Off Topic Politics Thread
- Thread starter ChilcoSaint
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You don’t have a clue what I believe in this instance. I think you’re being quite rude here.
I just said that I will wait until more of the real truth emerges. Yes - I believe it’s very likely that Trump has done something badly wrong here, but there is at least a small chance that he’s been set up.
I base that on the length of time it’s taken to raid his gaff, the vitriol against him, how corrupt the American legal system is and how stupid you’d have to be to keep illegal documents in your own place of residence.
They gave him every opportunity to reconsider being that stupid.
For being incredibly stupid.
He is that stupid and more. The chief lesson of the Trump era is that, no matter how bad you think it is, it's worse. And no matter how venal and stupid you believe Trump to be, he's far more so. He is not a supervillain, he is an unsupervised toddler with a fork in a light socket test facility.
Adam Davidson has been on the Trump international corruption beat longer than anyone (he broke the whole "Trump's Baku hotel was a money laundering front for the Iranian National Guard" thing). And his basic takeaway is to resist the temptation to give Trump too much credit: He's an impulsive child with the keys to a Harrier jet.
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I’m not sure why you are sticking to this absurd point on how long it took them to do a raid. You know that if they had done this rapidly the same people saying this has taken too long to count as a big deal would be screaming about due process not being followed
It took ages because they went through multiple legal hurdles that they absolutely had to go through. Especially when the target is a former President with a legion of followers who will immediately claim “witch hunt” , “set up” and “mobilising the justice department against political rivals”.
Sure he is a political rival and the justice department have come after him. But that isn’t the reason they came after him. And the warrant should make that abundantly clear.
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All that I knew was the hole in my shoe was letting in water.
The relevant part of the post to which I responded:
You're right. I have no idea what you believe. All I have to go on are the words you've typed in this forum.
In my opinion there's something of a difference between typing (not necessarily believing) "But again all this proves is that another federal government agency is against trump" and typing (not necessarily believing) "I just said that I will wait until more of the real truth emerges."
Believe what you want but if you write something in an open forum and someone thinks that what you've written is nonsense then discussing that is fair game. It's not an attack on your beliefs, it's a discussion of what you've written. It's not an attack on you, it's a discussion of the words you've used and the views they express. If somebody has misunderstood what you meant, then clarify. It's not personal; it's a discussion.
If you think that it's rude to highlight apparent contradictions and seemingly unfounded statements, I can't help.
However, in the interests of forum harmony, I'll leave it now.
Vin
You're right. I have no idea what you believe. All I have to go on are the words you've typed in this forum.
In my opinion there's something of a difference between typing (not necessarily believing) "But again all this proves is that another federal government agency is against trump" and typing (not necessarily believing) "I just said that I will wait until more of the real truth emerges."
Believe what you want but if you write something in an open forum and someone thinks that what you've written is nonsense then discussing that is fair game. It's not an attack on your beliefs, it's a discussion of what you've written. It's not an attack on you, it's a discussion of the words you've used and the views they express. If somebody has misunderstood what you meant, then clarify. It's not personal; it's a discussion.
If you think that it's rude to highlight apparent contradictions and seemingly unfounded statements, I can't help.
However, in the interests of forum harmony, I'll leave it now.
Vin
I glossed over part of the “another federal government agency is against Trump” comment. The “another” part
Which other ones are apparently against him? Surely the main one that matters now is the IRS. And I would think it is pretty obvious why they might be “against” him.
Which other ones are apparently against him? Surely the main one that matters now is the IRS. And I would think it is pretty obvious why they might be “against” him.
I do have full respect for Os for going against the tide here. It is far easier to just go with the flow.
I personally have some misgivings about some of the things he seems to believe, but to be honest it is making me stop for one second just to see if there is an inkling of truth IMO to what he is saying. So that is a good thing.
I do though think that IMO Trump isn't being unfairly targeted nor will he get away with it this time.
I am not knocking O at all as we all have differing views. I personally don't think I can be swayed on this one.
I personally have some misgivings about some of the things he seems to believe, but to be honest it is making me stop for one second just to see if there is an inkling of truth IMO to what he is saying. So that is a good thing.
I do though think that IMO Trump isn't being unfairly targeted nor will he get away with it this time.
I am not knocking O at all as we all have differing views. I personally don't think I can be swayed on this one.
It is always good to hear opposing views. I try to find a range when it comes to my news/opinion content. But some of those channels are really off the deep end on certain issues - like this one. It is quite obvious mental gymnastics for some of the counterpoints
The other exercise to try is “what if the other side had done it?”. As well as the one I did on the raid taking too long “what if the opposite had happened?”.
For the first one it is very easy to get an idea of how any media to the right of centre would have reacted by just considering Hilary and her emails and Benghazi - both far less significant issues. And to a lesser extent how they keep banging on about Hunter Biden’s laptop.
For considering the opposite scenario - I already set out an example of that with reference to the length of time this has taken. There are probably other examples
Is it wrong for me to hope that something similar happens to Johnson, in the not too distant future?
That time he shed his security detail and headed off to party with the Lebedevs, straight from a NATO Foreign Minister’s meeting that discussed Russian security, still hasn’t been adequately explained.
Add in all his financial support, from those people who benefit from government contracts, he must be ripe for a complete and full investigation by our security services.
That time he shed his security detail and headed off to party with the Lebedevs, straight from a NATO Foreign Minister’s meeting that discussed Russian security, still hasn’t been adequately explained.
Add in all his financial support, from those people who benefit from government contracts, he must be ripe for a complete and full investigation by our security services.
The report on Russian involvement in British politics still hasn’t been published. That would be a start. Johnson himself is probably way down the pecking order in who actually pulls the strings in this country.
You extrapolated my posts and jumped to conclusions about my beliefs.
A few people on here of the left-leaning persuasion are very quick to call trump fans pig-headed and deluded, but they are just as pig headed & deluded as trump fans but in an anti-trump way.
I still believe in innocent until proven guilty personally. And unless you’re an FBI insider I’m pretty sure you don’t know all the facts of this case yet.
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Private Eye cartoons
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By which time it may be too late. It may all be bunkum but we must all be vigilant.
These Tory bastards would reintroduce slavery if they thought they could get away with it.