Off Topic The Politics Thread

[Stroller]

So" just leave this here !!

WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE LISBON TREATY, THE TREATY THAT COMES INTO FORCE 2020, ITS WORSE THAN THE SO CALLED DEAL, IF 99% OF THE BRITISH THINK TERESA MAYS DEAL IS BAD, JUST LOOK AT THE LISBON TREATY. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW, LEAVERS AND REMAIN
..“What will actually happen if we stay in the EU” is a question no remainer will ever answer but here it is warts and all.
Check it out if you wish ——>>
1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.
2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.
6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today.
7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals.
8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs.
9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas.
10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights
11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights
12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty
13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation
14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent
15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy
16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them
17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths
18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc
19: The UK loses control of its judicial system
20: The UK loses control of its international policy
21: The UK loses full control of its national policy
22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right.
23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program
24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction
25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty
26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020
This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them?
They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons!
Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see whats coming before its to late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anynore

Why is no one talking about this? Because it's bollocks, that's why. I googled Lisbon Treaty 2020 and what came out top was something called the 'Lewes Forum' which had the same list of bullshit. I did manage to find this in repudiation, though (you'll enjoy the name of the website)…….

​

ilovetheeu.co.uk/democracy/no-none-of-the-list-of-lies-is-laid-down-in-the-lisbon-treaty/

 

[ELLERS]

we are leaving the EU, what they choose to do is up to them.

mmm In the last 3 days i have not been so confident about us leaving? It seems that May has ruled the out meaningful vote this week. And more concerning is that reports keep coming out talking of it being delayed until 2021?

 

[sb_73]

mmm In the last 3 days i have not been so confident about us leaving? It seems that May has ruled the out meaningful vote this week. And more concerning is that reports keep coming out talking of it being delayed until 2021?

I think you will get your wish by default Ellers, because all parties involved - our Government, our MPs and the EU Commission/Council - are incompetent twats, incapable of convincing anyone of anything. No deal looms as they play chicken and all get killed.

 

[Stroller]

Fair enough Strolls. Not sure if Andrew Fisher, who wrote the manifesto, is officially a Momentum member. He’s a former columnist for the Morning Star and was briefly suspended from Labour for urging voters in South Croydon not to vote Labour, but for the candidate for Class War (Stainsey’s mob). I’m afraid that, in my opinion, the Corbyn clique is full of entryists, for whom the Labour Party is a vehicle to power to implement a ultra left agenda, dragging us all towards the equality of poverty.

I don’t take political pointers from Maureen Lipman, and I hope no one else does. Labour has to deal with this Zionist/anti semitism stuff quickly and decisively, it’s a running sore.

May is kicking the empty can further down the road. Still in a game of chicken with the EU and MPs.

It’s a shame that all the commentators and the nonentities who have joined it can only see this Independent Group in terms of the past, a rerun of the SDP. A chance to reshape our moribund, ossified political landscape will pass us by.

Drinking Malbec while the lamb roasts, all is good with the world.

Never heard of Andrew Fisher, but I wouldn't have said that getting a journalist to write the manifesto was the same as letting him decide what went in it. Even if he had, there's nothing in it to be scared of as far as I can see. Quite the opposite.

There's been a lot of talk about UKIP entryism in the Tory party, so maybe a new centre party will eventually emerge from the Brexit fiasco, with One-Nation Tories and Blairite Labour MPs joining forces with Liberals. The Independent Group doesn't stand for anything currently, though.

Just about to open another bottle of the smokey bacon-tasting Kruger Pinotage. Yummy.

 

[ELLERS]

I think you will get your wish by default Ellers, because all parties involved - our Government, our MPs and the EU Commission/Council - are incompetent twats, incapable of convincing anyone of anything. No deal looms as they play chicken and all get killed.

I think that's a bit harsh Sb...I always wanted a free trade deal. I only said that the default will kick in if there is a no deal. However loads of MP's keep saying they won't let that happen.

 

[sb_73]

I think that's a bit harsh Sb...I always wanted a free trade deal. I only said that the default will kick in if there is a no deal. However loads of MP's keep saying they won't let that happen.

I wasn’t having a go at you Ellers, but at absolutely all of the numpties involved in this fiasco. I don’t think there is a mechanism in place for MPs to block a no deal Brexit. Might change this week. If it does May could also get her deal through.

But honestly, **** knows. As a bloke on the radio said this morning (his name escapes me) I’m tired and bored of my own thoughts on this subject, let alone anyone else’s.

 

[ELLERS]

I wasn’t having a go at you Ellers, but at absolutely all of the numpties involved in this fiasco. I don’t think there is a mechanism in place for MPs to block a no deal Brexit. Might change this week. If it does May could also get her deal through.

But honestly, **** knows. As a bloke on the radio said this morning (his name escapes me) I’m tired and bored of my own thoughts on this subject, let alone anyone else’s.

I just got back from Germany and had an interesting conversation re Brexit which I will post at a later point.

 

[sb_73]

I just got back from Germany and had an interesting conversation re Brexit which I will post at a later point.

My mates in the US don’t really get it at all, mind you they have enough problems of their own to focus on. The conversation tends to go:
‘What’s going to happen?’
‘Nobody knows, that’s the problem’
‘You guys must hate the EU’
‘We hate each other more’.

I will place a bet that your conversation in Germany 100% backs up your opinions. It’s amazing how you only ever meet foreigners who run down their own countries. Which us British would never do, of course.

 

[sb_73]

Never heard of Andrew Fisher, but I wouldn't have said that getting a journalist to write the manifesto was the same as letting him decide what went in it. Even if he had, there's nothing in it to be scared of as far as I can see. Quite the opposite.

There's been a lot of talk about UKIP entryism in the Tory party, so maybe a new centre party will eventually emerge from the Brexit fiasco, with One-Nation Tories and Blairite Labour MPs joining forces with Liberals. The Independent Group doesn't stand for anything currently, though.

Just about to open another bottle of the smokey bacon-tasting Kruger Pinotage. Yummy.

He’s not a journo, he is Corbyn’s Chief policy advisor, a Marxist economist.

I’m sick to death of this crappy stuck in the past us v them party system, but it will see me out.

 

[ELLERS]

My mates in the US don’t really get it at all, mind you they have enough problems of their own to focus on. The conversation tends to go:
‘What’s going to happen?’
‘Nobody knows, that’s the problem’
‘You guys must hate the EU’
‘We hate each other more’.

I will place a bet that your conversation in Germany 100% backs up your opinions. It’s amazing how you only ever meet foreigners who run down their own countries. Which us British would never do, of course.

You're wrong. I was actually surprised by what the fella said.

 

[sb_73]

You're wrong. I was actually surprised by what the fella said.

I look forward to your full and frank reportage on this encounter.

 

[ELLERS]

I look forward to your full and frank reportage on this encounter.

I need to get over the weekend though and back into London first thing. So it will prob be Tuesday.

 

[DT’s Socks]

So" just leave this here !!

WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE LISBON TREATY, THE TREATY THAT COMES INTO FORCE 2020, ITS WORSE THAN THE SO CALLED DEAL, IF 99% OF THE BRITISH THINK TERESA MAYS DEAL IS BAD, JUST LOOK AT THE LISBON TREATY. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW, LEAVERS AND REMAIN
..“What will actually happen if we stay in the EU” is a question no remainer will ever answer but here it is warts and all.
Check it out if you wish ——>>
1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.
2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.
6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today.
7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals.
8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs.
9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas.
10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights
11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights
12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty
13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation
14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent
15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy
16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them
17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths
18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc
19: The UK loses control of its judicial system
20: The UK loses control of its international policy
21: The UK loses full control of its national policy
22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right.
23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program
24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction
25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty
26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020
This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them?
They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons!
Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see whats coming before its to late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anynore

Oh dear Ellers

 

[ELLERS]

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[Stroller]

He’s not a journo, he is Corbyn’s Chief policy advisor, a Marxist economist.

I’m sick to death of this crappy stuck in the past us v them party system, but it will see me out.

Ah, ok. Well he advises good policies then, I would say.

I'm sick to death of the Tories.

 

[sb_73]

Ah, ok. Well he advises good policies then, I would say.

I'm sick to death of the Tories.

Bernie Sanders is well into something called Modern Monetary Theory, championed by a US economist called Stephanie Kelton, which essentially says a government can run up whatever deficit it likes, printing money to do it, as long as inflation doesn’t go mental. So Corbyn (or Sanders) could go in a spending spree, theoretically, and not send us all down the river. It’s actually just what conservative administrations have done, except they spend on tax cuts rather than public services.

On paper it makes sense. Sadly the people who like the conservative tax cuts also have the ability to manipulate markets to ruin public spending based policies. And it’s also a shame that Modern Monetary Theory shares its initials with Magic Money Tree.

 

[DT’s Socks]

How anyone can watch that May woman say that we are hopeful of a deal when there is only one deal in play... that was rejected was it not?

Dear god how can that be said on UK TV and not be picked up?

We have one deal from a self imposed dictator or doom for the next generations

It’s really incredible theatre this now
Layers and layers of brainwashing the sheep are confused , some have lied down to die

You will get your beautiful blue wool dirty

 

[Stroller]

Bernie Sanders is well into something called Modern Monetary Theory, championed by a US economist called Stephanie Kelton, which essentially says a government can run up whatever deficit it likes, printing money to do it, as long as inflation doesn’t go mental. So Corbyn (or Sanders) could go in a spending spree, theoretically, and not send us all down the river. It’s actually just what conservative administrations have done, except they spend on tax cuts rather than public services.

On paper it makes sense. Sadly the people who like the conservative tax cuts also have the ability to manipulate markets to ruin public spending based policies. And it’s also a shame that Modern Monetary Theory shares its initials with Magic Money Tree.

I'm not sure that makes sense to me, but I like the sound of it.

Sanders is seeking the nomination again isn't he. I'm convinced he would have beaten Trump last time round. It'd be marvellous if he did it next time.

 

[kiwiqpr]

how old is sanders

 

[Stroller]

how old is sanders

He's 77, but still sane. Trump, not so much.