Off Topic Paris Attacks !

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This is exactly the point. Tobes, or anyone else for that matter, has the right to express that there is a ****ing obvious link between a warped, twisted form of Islam and the current wave of terrorism/ISIS/whatever, just as that Westborough Chapel (sp) in the US is a mutated version of Christianity; or if you take political doctrines such as communism or fascism to their (inevitable?) extremes, people, especially disaffected youth, are liable to embrace an extreme but simple solution to life's complexities and society's evident unfairness.

The other Sunday morning I caught the back of one of these panel discussions. An Asian guy on there who is a youth leader from ( I think) Leicester was saying how he believed the Asian youths travelling to Syria were simply 'Punks', as in the old 70's, anti-establishment nihilism sort, of the type western culture have been throwing up since the 50's. Rebels without a cause who find one waiting for them, so to speak. The same way many of us embraced The Socialist Worker Party or David Bowie as an answer to it all in the fifth form. Only difference being, as he stated, once you enter this club (especially if you go to Syria) there's no turning back - there's no man-looked-at-pig and pig-looked-at-man moment that most of us old lefties had with communism, or indeed the moment of clarity that Malcolm X had with Islam when he realised faith was/should be inclusive and about love and not hate.

We all try to make sense out of this crazy existence, and youth will always embrace the easiest answer. A bit like any offer that someone tries to sell to you - if it seems too good/easy to be true, then it probably is. The crime for any of these snake-oil salesmen and their magic panaceas, be them radical preacher's or political agitators in the BNP/UKIP/Anarchists is that we don't protect our young people the same way as we would if they were being sold a dodgy holiday insurance package.
Spot on mate.

For merely having the temerity to state that obvious and undeniable link I've been branded a bigot and a racist by a couple of bone heads on this thread <doh>
 
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You and I can see it from our point of view. They can see it from theirs. Every hijab wearing woman I've spoken to has said tgey feel liberated by it. That they feel judged by their actions and intelligence rather than by their looks, appearance or gender. That's their reasoning and if they feel empowered by it so be it.

Btw I'm not an advocate of either but I find the hijab much more acceptable visually than the burka fwiw.

I would agree about the hijab. It at least allows for the persons individuallity. A burka hides that.

I know a Muslim woman who never wore hers (burka) until a male Muslim started working in our office. It may be that she had made the decision on her own or that she felt obliged to due to the male Muslim.

I feel she was pressured, subconsciously at least, to conform in the company of a Muslim male.
 
A seminarian. had he stayed with them he'd have been a priest in Georgia, sadly for several million people the **** didn't.

Should I insult you now because you were not quite historically accurate there? :bandit:

If you wish. It will give me the opportunity to compare it with some posters getting World Wars, monarchs, centuries, Boeing airliners, , US presidents (list continues for several pages) mixed up.
 
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If you wish. It will give me the opportunity to compare it with some posters getting World Wars, monarchs, centuries, Boeing airliners, , US presidents (list continues for several pages) mixed up.

You said Bush was in the pacific when Nixon has recruited, he was in the united states. I proved it and you were actually wrong, yet here you are repeating the same ****.

Of course that small point didn't alter the underlying context of the whole debate, that the Buish family are behind a lot of ****.

People like you, not intersted but looking to flex your imagined knowledge and seemingly dissonant reaction to opposing views which is why you made it personal right at the beginning because I wouldn't agree

People like you look for one mistake, or error and essentially use that as cause to claim the whole thng is untrue. You then treat any mistake in views you don't like as "agenda" or some other such bollocks. I am not reading from a webpage when I ramble, you are when trolling me, to make you look like you know **** <doh>

Here's the kicker though, this is how ******ed you are.

It is a fact, shown all over the world, that the plane that hit the south tower came out the other side, on all angles on all footage showing the crash from the side.

So, you believe your eyes when you see an aluminun plane that will be destroyed if it just falls of of it's undercarriage on the runway, cut a roadrunner shaped hole in reinforced steel, but when that plane appears out of the other side of the building and leaves no hole, you no longer believe the footage.

All you ******s won't explain that.. cos the only answer is the footage is fake.

That's how self deluded you are

All of the people who reported a AA pasenger plane on 9\11 on that day on the media were media people.
ALL, I can list them and their employers

Most of the public were saying for the first hit, small windowless passenger plane or missile. Fact
 
Here's the kicker though, this is how ******ed you are.

It is a fact, shown all over the world, that the plane that hit the south tower came out the othe side, on all angles on all footage showing the crash from the side.

So, you believe your eyes when you see an aluminun plane that will be destroyed if it just falls of of it's undercarriage on the runway, cut a roadrunner shaped hole in reinforced steel, but when that plane appears out of the other side of the building and leaves no hole, you no longer believe the footage.

That's how self deluded you are

http://www.urban75.org/info/conspiraloons.html

Dem holograms...

<laugh>
 
"Most of the public were saying for the first hit, small windowless passenger plane or missile. Fact
"

Of course this is backed by actual eidence, the kid of stuff you debunkers don't like. The flight recorded data. 500 knotts is impossible for that AA plane even dive speed is not near that. The last passenger plane to dive from altitute travelling at 500 knotts to sea level broke up. The Egyptian airways plane.
The pilot put it into a dive and it broke apart when it hit thicker air.

Wintness accounts, many, North Tower and South Tower "small passenger plane" "small windowless plane" "Missile".


it seems we have differing accounts here. But... I know it's crazy taking eye witness accounts and trying to match something to those accounts, like police do, ridiculous, no I don't think I am a cop <laugh>
Air to Surface JASSM 158 can certainly appear as all three accounts.
You must log in or register to see images


Again Yawn!! not proof, but this matches descriptions from many eyewitnesses as in the actual media coverage of that day. But beause you guys believe the official account it means I am crazy <laugh>
 
Just saw this on another thread. Horrific.
 

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Tobes tell me, given you seen footage of a plane hitting the building and therefor you do not even, as admitted by yourself, need to know the official account. Ironically you don't believe the bit of footage that shows the plane passing through

Tell me what purpose there is in me even reading what you have to say given you have stated that nothing would ever change your mind because you "seen it with your own eyes", a meaningless comment as you seen it on a screen after it actually happened on a third or fourth hand news feed.

So why would I bother, none of you have answered why the plane came out the other side and left no hole, yet left a roadrunner hole on other side.

if you have an answer for that I am all ears.
 
"Most of the public were saying for the first hit, small windowless passenger plane or missile. Fact
"

Of course this is backed by actual eidence, the kid of stuff you debunkers don't like. The flight recorded data. 500 knotts is impossible for that AA plane even dive speed is not near that. The last passenger plane to dive from altitute travelling at 500 knotts to sea level broke up. The Egyptian airways plane.
The pilot put it into a dive and it broke apart when it hit thicker air.

Wintness accounts, many, North Tower and South Tower "small passenger plane" "small windowless plane" "Missile".


it seems we have differing accounts here. But... I know it's crazy taking eye witness accounts and trying to match something to those accounts, like police do, ridiculous, no I don't think I am a cop <laugh>
Air to Surface JASSM 158 can certainly appear as all three accounts.
You must log in or register to see images


Again Yawn!! not proof, but this matches descriptions from many eyewitnesses as in the actual media coverage of that day. But beause you guys believe the official account it means I am crazy <laugh>
https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-the-role-of-aeroelastic-flutter-in-the-events-of-9-11.t3359/

You're welcome.
 
This is exactly the point. Tobes, or anyone else for that matter, has the right to express that there is a ****ing obvious link between a warped, twisted form of Islam and the current wave of terrorism/ISIS/whatever, just as that Westborough Chapel (sp) in the US is a mutated version of Christianity; or if you take political doctrines such as communism or fascism to their (inevitable?) extremes, people, especially disaffected youth, are liable to embrace an extreme but simple solution to life's complexities and society's evident unfairness.

The other Sunday morning I caught the back of one of these panel discussions. An Asian guy on there who is a youth leader from ( I think) Leicester was saying how he believed the Asian youths travelling to Syria were simply 'Punks', as in the old 70's, anti-establishment nihilism sort, of the type western culture have been throwing up since the 50's. Rebels without a cause who find one waiting for them, so to speak. The same way many of us embraced The Socialist Worker Party or David Bowie as an answer to it all in the fifth form. Only difference being, as he stated, once you enter this club (especially if you go to Syria) there's no turning back - there's no man-looked-at-pig and pig-looked-at-man moment that most of us old lefties had with communism, or indeed the moment of clarity that Malcolm X had with Islam when he realised faith was/should be inclusive and about love and not hate.

We all try to make sense out of this crazy existence, and youth will always embrace the easiest answer. A bit like any offer that someone tries to sell to you - if it seems too good/easy to be true, then it probably is. The crime for any of these snake-oil salesmen and their magic panaceas, be them radical preacher's or political agitators in the BNP/UKIP/Anarchists is that we don't protect our young people the same way as we would if they were being sold a dodgy holiday insurance package.

That's pretty much spot on, IMO.

Groups like ISIS know this and deliberately court the naive and disaffected through social media.

As was said, this one is a one way ticket though. This isn't some youthful phase you can go through and forget about later, this is real people dying. Real people being needlessly slaughtered.

It makes me sick watching murderous scum like ISIS spread their hateful bile around the world.
 
They are a criminal network pure and simple. The minute you feel the need to associate them with any innocent group of people then you're already creating a them and us situation and alienating people unfairly. What the fck is an average muslim living in his home raising his family going to do to hunt down these terrorists ffs. All they can do is the same as the rest of us, try to educate their kids the best they can. And if they feel aggrieved about something, feel comfortable enough to discuss how to tackle it within the democratic process they live in and the freedoms they enjoy. Simples.
I loved them when Sutch was still around. I voted for them in the late '80's as one of their cornerstone policies was that, if elected, they would launch an immediate investigation into why there was only one Monopolies Commission <laugh>

Remember reading somewhere policy's that were first suggested by the raving looney party and have now been adopted by the other parties. Can't be arsed to google it but things like pedestirising town centres were policy's of there's.
 
Maybe agree to disagree fellas.

132 people so far confirmed dead.


I just cant make sense of this whole attack. It;s ****ng insanity. You have to be certifiable to do such a thing first and foremost, **** religion, what goes on in a mind willing to do such a thing.
 
"Most of the public were saying for the first hit, small windowless passenger plane or missile. Fact
"

Of course this is backed by actual eidence, the kid of stuff you debunkers don't like. The flight recorded data. 500 knotts is impossible for that AA plane even dive speed is not near that. The last passenger plane to dive from altitute travelling at 500 knotts to sea level broke up. The Egyptian airways plane.
The pilot put it into a dive and it broke apart when it hit thicker air.

Wintness accounts, many, North Tower and South Tower "small passenger plane" "small windowless plane" "Missile".


it seems we have differing accounts here. But... I know it's crazy taking eye witness accounts and trying to match something to those accounts, like police do, ridiculous, no I don't think I am a cop <laugh>
Air to Surface JASSM 158 can certainly appear as all three accounts.
You must log in or register to see images


Again Yawn!! not proof, but this matches descriptions from many eyewitnesses as in the actual media coverage of that day. But beause you guys believe the official account it means I am crazy <laugh>
I've just suggested you all agree to disagree but this is just daft BBF. Do you think all the people I know who were there that day and saw the planes hit the tower are complicit to the conspiracy? All the families of the people on board the planes are in on it too or at least haven't tried to expose the truth? All the rescue workers, the people who cleared up the debris, the doctors and nurses, the government staff who, to a man and woman, haven't come forward and exposed the conspiracy? It's banana mad stuff fella.
 
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Tobes tell me, given you seen footage of a plane hitting the building and therefor you do not even, as admitted by yourself, need to know the official account. Ironically you don't believe the bit of footage that shows the plane passing through

Tell me what purpose there is in me even reading what you have to say given you have stated that nothing would ever change your mind because you "seen it with your own eyes", a meaningless comment as you seen it on a screen after it actually happened on a third or fourth hand news feed.

So why would I bother, none of you have answered why the plane came out the other side and left no hole, yet left a roadrunner hole on other side.

if you have an answer for that I am all ears.
You're a ****ing idiot, I can't be arsed

http://www.urban75.org/info/conspiraloons.html
 
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I've just suggested you all agree to disagree but this is just daft BBF. Do you think all the people I know who were there that day and saw the planes hit the tower are complicit to the conspiracy? All the families of the people on board the planes are in on it too or at least haven't tried to expose the truth? All the rescue workers, the people who cleared up the debris, the doctors and nurses, the government staff who, to a man and woman, haven't come forward and exposed the conspiracy? It's banana mad stuff fella.

Firstly too slow, I had already dropped it.

The first responders were victims too, Silverstein knew damned well that those buildings were full of asbestos that was due to be removed at the cost of millions. over 50 different types of cancers. ****ing tragic.

yeah ok, you know people who saw the planes, there is a million new yorkers who saw the planes now, but only a handful on the day. Spare me the mythology mate. All the witness during the event about passenger planes were media employees.

Now everyone "saw the planes" yet even you cannot explain why it passes through and leaves no hole?

No one can, and you, using shame and emotion argument. :D

Lets leave it at that shall we
 
You're a ****ing idiot, I can't be arsed

http://www.urban75.org/info/conspiraloons.html


How many times have I asked you one simple question, you reply with a link without ever answering that question.

Why does the plane pass through the building and pop out the other side and leave no hole.?

because no one can answer that and then laugh at me, it is not beng relentless to ask the question? We are talking in your eyes recorded history cos you say the video is legit, so if you say it is legit, then explain the bit you are avoiding explaining.

hardly relentless, just answer the bloody question and it wont be asked. Maybe you know somethin I dont?