Off Topic Politics Thread

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It’s not just a feeling Ides, impartiality is enshrined in the Good Friday Agreement. Theresa May broke the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement when she enlisted the support of the DUP.
As is well known, Boris doesn’t have a majority, and even with the DUP it’s wafer thin. 2 Tory MP’s crossing the floor this afternoon means he can’t form a government. Even if he can, several Tories have already flagged up that they will vote against him in a Confidence Motion.

Cameron broke the Good Friday agreement as well by reuniting the Conservatives with the Ulster Unionists some time pre-2010. I believe the Unionist chose to split from the Conservatives again, and are not politically aligned at the moment, although the Conservatives still have the attachment "Unionist" on their party name.
 
It is not just because of Brexit.......the EU too is short of these medicines............

(From the Pharmaceutical journal)

EU must investigate medicines shortages say hospital pharmacists
24 JUN 2019 9:33
European hospital pharmacists are demanding that the EU launches an investigation into medicines shortages.

There appears to be a manufacturing problem...for once not caused by Brexit...........
That's a sweeping article with pan European solutions sought. Dealing with the hardnosed pharmaceutical manufacturers has to be better done by the EU rather than individual countries.
I note the conference took place in Edinburgh that won't happen again post brexit, I doubt the UK chemists will be able to stay part of organisation.
There's a job advertised in Cork on the web page, great place, I've worked there in the past, no more freedom of movement for Brits after the b word. Never mind there's always Pompey.
 
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You are still missing the point..............The EU itself is also short of these medicines which is nowt to do with Brexit whatsoever. There has been a shortage for a few years and pharmacies have been struggling for around 4/5 years over this..............That means before the Brexit referendum even.......
I'm not missing the point , I'm saying your point is a logical fallacy.

The person in my example was in debt before the hypothetical recession. But you can't say the recession didn't cause his bankruptcy, Nor can you say his original debt didn't.

It's the same problem as our hospitals have. Treatments have progressed massively in recent times which means a lot more treatment and in this case medicine is needed which increases the load on our doctors and in this case manufacturers.

Reducing the number of doctors will create shortages in GP appointments, not make more appointments. and as your article points out better international intergration will reduce the medicine shortages. Reducing this as Brexit does, will only create shortages.

Saying that Brexit isn't causing shortages because there were already shortages is just plain wrong.
 
I am staggered that you think Jeremy Corbyn is unelectable. The previous election in 2017 showed that Labour could make a very effective challenge to the Conservatives. For me, the problem is that the media seems to be ignoring all the good work realigning Labour back to it's core values and concentrating on the non-story about anti-Semitism. I have lot count of the number of times that Jeremy has had to explain the party's position whilst a number of politicians on the Right of the party try to sabotage his tenure simply because they are not genuine socialists.

The problem with your analysis is that Corbyn achieved the 2017 result on the strength of a Remain votes. Since then Remainers ( such as myself a Labour member, supporter and councillor) have decamped en masse in the direction of the Lib Dems. Brexit for many of us is the issue that counts most of all. If we can get Article 50 revoked then we can start worrying about what kind of Socialism we want.
 
For some reason that didn't print. : The problem with that analysis is that the 2017 result was achieved on the back of Remainer votes cast by people who though that Labour were a remain party. Since then about half of Corbyn's 40% has decamped to the Lib Dems or Greens. As a lifelong Labour supporter and councillor for 16 years I won't vote LD with great enthusiasm, but make no mistake I will be voting LD.
 
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I don't know what I'll vote for. I want to vote LD but I'm in the very marginal (30 votes) sholing constituency between labour and conservatives so I think I pretty much have to vote labour to stop the very pro Brexit conservative MP here.

Definitely wish I had AV or a proportional system right now.
 
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I don't know what I'll vote for. I want to vote LD but I'm in the very marginal (30 votes) sholing constituency between labour and conservatives so I think I pretty much have to vote labour to stop the very pro Brexit conservative MP here.

Definitely wish I had AV or a proportional system right now.

Basically, we should vote for any party trying to stop Brexit. I’m really hoping they can get together and avoid splitting the vote, so the “big 2” parties get the idea and Farage is annihilated ......
 
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I am staggered that you think Jeremy Corbyn is unelectable. The previous election in 2017 showed that Labour could make a very effective challenge to the Conservatives. For me, the problem is that the media seems to be ignoring all the good work realigning Labour back to it's core values and concentrating on the non-story about anti-Semitism. I have lot count of the number of times that Jeremy has had to explain the party's position whilst a number of politicians on the Right of the party try to sabotage his tenure simply because they are not genuine socialists.

It will be a tragedy if Corbyn does not get elected. Few politicians have had his integrity and strong moral compass, always fighting for the poor and those marginalised by society. I hope that Momentum ensure that those politicians who are not on board are deselected in the next general election. Either you are on the bus or your are not. We have the chance to rectify 40 years of disaster and I think most genuine Labour supporters appreciate that Jeremy will represent a sea-change for western politics.

I do not feel Boris Johnson will fair any better against the EU. Parliament will not allow a no deal Brexit to proceed and I feel it is obvious that we will have a general election in the autumn. No one forgives the Liberals for being liars and helping the Tories assist with austerity. They cannot be trusted. The only way out of the mess is with a Socialist government and I am almost inclined that we need one with a good majority in Parliament so as to wipe out any opposition so that the things that need to be implemented to sort out the morass that has accumulated since 1979 without opposition from parties whose interests have been unfairly protected since this time. For what it is worth, Momentum are currently campaigning to unseat Boris in his own constituency which is considered by Labour to be winnable. I think that Jeremy will prove many doubters wrong and with the energy of the people within the Socialist movement, I think that some serious wrongs will ultimately get righted with this countries first genuine socialist government. That said, a more demonstrative show of disapproval following the "coronation" of Boris would have been appreciated from Labour - I am not a fan of the SNP but Sturgeon always manages to come in with just the right and well judged sound bite.

I just think Corbyn has alienated too many people at this point. Remain and leave voters have no reason to vote for him, too many people have bought into the antisemitism/terrorist sympathiser sound bites.

I just cannot see him winning an election, though I personally do respect him and his views.

My own views (that society is best serverd byam Capitalism, tempered by socialist policies) isn't really represented by the extreme left/right politics divide we are starting to see.
 
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Cameron broke the Good Friday agreement as well by reuniting the Conservatives with the Ulster Unionists some time pre-2010. I believe the Unionist chose to split from the Conservatives again, and are not politically aligned at the moment, although the Conservatives still have the attachment "Unionist" on their party name.
That isn’t quite true Ides. Cameron had a pact with the Ulster Unionists but it wasn’t a merger, they just fielded joint candidates in one election. The pact more or less fell apart even before the 2010 election.

The Tories have always been called the Conservative and Unionist Party, which is odd considering they are hell-bent on actions which will most probably tear the UK apart.
 
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For some reason that didn't print. : The problem with that analysis is that the 2017 result was achieved on the back of Remainer votes cast by people who though that Labour were a remain party. Since then about half of Corbyn's 40% has decamped to the Lib Dems or Greens. As a lifelong Labour supporter and councillor for 16 years I won't vote LD with great enthusiasm, but make no mistake I will be voting LD.
You and me both F19. Unless and until Labour unequivocally supports Revoking Article 50, holding a second referendum and campaigning wholeheartedly for Remain my vote goes to the Lib Dem’s too. The LD’s and Greens between them crushed the Tories round here in the local council elections, so there is hope for the General Election, especially if a nationwide Remain Alliance can be put together.
 
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I agree vote Labour.
Why? Corbyn has been totally ineffectual the last couple of years, I don't truly know what he or the current Labour Party stands for. The Tories have been in freefall and he's been sitting on the side-lines knitting, as far as I can tell. He's no leader and we're in a time where we need strong, vocal, moral political leaders. Corbyn ain't it!

I'll either be voting Plaid Cymru or Greens at the next GE. My constituency will definitely be Labour (though the Brexit Party won more votes in the recent EU elections :() because it's an old mining area and people will vote as they have for decades. In fairness, our MP (the shadow Defence Sec) Nia Griffiths is pretty good but I despair of a Labour Govt almost as much as I do of a Tory one.
 
That isn’t quite true Ides. Cameron had a pact with the Ulster Unionists but it wasn’t a merger, they just fielded joint candidates in one election. The pact more or less fell apart even before the 2010 election.

The Tories have always been called the Conservative and Unionist Party, which is odd considering they are hell-bent on actions which will most probably tear the UK apart.

What is it with the UK Conservatives that they take actions that put people against people? It is as if it is a delierate ploy to play on people´s prejudices and fears when there aren´t any, provoke an opposition so the two sides clash, whilst the policy makers themselves continue quaffing the champagne and just pay lip service to the fears and worries of people who put them there. The old saying of "divide and rule," appears to be true regarding the governing UK Conservative and Unionist party.

Although my natural instinct is to vote for a party to remain in the EU, perhaps a minority Corbyn one that can be supported by the SNP, PC, the Lib Dems and the Greens, the Alliance and Independent in NI, might be the best solution to start healing the división sown by the Tories
 
I'm not missing the point , I'm saying your point is a logical fallacy.

The person in my example was in debt before the hypothetical recession. But you can't say the recession didn't cause his bankruptcy, Nor can you say his original debt didn't.

It's the same problem as our hospitals have. Treatments have progressed massively in recent times which means a lot more treatment and in this case medicine is needed which increases the load on our doctors and in this case manufacturers.

Reducing the number of doctors will create shortages in GP appointments, not make more appointments. and as your article points out better international intergration will reduce the medicine shortages. Reducing this as Brexit does, will only create shortages.

Saying that Brexit isn't causing shortages because there were already shortages is just plain wrong.

I referred to the post that mentioned the shortage of medicines and the fact it wasn’t just the UK suffering medicine shortages. I also mentioned that you cannot blame Brexit for that problem as it has been going on for a long while. Before the referendum in fact. I haven’t said Brexit won’t create shortages or any of the other stuff you mentioned. So yes you did miss my point deliberately.
 
You and me both F19. Unless and until Labour unequivocally supports Revoking Article 50, holding a second referendum and campaigning wholeheartedly for Remain my vote goes to the Lib Dem’s too. The LD’s and Greens between them crushed the Tories round here in the local council elections, so there is hope for the General Election, especially if a nationwide Remain Alliance can be put together.

Like you, I would love it if Labour threw their weight behind revoking article 50, but I would struggle to give my vote to the Lib Dems, simply because of the part they played in the coalition government, and the voting history of their new leader, who supported pretty much all the horrible **** the government foisted on the public.
 
Like you, I would love it if Labour threw their weight behind revoking article 50, but I would struggle to give my vote to the Lib Dems, simply because of the part they played in the coalition government, and the voting history of their new leader, who supported pretty much all the horrible **** the government foisted on the public.
Don’t get me wrong, my support for the Lib Dem’s is purely pragmatic, and only until Brexit is binned for good. Hopefully by then Labour have put their house in order and can command the mass support, especially among young voters, that they had in 2017.