Off Topic Politics Thread

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Imps is right about the ladder being kicked away..........
I have met a few self made millionaires. During discussions about how they become millionaires there was always something about getting the right break at the right time.
Then they go on to say what they did to enhance their profit........Then the surprises start to come in, how they pay their workforce (way below minimum) because people were so desperate for jobs. I could go on but we've all been there.
Now they are millionaires I asked did they remember what it was like not have money or a home? What it was like to have to walk to work because you didn't have the money for the bus fare in the pouring rain? or being in a super market buying food and you'd made a mistake in calculation and you were 2p short. Having to put something back or relying on a stranger standing in the queue to give you the money. (I did that for a lass just the other day at Sainsburys Hedge end) Do you know a couple of them said they wouldn't have helped them? Why says I? Because you are discouraging them from getting work.
Me being me couldn't resist.......What, advise them to apply for a job at your factory to be exploited by you instead? Needless to say I wasn't the most popular person in the group. Just for the record no Im not a millionaire it just happened I was helping my brothers company out at the time. The two guys in question left the table and have not spoken to me since. (obviously I've picked at the conversation as a whole there was a lot more bragging going on but I won't bore you with that.......)

Edit.....My wife read this over my shoulder and asked me to say this conversation wasn't in this country.
 
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fatletiss said:
Anyone see Billy Connolly on Thursday night? His very last sentence was something to the words of:

“People need to stop fearing a foreigner and religions just need to settle themselves down a bit.”

Wise words.
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We've arrived on the nuthouse when we rely on a geriatric comedian to offer us words of wisdom. Not criticising Billy, you understand. I love the guy. But it's a shame some of our political classes don't give such clear messages.
 
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Missing Lambo said:
Brilliant summary! Exactly this. Social mobility is becoming a mythological animal. The classic Marxist analysis was always that a few of the proles would be allowed to advance in order that the rest would think that the system is fair but they lack the gumption to make it work for them.

So have you become a multi-millionaire? If so, will you continue to post? <laugh>
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No, I ended up $120 up. Got knocked out in about 60th place.
 
Missing Lambo said:
Brilliant summary! Exactly this. Social mobility is becoming a mythological animal. The classic Marxist analysis was always that a few of the proles would be allowed to advance in order that the rest would think that the system is fair but they lack the gumption to make it work for them.

So have you become a multi-millionaire? If so, will you continue to post? <laugh>
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Disagree entirely, the entire point of capitalism is to reward those that add value to society.

Those that earn the most are those that have started businesses and provide jobs for other people. I don’t really believe in a massive conspiracy to stop people progressing. If you came up with an incredible business idea tomorrow, you could join the elite class within a few years

I will say that there is a horrible trend of companies cutting employee benefits etc. though, which I hate. It seems in the old days everything from holidays, to pensions were much better.
 
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The only thing I would say to that Osvaldo....is that not all are lucky enough to be able to go to university.......and even if they have done that they are not always able to get the job they want. Circumstances play a huge part. I would suggest most want to be of Value to their family etc and are not necessarily wanting to join any Class as you put it. They just want to be happy and see that they provide for their family and for their future. Trouble is with a lot of companies they are competing with countries that do not pay a decent living wage. That is why we lose a lot of our manufacturing simply because in their eyes they can make a bigger profit. Mind you some manufacturers have found ways around this and do stay.
 
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Beddytare said:
The only thing I would say to that Osvaldo....is that not all are lucky enough to be able to go to university.......and even if they have done that they are not always able to get the job they want. Circumstances play a huge part. I would suggest most want to be of Value to their family etc and are not necessarily wanting to join any Class as you put it. They just want to be happy and see that they provide for their family and for their future. Trouble is with a lot of companies they are competing with countries that do not pay a decent living wage. That is why we lose a lot of our manufacturing simply because in their eyes they can make a bigger profit. Mind you some manufacturers have found ways around this and do stay.
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I agree there 100%, the system is far from perfect, but it’s the only one which is proven to work.

I just think a lot of people in this country don’t realise how good and lucky they are.

I work with a guy from Venezuela, and some of the stories he has about his country, with the hyperinflation there etc. would be enough to stop anyone voting for Brexit and upsetting the status quo. (I’m not saying hyperinflation will happen here, but upsetting our economy this much - who knows what’s could happen?)
 
Osvaldorama said:
Disagree entirely, the entire point of capitalism is to reward those that add value to society.

Those that earn the most are those that have started businesses and provide jobs for other people. I don’t really believe in a massive conspiracy to stop people progressing. If you came up with an incredible business idea tomorrow, you could join the elite class within a few years

I will say that there is a horrible trend of companies cutting employee benefits etc. though, which I hate. It seems in the old days everything from holidays, to pensions were much better.
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So Public Service workers who teach the next generation, put out fires, treat us when we're ill etc etc deserve sod all? Society needs a range of tasks. It is not all about business start ups, much though I admire those who do.

For me, the point of capitalism is that it requires money to circulate. Inequality leads to hording of resources by a few and so the system starts to grind to a halt.
 
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Missing Lambo said:
So Public Service workers who teach the next generation, put out fires, treat us when we're ill etc etc deserve sod all? Society needs a range of tasks. It is not all about business start ups, much though I admire those who do.

For me, the point of capitalism is that it requires money to circulate. Inequality leads to hording of resources by a few and so the system starts to grind to a halt.
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I agree. You need capitalism to create the cash and then you need governments able and willing to spread that cash.

I run a business and I'm happy to pay tax. There are a few of us about.

Vin
 
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And on the subject of small business, this is what the threat of Crash Brexit* is doing to one small business. And he's received abuse for daring to discuss his preparations for Crash Brexit.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ness-bankrupter-small-firms-brace-for-no-deal

Vin

*so named because it appears that many members of the public, when asked, think "No Deal" means no change from the current situation, so let's call it something that describes it properly and unequivocally
 
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Missing Lambo said:
So Public Service workers who teach the next generation, put out fires, treat us when we're ill etc etc deserve sod all? Society needs a range of tasks. It is not all about business start ups, much though I admire those who do.

For me, the point of capitalism is that it requires money to circulate. Inequality leads to hording of resources by a few and so the system starts to grind to a halt.
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If it's hoarded then it's put in a bank and loaned out to people starting businesses. Interest is paid on the loan then paid back as interest to the people who put money in the bank. Both the startup and the people at the top make a lot of money.

This is the original and main purpose of banks.

Businesses and people at the top fear money sitting around doing nothing. Most of the time they'll just invest it directly themselves as they have the experience to do so.
 
VocalMinority said:
If it's hoarded then it's put in a bank and loaned out to people starting businesses. Interest is paid on the loan then paid back as interest to the people who put money in the bank. Both the startup and the people at the top make a lot of money.

This is the original and main purpose of banks.

Businesses and people at the top fear money sitting around doing nothing. Most of the time they'll just invest it directly themselves as they have the experience to do so.
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Or put in a bank and loaned back to governments who are having to pay tax credits because the money they just got loaned should really have been paid to employees by the employer......and incurred NI.tax employer/employee contributions as well.
 
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