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Kevin Francis said:
Just a quick point...... Why does this tragic event (and I do honestly have the deepest sympathy) have the god given right to more coverage than any other miscarage of justice?
That been my whole argument all along. Many worse things have happened in the 23 years that followed this, worse tradgedies, worse injustices. I honestly don't understand why this has peoples attention. It smacks of the type of weirdo's who go lay flowers at the side of a road when they have no connection to the victim just in the hope of getting on TV or the paper.
A verdict has been reached, why can't people just leave it be now.
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I don't quite get why its bothering you and some others ,
for 23 years families of those that died and those stood amongst them in those terraces have been calling for a rightful acknowledgement of their innocence .Why should they be doing this quietly ??? This weeks news absolutely makes it right that those fighting for justice were right to be so vocal.

I know if i was in an adjacent terrace (let alone a family member of the victims) i would be fighting to just clear my own name from what the media wrongly reported was going on amongst the fans.

The Birmingham six , Guilford four and the "bloody sunday events" also received extensive coverage in the media long after the events so its not exactly fair to single Hillsborough out .
 
if i hear this chant sung by a solitary young 'un wearing a Macintosh, not only a computer by the way and Burberry keks, whilst carrying a flask and eating a large chunky kit kat, I ll just assume that this worldly wide wise youth is just dazed and confused - I thank you. Remember Arthur Askey?
 
I understand both sides of this debate.
Yes it is right to support the families and friends affected by Hillsborough. It is right to condem the police and the state for the cover up. If Hull City supporters want to show their support, they should.

The one thing that has to be remembered is that this tragic event led to drastic changes in the way we watch football and in many ways has been part of the Health & Safety drive that we all now have affect us. The events that day changed society and yet key participants to the inquiry lied.

Lessons where learnt from Hillsborough, but one of the main effects, is/was an eroding of the trust that the public had with the Police. If they have lied about Hillsborough, what else. Look at the way that even 9/11 and 7/7 are portrayed by some groups who state that the governments us/uk have covered up or even manufactured the evidence so that it points to terrorists. Now they can point to Hillsborough and say look they lied about their own, so why believe what they say about our people.

The government and the Police, need to demonstrate that what happened then does not happen now. Newspapers like the Sun need to start reporting just the truth and not what they can make up to sell more copies. The Leverson enquiry has shown just how low the press stoop to get a story. Reform is vital. The apparatus of the state, how the police are scrutinised and how the media operate, has to be open. No one should fear the truth.

Will I sing, I don't know, but one thing is for sure, this weekend, every adult football fan in every stadium will at least remember what happened and that really is a tribute to those who lost their lives or where injuried on that day.
 
Mel U said:
I understand both sides of this debate.
Yes it is right to support the families and friends affected by Hillsborough. It is right to condem the police and the state for the cover up. If Hull City supporters want to show their support, they should.

The one thing that has to be remembered is that this tragic event led to drastic changes in the way we watch football and in many ways has been part of the Health & Safety drive that we all now have affect us. The events that day changed society and yet key participants to the inquiry lied.

Lessons where learnt from Hillsborough, but one of the main effects, is/was an eroding of the trust that the public had with the Police. If they have lied about Hillsborough, what else. Look at the way that even 9/11 and 7/7 are portrayed by some groups who state that the governments us/uk have covered up or even manufactured the evidence so that it points to terrorists. Now they can point to Hillsborough and say look they lied about their own, so why believe what they say about our people.

The government and the Police, need to demonstrate that what happened then does not happen now. Newspapers like the Sun need to start reporting just the truth and not what they can make up to sell more copies. The Leverson enquiry has shown just how low the press stoop to get a story. Reform is vital. The apparatus of the state, how the police are scrutinised and how the media operate, has to be open. No one should fear the truth.

Will I sing, I don't know, but one thing is for sure, this weekend, every adult football fan in every stadium will at least remember what happened and that really is a tribute to those who lost their lives or where injuried on that day.
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Bradford vs Lincoln was the event that initiated the change to stadia some time earlier. RIP those who died at Valley Parade
 
doveston said:
be honest with yourself.
you couldnt actually give one flying fook about hillsbourgh
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Hillsborough may have happened 2 years before I was born, but the fact 96 football fans, football supporters just like myself, didn't make it home that afternoon strikes a chord with me as it probably does countless other football fans. You only have to look at the comments on the Hillsborough thread to see how much people care about this and how strong their opinions are. If the song was to be sung, it should stay in Liverpool, these type of things should be left to the club affected. At least the families have justice now for those that lost their lives.
 
It seems to me that 2 linked but subtley different things are being debated here. The deaths of 96 football fans at Hillsborough was a shocking and tragic event which is annually marked and should always be remembered by football fans, along with others such as the Bradford fire. However, nothing that has come out this week has changed that fact or altered the need to remember and mourn those lost. What has been revealed this week is bigger than football and not really about it. Therefore, while being a personal decision, I do not see the need for football fans specifically to make a statement, as citizens we should be shocked, angry and concerned by the findings of this report, but as football fans little has changed since the last time we filed through the turnstiles.

It is a real shame that the public perception of all football fans in 1989 was sufficiently bad that they were able to accept the story put forward by the police so readily and that the dissenting voices from Liverpool and elsewhere were so easily dismissed by many. The search for justice must continue, but for me, it is no longer about football. It is about widespread corruption and conspiracy that must be fully exposed for the good of the soul of the nation. Good luck.
 
Any attempt to organise football supporters from opposing clubs to unify and do anything for a common cause is a waste of time.

You only have to read the comments on this thread to see that many can't get their heads out of tribal mode for long enough to evaluate any issue.
Some don't have the ability to understand that just because other events were also tragic it doesn't mean this one is any less so.

If this thing goes ahead on Saturday there will be so many lobotomised morons singing anti-Liverpool songs or aggressive chants, that the whole thing will become an act of disrespect for the dead rather than the opposite.
The OP's intentions are good, but he needs to recognise that football supporters don't express public outrage well (unless it involves Jimmy Bullard).
 
Craig in Nottingham said:
Any attempt to organise football supporters from opposing clubs to unify and do anything for a common cause is a waste of time.

You only have to read the comments on this thread to see that many can't get their heads out of tribal mode for long enough to evaluate any issue.
Some don't have the ability to understand that just because other events were also tragic it doesn't mean this one is any less so.

If this thing goes ahead on Saturday there will be so many lobotomised morons singing anti-Liverpool songs or aggressive chants, that the whole thing will become an act of disrespect for the dead rather than the opposite.
The OP's intentions are good, but he needs to recognise that football supporters don't express public outrage well (unless it involves Jimmy Bullard).
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I'm not anti Liverpool. I just think their families have got the closure they want and can now move on as should everyone else. If they want to mourn their loved ones still then they can do so. Hopefully in private and away from the cameras.

There's no guilt trip needed- i'm very sad about the passing of 96 fans that day (i was one and a half btw, so i don't remember it). But the ones not directly affected can't keep wallowing in self pity.

Btw it was the memorial to 9/11 this week, wasn't it? Surely an even bigger event that shaped the world we live than this.
 
Isn't it Liverpool fans who sing whose that laying on the runway , whose that dying in the snow, while pretending to be airoplanes when ever they play Man Utd ?

**** em..
 
I can't open the link but I take it someone has had the idea of fans up and down the country singing ' you'll never walk alone' on Saturday?

Am I right?
 
I'm glad the truth has finally come out, the families deserved to hear it, but it's their business now.

There's no need for us to be singing You'll Never Walk Alone, or praying for Muamba, or doing it for Rambo.
 
Probably when people stopped buy scarves and started wearing shirts instead. Always looked good with a sea of black and amber swaying back and forth, not a bad song either really always got us going
 
dazednconfuzed said:
for me its a none football thing ... its a disgraceful injustice that has come out , as I said from the outset this is not about football .. I remember seeing those scenes as a 10 year old wondering what the **** was going on .. this is simply showing those that fought for so long about what they believe in that people support them now and feel for the heartache and pain they have all gone through .. but I wouldn't expect you would understand that
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agree, its not about liverpool, or even football its a human issue..
people in massively high profile positions, went to unbelievable lengths to protect themsleves and there pensions, rather then doing right by the people they where supposed to protect, even non football fans have to be outraged by it, it could have been any club that day and whos to say similar cover ups wont happen again in another situation, football or non football..
no surprise theres still plenty of dickheads around who cant help themselves unfortunately...
 
scarborough tiger said:
Isn't it Liverpool fans who sing whose that laying on the runway , whose that dying in the snow, while pretending to be airoplanes when ever they play Man Utd ?

**** em..
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I dont really like Liverpool or Man Utd but this is why I am not bothered.... they both behave like animals so as you say... **** em.
 
As much as I hate Scousers and their whining, world-owes-us-a-favour ways, I do have sympathy for the supporters of Liverpool FC - especially those who lost family and friends at Hillsborough. I can't think of a worse way to day than being slowly crushed to death, unable to breathe.

However, I shall not be joining in with these chants. I am a fan of Hull City, not Liverpool FC.
 
Erik said:
As much as I hate Scousers and their whining, world-owes-us-a-favour ways, I do have sympathy for the supporters of Liverpool FC - especially those who lost family and friends at Hillsborough. I can't think of a worse way to day than being slowly crushed to death, unable to breathe.

However, I shall not be joining in with these chants. I am a fan of Hull City, not Liverpool FC.
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This
 
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