The Joe Allen speculation thread

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NI Revolution In Red said:
Don't get the vitriol, this is how football works really.
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I'm sorry, but if you can't see why some of us are upset then you're blind. I know that people in football can't be relied upon to keep their word, but when you have a written contract, we as fans thought this wouldn't happen. I presume he signed it in the knowledge that he would ignore it and take advantage of the £15m clause. THAT is the thing that has stirred us up most.

That being said £15m isn't a bad sum of money and I would hope we can replace him, however the problem here isn't so much Joe's actual skills, but his understanding and place in the starting 11. It will take some time to find the right "cog" to fit that.
 
Good luck to br and Joe i hope it works out for them as has been said earlier 22million in the bank and we seem to have added quality enough said and i think there should be a good reception for the returning people when Liverpool come to town.
 
SA9JACK said:
He didn't want out, as recently as this week he's been indecisive and I get the impression he's still not 100% he's doing the right thing. That's not wanting out
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I think it looks pretty clear. Not to say he doesn't love Swansea though.

And Norfolk, I can see why you're upset, it's obvious why - what I'm saying is you have to be realistic. This is how football works, there is little romance left in it when you go beyond the fans and certain players - and even the brightest flames can be extinguished with a single breath.
 
SA9JACK said:
He didn't want out, as recently as this week he's been indecisive and I get the impression he's still not 100% he's doing the right thing. That's not wanting out
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He was sat in Anfield last night. He wants to go and I've been told that Brendan had told him he'd take him before he'd even signed his Liverpool contract. They had an agreement as Rodgers knew he was pivotal to his success. He has always been up for the move since Rodgers left Swansea and thats come from Rodger's big gob himself.

I think you're clutching at straws and kidding yourself that he's been undecided no matter what you've been told. You still sound like you think there's a chance he won't come!

If he didn't want the lucrative move that will set his new family up for life, he would not have been sat in Anfield last night and we wouldnb't of went as far as to spend £15m on someone who wasn't sure when were not exactly minted.
 
NorfolkSwan said:
I'm sorry, but if you can't see why some of us are upset then you're blind. I know that people in football can't be relied upon to keep their word, but when you have a written contract, we as fans thought this wouldn't happen. I presume he signed it in the knowledge that he would ignore it and take advantage of the £15m clause. THAT is the thing that has stirred us up most.

That being said £15m isn't a bad sum of money and I would hope we can replace him, however the problem here isn't so much Joe's actual skills, but his understanding and place in the starting 11. It will take some time to find the right "cog" to fit that.
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I wouldn't be so sure that the release clause was all Joe's idea.
 
Joe wanted to join liverpool from the beginning. we had not quite finished the season even. he knew kenny was coming in for him and when kenny was sacked and brendan was appointed then that sealed it for joe. nothing was going to stop his dream move then.....He will always be a jack and a local lad but lets get real here. he is trying to be the best he can in his chosen career and play at the very highest level, He has worked hard to get where he is and mayby in a few years he may get to play for us again just like curtis and james did.....Brendan just happens to be liverpools manager now but it could have been anyone. Joe was not going to let a little thing like a gentlemans agreement stand in his way as he knew nobody can stop him from leaving due to his players rights and as he was adament on joining liverpool then Brendan might as well take him, Also brendan did not have to pay the maximum but he kept his word and let joe instigate the move......
 
Toela65 said:
He was sat in Anfield last night. He wants to go and I've been told that Brendan had told him he'd take him before he'd even signed his Liverpool contract. They had an agreement as Rodgers knew he was pivotal to his success. He has always been up for the move since Rodgers left Swansea and thats come from Rodger's big gob himself.

I think you're clutching at straws and kidding yourself that he's been undecided no matter what you've been told. You still sound like you think there's a chance he won't come!

If he didn't want the lucrative move that will set his new family up for life, he would not have been sat in Anfield last night and we wouldnb't of went as far as to spend £15m on someone who wasn't sure when were not exactly minted.
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You've heard from a friend of a friend that rogers said Allen wanted to join Liverpool from the start, I heard from Joe's Mrs directly that he's been indecisive. Not clutching at straws at all, I've said all along that he'd probably go but can't believe people have been saying that this has been a done deal for weeks and that Allen wanted out of Swansea. He's had a though choice to make between leaving the club he's been with since he was 9 and moving him and his heavily expectant girlfriend to Liverpool for some stupid money. I don't blame him in the slightest for choosing the latter and I've past on my best wishes to him. I hope he goes on to be a kop legend as he is a liberty legend, and hope the new manager after Christmas will continue to give him the chance he deserves
 
wewontchangeouridentity said:
Joe wanted to join liverpool from the beginning. we had not quite finished the season even. he knew kenny was coming in for him and when kenny was sacked and brendan was appointed then that sealed it for joe. nothing was going to stop his dream move then.....He will always be a jack and a local lad but lets get real here. he is trying to be the best he can in his chosen career and play at the very highest level, He has worked hard to get where he is and mayby in a few years he may get to play for us again just like curtis and james did.....Brendan just happens to be liverpools manager now but it could have been anyone. Joe was not going to let a little thing like a gentlemans agreement stand in his way as he knew nobody can stop him from leaving due to his players rights and as he was adament on joining liverpool then Brendan might as well take him, Also brendan did not have to pay the maximum but he kept his word and let joe instigate the move......
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Dream move? Yeah, every Man utd fan aspires to play for Liverpool don't they? <doh>
He's only there because rogers tapped him up
 
So it looks like we're going into the weekend with the Allen Affair unresolved. He's in the Welsh squad for next week, so he will no doubt be joining up with the squad after tomorrow's game. Will Allen play against Stuttgart? Or, if he doesn't is it in deference to the Wales game or because he's been setaside until this affair is resolved. Did he train yesterday and today?
 
Yankee_Jack said:
So it looks like we're going into the weekend with the Allen Affair unresolved. He's in the Welsh squad for next week, so he will no doubt be joining up with the squad after tomorrow's game. Will Allen play against Stuttgart? Or, if he doesn't is it in deference to the Wales game or because he's been setaside until this affair is resolved. Did he train yesterday and today?
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How can he possibly play against Stuttgart when he was sitting in the stands at Anfield last night? He's finished here.
 
aswan_dam said:
How can he possibly play against Stuttgart when he was sitting in the stands at Anfield last night? He's finished here.
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If memory serves, Taylor talked to Newcastle a year ago and he didn't go anywhere. Allen is still under contract. He is still pulling a pay check. He still as duties and obligations. It is still in his best interest to train. This is why I asked if he's not playing tomorrow why? And has he been at training?

Now, I'm interested in understanding the final lap of this thing. If for some reason HJ wants full cash on delivery, and why not, and Liverpool want to finance but can't get any financing other than through the seller because their balance sheet isn't up to it, what happens? Let's take the emotion out of it and speak generically - why would the selling team be required to finance the transaction for the buying team by accepting payment over time and assuming the risk of default - its a general business question, but applied to football. If the seller is not desperate for cash flow and / or has no other incentive to sell, why would the seller accept less than the value of the transaction upon closing and assume risk. If the buyer cannot meet cash on delivery then they are under funded and would have to withdraw from the transaction. Let's say the transaction amount is 15M. If the buyer cannot close with 15M in cash or financing, then they two options - withdraw - or negotiate the amount down due on closing but then pay a premium on the back end at a minimum for the seller's lost opportunity cost on the balance owed, which would end up making the transaction valued at over 15M.

Can somebody enlighten me as to why HJ would not demand payment in full on closing. Does he have to sell if the required amount cannot be paid on closing and accept deferred payments.
 
That's an insult and should be removed in light of the forum rules, Aswan.

Oh you said banker! Still an insult.

Allen's history. Just a question of dotting the i's and crossing the t's.
 
Yankee_Jack said:
If memory serves, Taylor talked to Newcastle a year ago and he didn't go anywhere. Allen is still under contract. He is still pulling a pay check. He still as duties and obligations. It is still in his best interest to train. This is why I asked if he's not playing tomorrow why? And has he been at training?

Now, I'm interested in understanding the final lap of this thing. If for some reason HJ wants full cash on delivery, and why not, and Liverpool want to finance but can't get any financing other than through the seller because their balance sheet isn't up to it, what happens? Let's take the emotion out of it and speak generically - why would the selling team be required to finance the transaction for the buying team by accepting payment over time and assuming the risk of default - its a general business question, but applied to football. If the seller is not desperate for cash flow and / or has no other incentive to sell, why would the seller accept less than the value of the transaction upon closing and assume risk. If the buyer cannot meet cash on delivery then they are under funded and would have to withdraw from the transaction. Let's say the transaction amount is 15M. If the buyer cannot close with 15M in cash or financing, then they two options - withdraw - or negotiate the amount down due on closing but then pay a premium on the back end at a minimum for the seller's lost opportunity cost on the balance owed, which would end up making the transaction valued at over 15M.

Can somebody enlighten me as to why HJ would not demand payment in full on closing. Does he have to sell if the required amount cannot be paid on closing and accept deferred payments.
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I wouldn't mind betting that this transfer is as much Huw's doing as anybody else's. I can imagine him sitting back now with a panama, a bottle of bubbly and a huge grin on his face.
Tucked those stupid yanks (no offence yankee) up for another 15 million, thank you very much :D
I do love Allen and I'm gutted to see him go, but 15 million? Come on. Do they want Gower too? 10 million, they can have him. Bargain.
Seriously though, Jenkins seems to have been very quiet about all this when you'd normally expect some fighting talk so I think this is very much to his liking so I wouldn't expect him to play hardball over the payment.
 
SA9 ... no offence taken! I'm not a yank, I just live amongst them.

You might be right. By now HJ and ML would have figured out what they could do with the money in terms of replacement and perhaps they really like what's on their radar or even moving through the pipeline waiting for the Allen deal to close.
 
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