Off Topic Politics Thread
- Thread starter ChilcoSaint
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Only "like" this because it's so true and extremely frightening. As you say, it's happening in the US now (my US based friends are confirming this) and it'll come here if something isn't done about this current shower of thieves in power. When the reality of Brexit hits next year with shortages of food and prescription drugs, mass unemployment and general unrest (I predict the gammons will take to the streets looking for someone to blame - what's the betting that will be the persons of colour (any colour other than white), the EU and the namby-pamby socialists), the police and, possibly, the army will be called in to restore order which will mean sweeping draconian laws against any protest ............. the next thing will be to suspend parliament and postpone any election ........ following Putin's rules ........
God - I need to get out I think ................
Immigration is going to be a real problem for Labour. If we take a pro immigration line it's going to be incredibly easy for the Tories to exploit. The way I see it is this: At least 50% of the electorate will see large scale immigration of the type proposed by Labour at the last election as potentially eroding their living standards. Whether it's true or not is another matter, but that is what they think.
Given that perception it's going to be easy for a party as morally bankrupt as they are to persuade 40% of the electorate to support to take a hard line. We need a discussion on immigration that runs Europe wide, otherwise populism will win out. I'm quite prepared here to be the messenger that gets shot but it's very easy to assume that people are generous and welcoming when at least half of them are not. If we go into the next election with anything like the last policy we will get slaughtered again. My suspicion is that the old Corbynite wing won't mind that at all. It keeps them clean and gives them a get out.
The last sentence sums up my fears for ever being able to oust the Tories. The inability of the left, centre and right of the Labour supporters unifying in the same way as the Tories do.
They are their own worst enemies.
Immigrants will always be portrayed as the enemy, whilst we have a mainly right wing media spewing forth it’s racist bile, so Starmer is going to have to convince the people of their value to the economy and maybe the way to do that would be to diarise areas of failure, that occur over the next few years, that were previously areas of success, as a direct result of immigrant input.
Also, the only way we are likely to get decent trade deals from India/China is to allow them to have more visas, something to be tallied and thrown back in the Tories faces in terms of comparison figures.
The main hope, IMO, is for the young to register for voting as soon as they are eligible, and fight to undo the damage caused by years of Tory rule and the disadvantages foisted on them by Brexit.
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The way to tackle this absurd debate is to point out what will happen to people’s living standards if there is NO immigration. The NHS will cease to exist, skilled trades will be few and far between, agriculture will have no cheap labour for harvest time, and so on and so on. The reason? Decades of lack of training, under the Tories AND under Labour.
What did Labour's 2019 Manifesto say about immigration? I think Jeremy Corbyn understood the reservations traditional Labour supporters had with immigration better than the centrist wing of the party, hence his willingness to accept the Referendum result. Make no mistake, Free Movement was a huge contributor to Leave's victory.
Looks to me like you're trying to haver it both ways. I'm personally quite relaxed about immigration, but large numbers of the electorate clearly aren't. I don't know how you square that circle, but blaming Jeremy Corbyn and the left certainly won't do it.
Whichever party is in power, and whatever our relationship with Europe there will be immigration. Migration across the globe is only going to accelerate, and we can’t unilaterally opt out if that economic and social reality.
I absolutely agree, and would remind everyone of that.
Well perhaps you live in a more cosmopolitan area than me. Immigration has been a big issue in a East Anglia with UKIP and Brexit making big inroads into the vote. I'm quite pessimistic about being able to change opinions on this issue. Raising the large number of immigrants in NHS and the care sector seems to just prompt more racist responses. I don't rate my chances of persuading those sort of people. I am intending to stand for Labour in a ward I represented for eight years. It's a very middle class area with a clear majority who voted against leaving the EU and that may well work at Council level but nationally I think immigration is going to be a real problem for us.
This piece indicates the need for migrant fruit/veg pickers.
https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/n...4-less-productive-than-migrant-workers/23/08/
https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/n...4-less-productive-than-migrant-workers/23/08/
If political parties like Labour would only show genuine leadership over immigration and tackle the racist subtext head on, rather than just saying what will win votes, many of us would gain a huge respect for them. Tell the truth about the vast amount of economic benefit immigrants bring to this country, and call the racists out.
I agree that immigration as a topic is only going to get hotter....we can only be a few years away from a mass exodus of areas of the world where it will be too hot to grow the food to support the local population, and I can only see Britain more firmly shutting the borders, we already have politicians inciting the use of military to turn away dinghies.
The annoying thing to me that many of the people who oppose immigration are the same ones that don't want to do low paid jobs, expect their hospitals to be clean, want cheap food and cheap holidays and deny climate change and any scientific fact that does not sit well with their way of life.
As for what the Labour party can do about it and still get elected is difficult - I think they will have to concentrate on helping rebuild Syria and other areas, make out that will stem the need to leave those areas - they will also need to twin it with stopping climate change and global co-operation.
The annoying thing to me that many of the people who oppose immigration are the same ones that don't want to do low paid jobs, expect their hospitals to be clean, want cheap food and cheap holidays and deny climate change and any scientific fact that does not sit well with their way of life.
As for what the Labour party can do about it and still get elected is difficult - I think they will have to concentrate on helping rebuild Syria and other areas, make out that will stem the need to leave those areas - they will also need to twin it with stopping climate change and global co-operation.
It doesn’t help when the current government stops foreign aid, designed to help local communities, which could lead to further migration. Unfortunately, those that buy into the “all immigration is bad” mantra, will be applauding this action.
“Funding for scores of life-saving overseas projects has been stopped ahead of the axing of the aid department.
The doomed Department for International Development (DfID) has “paused” grants as it prepares to slash billions from its budget – before it is abolished altogether in September, The Independent can reveal.”
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What an utter and complete **** he is.
He is a complete **** is what he is .......really don’t like how smug he is.
Couldn't agree more Chilcs, but you're preaching to the converted on this thread (in the main, I don't speak for all).
It's the scaremongering tabloid readers being bombarded with the "illegal immigrant invasion" that suck up the fear and cheer at lost lives. Often the same conspiraloons that deny climate change, are anti-vaxxers and believe the coronavirus is man made no worse than the flu. ****ing bonkers all.
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Should have been months ago .......not in 6 months time 
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