i think its about time we recall Sam Gallagher and Jack Stephens and send them to lower clubs or train them with our squad... They are gaining nothing by sitting on a championship bench!
Saints Academy Thread
- Thread starter - Doing The Lambert Walk
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Stephens played against United in the Capital One cup. He's getting some minutes. Not much, but still more than he would get here.
Maybe we should send Gallagher to a League 1 club. It's difficult to cement a place in a Championship team for a young lad of twenty. It's a strong league, very competitive, full of experienced pro's.
Maybe we should send Gallagher to a League 1 club. It's difficult to cement a place in a Championship team for a young lad of twenty. It's a strong league, very competitive, full of experienced pro's.
My tame MK Dons supporting friend says Gallagher started off ok but fell down the order despite the fact that they don't have many strikers ("or midfielders, or defenders"). Unfortunately for him, promotion last season came from the success of loan players like Benik Afobe, Dele Alli and Will Grigg, who are gone now. Even clubs at the wrong end of the Championship are spending money on experienced players and MK haven't got that, so it will be tough for them to get to 45 points. I see why that loan was appealing at the start of the season, hopefully Sam will get enough out of it to be worthwhile.
Would it be harsh to suggest I think we should sell him on? I never personally felt he offered a great deal and he seems not to have progressed at all. At some point it's time to move things forward for both parties, no? Or am I being hasty? (I just don't see him getting anywhere near our first team, despite being an obvious Pelle style replacement).
Agree LTL. We are going to have to accept that very few (if any!!) players coming through our academy are going to reach the level of top 6 premiership players. This is the level we are aiming at. With the money in this league we are talking about competition with the best players in the world and more than half the world's players have a greater incentive (poverty) to get there. Our academy may have to viewed as a way of making us more competitive with the top teams by providing us with income that shirt sales, merchandise etc. doesn't.
I'd have to agree with you LTL, I don't think he will ever reach the standard we require. Although some on here have seemed to rate him quite highly, I've never seen it and think it would be better for club and player if we moved him on soon.
We will still produce players good enough for where we want to be. Bale, Walcott, Chamberlain, Shaw, Lallana and Chambers are all good enough to be in a team or squad in the top 6. I think people panic and think because we haven't got many around the first team squad at the moment, that our academy is regressing and not producing the quality of young player any more. We've sold so many in the last few seasons that it's innevatble that we will have a few seasons where we'll see less in the squad. But the ones we have sold in recent seasons, we've sold to the teams competing at the top. Maybe the ones that are slower to progress (like Lallana) will find it more difficult to break through. But I trust in our set up to continue to show why it's one of the best in the country.
No ones panicking?
Gallagher also isn't really a proper youth product by definition either is he? Didn't we sign him at 16?
Also I asked on here before but can't remember if I got a definitive answer... does anyone know if there's any truth in the rumour that we were due a couple of 'slower' years from the academy due to finances in 09?
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I don't mean panic to the extent that people are running around with flailing arms. Maybe worried is a better word
I've just seen a lot of comments since last summer with people concerned that we'll no longer be able to produce players of the quality sufficient for where we are and where we want to be. I've seen comments where people have noted the lack of youth products in our squad at the moment and have projected that to mean that we will now struggle to get the youngsters in the set up. Maybe that will be the case. But all the youngsters we've sold recently have gone to clubs where we want to be so I don't see that being the case.
Wasn't a comment on Gallagher who I don't think will make it with us either. Gallagher is the lad we signed from Plymouth isn't he? I think he had already broken through to the Plymouth first team. Maybe I'm thinking of Stephens...now I am confused
I don't mean panic to the extent that people are running around with flailing arms. Maybe worried is a better word
I've just seen a lot of comments since last summer with people concerned that we'll no longer be able to produce players of the quality sufficient for where we are and where we want to be. I've seen comments where people have noted the lack of youth products in our squad at the moment and have projected that to mean that we will now struggle to get the youngsters in the set up. Maybe that will be the case. But all the youngsters we've sold recently have gone to clubs where we want to be so I don't see that being the case.
Wasn't a comment on Gallagher who I don't think will make it with us either. Gallagher is the lad we signed from Plymouth isn't he? I think he had already broken through to the Plymouth first team. Maybe I'm thinking of Stephens...now I am confused
We signed both Stephens and Gallagher from Plymouth. Stephens had played a handful of times, we signed him in 2011(?), whilst Gallagher hadn't even started a scholarship at Plymouth before we nabbed him at 16, in I think 2012?
I think everyone knew that a few years ago our golden generation came through...even the club acknowledged it in a photo. JWP and Gallagher are the only ones left from that group (I think) and we made great money from Shaw and Chambers. Not sure if Targett was included. There was known to be a gap after that (because of our previous financial problems), so we bought a few in. Few clubs have great players every year, but this is covered in bigger clubs because they keep the players, so have several Academy players in the team at one time.
Re loaning out young players.
I've always wondered what part the player/agent/parents play in this. If a loan to a L2 club is suggested can or do they turn it down for ego or status reasons?
It's ok going to a Champ' club but you really have to make an impact quickly or become bench fodder. I'd rather see someone like Gallagher at somewhere like Plymouth, Oxford, Wimbledon or Bristol Rovers where he stands more chance of playing and making a real go of it. I know some have concerns regarding the coaching or facilities at some lower league clubs but with close monitoring it could benefit everybody. Never underestimate game time and through it gaining confidence.
I've always wondered what part the player/agent/parents play in this. If a loan to a L2 club is suggested can or do they turn it down for ego or status reasons?
It's ok going to a Champ' club but you really have to make an impact quickly or become bench fodder. I'd rather see someone like Gallagher at somewhere like Plymouth, Oxford, Wimbledon or Bristol Rovers where he stands more chance of playing and making a real go of it. I know some have concerns regarding the coaching or facilities at some lower league clubs but with close monitoring it could benefit everybody. Never underestimate game time and through it gaining confidence.
Gallagher wasn't in that group and neither was Targett- they were the year below. Reed, Gape & McQueen were though.
I think any smart lad does what the club wants....cannot harm them to get game experience....must be depressing to just train and occasionally play with lads coming through the Academy behind you. Didn't do Beckham any harm.
Wasn't Gallagher being used more as a wide player, last season, to accommodate Seagar playing in the middle, in the U21s?
I would have thought that his confidence would have taken a knock, when he realised he wasn't being picked to play in his preferred role, and maybe he's developed bad habits as a result of being played out of position?
I would have thought that his confidence would have taken a knock, when he realised he wasn't being picked to play in his preferred role, and maybe he's developed bad habits as a result of being played out of position?
I would like to see Gallagher get another chance and I would like to see more youngsters break in and have premier league experience but whilst some have sat on the bench koeman obviously doesn't think they are ready.
Mind you, given the amount of abuse there is when a seasoned pro like yoshida gets when he gets picked it's scary to think what the reaction of some would be if an academy player was given a chance.
Mind you, given the amount of abuse there is when a seasoned pro like yoshida gets when he gets picked it's scary to think what the reaction of some would be if an academy player was given a chance.
Going out on loan as a striker is much more difficult than for a defender or midfielder. They really have to hit the ground running and unless they start like Defoe did at Bournemouth they will soon be replaced. Strikers will only find loan clubs that are struggling in the league, as the teams doing well will be scoring goals. Strikers feed on confidence, send him out to a L1 or L2 team that play good football and see if he rips it up
Don't think so. I think the main issue was that he was going through a growth spurt and as a result was struggling with movement and balance. That was why Seager was preferred. Gallagher will come back in time and could prove to be a major asset. Whether that matches up to our top 4 or top 6 aspirations remains to be seen.