad]

Combined rate is 30-33% so I am thinking of Germany.

The fastest growing developed economy, the US, has a rate of 35%. Trump is planning to cut it to less than the reduced rate that our government is suggesting, which has my CEO almost wetting himself with excitement, and eating out of the Presidents hand, promising capital investment in the US more jobs etc, which none of the company employees think will actually happen as we don't need any more capacity and have massive capital investment in multiple different countries which would cost a fortune to shut down. Trump also saying he will offer incentives for US companies to 'repatriate' profits earned overseas and pay tax on it there rather than where it is generated.

You edited your post making mine look weird!

Sorry about the editing - comparative corporation taxes between nations is a learning curve for me!

I think a general comparison between the economies of the UK and Germany is an interesting one - presumably better productivity rates favour the latter

 

[sb_73]

Sorry about the editing - comparative corporation taxes between nations is a learning curve for me!

I think a general comparison between the economies of the UK and Germany is an interesting one - presumably better productivity rates favour the latter

I added something to mine now! I can't really work it out either, but the instant shroud waving on the Labour proposals was interestingly reminiscent of the Remain campaign.......

 

[sb_73]

Anybody flying to the USA in the near future be prepared for inconvenience. Laptop/tablet ban in hand baggage to be implemented very soon. If this prevents an atrocity of course it has to be done, though it's rather depressing to think that we and the US agree that the UK is the place most likely after the usual suspects for an attack to come from.

I am wondering what my company will say when I turn up either without a laptop (and hence in modern day work virtually useless) because the bags have gone missing in transit (not infrequent) or the contents have been smashed up*, or 'borrowed'.

* travellers tip. Never pack anything delicate in checked in bags going anywhere near Madrid, where the baggage handlers apparently entertain themselves by jumping up and down on every bag they move.

 

[TootingExcess]

Anybody flying to the USA in the near future be prepared for inconvenience. Laptop/tablet ban in hand baggage to be implemented very soon. If this prevents an atrocity of course it has to be done, though it's rather depressing to think that we and the US agree that the UK is the place most likely after the usual suspects for an attack to come from.

I am wondering what my company will say when I turn up either without a laptop (and hence in modern day work virtually useless) because the bags have gone missing in transit (not infrequent) or the contents have been smashed up*, or 'borrowed'.

* travellers tip. Never pack anything delicate in checked in bags going anywhere near Madrid, where the baggage handlers apparently entertain themselves by jumping up and down on every bag they move.

Back in the 90s I worked airside in the halls at Gatwick and Heathrow installing security equipment ; I was astonished at how far these handlers could through suitcases through the air onto concrete. As I stood open mouthed after one very loud bang; one handler asked me what the **** I was looking at. We were later told not to look at the handlers doing their work as "they are very unionised and touchy about their working practices". I always think of those loud bangs every time someone says they had something break in transit.

Not sure if it's still like that now Stainsey?

 

[Stroller]

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[TootingExcess]

I added something to mine now! I can't really work it out either, but the instant shroud waving on the Labour proposals was interestingly reminiscent of the Remain campaign.......

The tories have rolled out Project Fear again, but all the leavers who bitched about it last time are the ones writing the script this time. The smile on old IDS's face as Project Fear was back on his side again was a joy to behold.

Depressing all around.

 

[sb_73]

The tories have rolled out Project Fear again, but all the leavers who bitched about it last time are the ones writing the script this time. The smile on old IDS's face as Project Fear was back on his side again was a joy to behold.

Depressing all around.

It's intellectual dishonesty mate, where you don't engage with ideas but try to suppress them without debate. All sides guilty of it in modern politics, and I'm no innocent in indulging in this very bad habit myself. Though I am aware of what I'm doing and try to stop myself. Sometimes.

Lynton Crosby's strategy for the Tories now clear. May as the national mother figure (Big Mother! Her name on the bus, no mention of the Tory Party), Corbyn to be mocked at every occasion, but also made to seem threatening and sinister, all the focus on the Labour manifesto all about policies which will not be implemented, avoid any detail (or even generalities so far) on the Tory policies which the next Government will supposedly deliver, particularly the terms of Brexit which is what this election is all about. Roll out Michael Fallon, who usually comes across as moderate and avuncular, for the big knife jobs on opponents. Keep Johnson and Fox as quiet as possible.

Though the council housing proposal is interesting. Square the compulsory purchases necessary for local authorities to deliver this with free market philosophy. No I can't either.

Big Mother is watching you!

 

[sb_73]

Merkel's CDU biggest party in Germany's most populous province in elections, beating the SDP into a surprising second. But the good news is that the AFD only got 7.5% of the vote. Another blow for the populists, the tide is turning.