Ot f1

joeisonfire

joeisonfire

Well-Known Member
Jan 25, 2011
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Sunderland
Any fans out there like me becoming bored with the Vettel dominance? Lap 4 I turned it off yest as I knew he would win and I don't like watching week in week out a battle for 2nd 3rd and 4th etc.

Looking forward to the changes next year hoping it makes it more competitive
 
I used to watch regularly and still like F1 but Vettel + Red Bull are just too far ahead to make it interesting.

I recall watching the start of a race on my lunch break that Hamilton starting on pole. Vettel got by him on the first corner and I thought to myself 'oh well, race over'. Checked the sports news few hours later and I was right.

I do think Kimmi Raikonnen and Fernando Alonso are better drivers than Vettell though and If Kimmi had a top car he'd win the championship imo.
 
For those of us without Sky it is easy to get out of the habit of watching - the money men at F1 care nothing about this though. Like Parker as soon as Vettel takes the lead I find something better to do as the result is then a foregone conclusion. I fear that this may be the case for a couple more years yet given that he is head and shoulders above the rest at the present time. By then it is entirely possible that I will have stopped watching all together and I don't think I'll be the only one.
 
F1 would be excellent to watch if every car engine was identical and the downforce etc. IOt would then be truly about who is the best driver and not who has the best car. I don;t mind Vettell winning all the time but he has a better car than everyone else so what do we expect. It'd be like me driving my Toyota Corolla 1.4 against a Golf GTI - I may win 1 due to the other person having a fault wityh their car but I certainly won't win many others
 
Parkersafc V.2.0 said:
I used to watch regularly and still like F1 but Vettel + Red Bull are just too far ahead to make it interesting.

I recall watching the start of a race on my lunch break that Hamilton starting on pole. Vettel got by him on the first corner and I thought to myself 'oh well, race over'. Checked the sports news few hours later and I was right.

I do think Kimmi Raikonnen and Fernando Alonso are better drivers than Vettell though and If Kimmi had a top car he'd win the championship imo.
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If Kimi joined Red Bull, I'd put my house on it that he wouldn't make his car better than Seb's RB9, but I guess we'll never find out now!

Next year sees an introduction of the 1.6 Turbo engines produced by Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault so every team will have one of the three. Obviously McLaren and Mercedes will have a Merc engine and the Ferrari will have a Ferrari engine, but it's the Renault engine for the Red Bull and Toro Rosso. Red Bull reckon the Mercedes engine will dominate, but I still fancy Vettel to go on and win the Championship, because in my opinion he has an advantage of understanding his car, it's what set him aside from Webber. He'll work with team RB to make his car aerodynamically the best, just like he has done with the V8 Red Bulls. We could be looking at the greatest driver since Senna or maybe of all time, who knows? The guy's attention to detail makes him unstoppable at the minute for me, I think too many people liken him to Button in the Brawn as having an unfair advantage but he's helped develop that machine that he wins races in so massive credit is due and I think it's up to the drivers, not the sport's regulators to close the gap.
 
Its become almost as boring as watching schumacer in his hayday, dont even make a point of watching anymore
 
It might be boring at the moment but F1 dominance seems to run in cycles.
Only 5-6 years ago Red Bull were really struggling and Ferrari, Mclaren and even Sauber & Renault were fighting it out for the podiums.
A few years before that Schumacher was winning 5 WDCs in a row.
Back in the 90s Williams were dominating everything and look where they are now. Even Mclaren have been slowly slipping down the order over the last few years.

It's just a pity that we are waiting for a rule change and hoping that Red Bull find the move to 1.6 litre turbos more difficult than the rest in order to make the "sport" more exciting again.

That said, much of Vettel's dominance comes from what Red Bull are doing with their exhausts compared to the other teams and that advantage will disappear next season so they will need to find something else to keep them ahead.
 
TankMarvin said:
It might be boring at the moment but F1 dominance seems to run in cycles.
Only 5-6 years ago Red Bull were really struggling and Ferrari, Mclaren and even Sauber & Renault were fighting it out for the podiums.
A few years before that Schumacher was winning 5 WDCs in a row.
Back in the 90s Williams were dominating everything and look where they are now. Even Mclaren have been slowly slipping down the order over the last few years.

It's just a pity that we are waiting for a rule change and hoping that Red Bull find the move to 1.6 litre turbos more difficult than the rest in order to make the "sport" more exciting again.

That said, much of Vettel's dominance comes from what Red Bull are doing with their exhausts compared to the other teams and that advantage will disappear next season so they will need to find something else to keep them ahead.
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Yeh they arent allowed to use the exhaust for aerodynamics are they, so the exhaust tail has to point up slightly to prevent this.

No doubt about it, Vettel is a class driver but his RB isjust to far ahead. 2-3 seconds ahead after a couple of laps is unreal.

Really am looking forward to the rule change though, I think Brawn leaving Mercedes will be massive as his experience is unreal.
 
joeisonfire said:
Yeh they arent allowed to use the exhaust for aerodynamics are they, so the exhaust tail has to point up slightly to prevent this.
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Next year the exhaust will exit at the back of the car in the middle, under the rear wing rather than on the top/back of the side pods.
This means they can't direct to exhaust gases around the rear of the car to produce extra downforce.
 
TankMarvin said:
Next year the exhaust will exit at the back of the car in the middle, under the rear wing rather than on the top/back of the side pods.
This means they can't direct to exhaust gases around the rear of the car to produce extra downforce.
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Also restricted to 100 litres of fuel. So possibly could be some early retirements
 
The most mundane sport in the world today imo.

I'd rather watch MMA, and i ain't a big fan of that either.
 
XXX litres of fuel on it's own would be a good restriction.
Then the teams could be free to do whatever they liked with the powertrain (number of cylinders, turbos, KERS/HERS, etc), but as an extra restriction on top of a stack of other rules I do think it's going to provide the team with a chance to do anything different or surprising (apart from run out of fuel before the end).

It's basically just the FIA trying to ram "look at F1's green credentials" down our throats but forgetting that it's motor racing....
 
Totally tedious at the moment. Even within Red Bull Vettel appears to have a better car, so what's the point of it?
 
Sidthemackem said:
Totally tedious at the moment. Even within Red Bull Vettel appears to have a better car, so what's the point of it?
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It's not like a game of scalectrix, that's for certain, also there is nee crashes, and nee more ' oh oh me hairs on fire' ,and all that...
 
Typical_Terry said:
If Kimi joined Red Bull, I'd put my house on it that he wouldn't make his car better than Seb's RB9, but I guess we'll never find out now!

Next year sees an introduction of the 1.6 Turbo engines produced by Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault so every team will have one of the three. Obviously McLaren and Mercedes will have a Merc engine and the Ferrari will have a Ferrari engine, but it's the Renault engine for the Red Bull and Toro Rosso. Red Bull reckon the Mercedes engine will dominate, but I still fancy Vettel to go on and win the Championship, because in my opinion he has an advantage of understanding his car, it's what set him aside from Webber. He'll work with team RB to make his car aerodynamically the best, just like he has done with the V8 Red Bulls. We could be looking at the greatest driver since Senna or maybe of all time, who knows? The guy's attention to detail makes him unstoppable at the minute for me, I think too many people liken him to Button in the Brawn as having an unfair advantage but he's helped develop that machine that he wins races in so massive credit is due and I think it's up to the drivers, not the sport's regulators to close the gap.
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Vettel is in no way the best driver, it is all down to the car.
He is nothing more than a pilot guiding a mobile computer.
What sets him aside from Webber is the team orders and tactics.

Although not definitive the Top Gear test track and them all using the same car should be informative.
The information that came from it was that Webber was a just under a second faster than Vettel.
And Hamilton was over a second faster than Vettel.

If we want F1 back, the way to do it is remove the computers and leave the decision making up to the drivers like it used to be.

By the way aren't McLaren going with Honda for 2015 and not Mercedes?
 
MackemsRule said:
Vettel is in no way the best driver, it is all down to the car.
He is nothing more than a pilot guiding a mobile computer.
What sets him aside from Webber is the team orders and tactics.

Although not definitive the Top Gear test track and them all using the same car should be informative.
The information that came from it was that Webber was a just under a second faster than Vettel.
And Hamilton was over a second faster than Vettel.

If we want F1 back, the way to do it is remove the computers and leave the decision making up to the drivers like it used to be.

By the way aren't McLaren going with Honda for 2015 and not Mercedes?
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There seems to be a bit of a dislike for Vettel for some reason amongst F1 fans, I absolutely rate the guy and he's a really nice bloke too by all accounts. I don't get how he's being made out to be this sack of skin that's behind the wheel of a super car that wipes out the competition. If you do enough research you'll find a billion and one quotes from Adrian Newey singing the praises of Vettel. He gives the technical team so much feedback that they can make minor changes to his car to improve it's performance. Webber didn't have anything like the understanding of the Red Bull car like Vettel does, it's not favouritism, he just gets the very best out of that machine because he knows how it behaves in every way.

The Top Gear test track is not done under race conditions, so as a point of reference it's flawed. Sebastian Loeb would wipe the floor with Hamilton, Vettel, Schumacher or whoever over a WRC stage, it's a different sport and one that former F1 driver Robert Kubica is barely able to compete in alongside the likes of Latvala and Ogier. Comparisons could surely only be drawn on who is the better driver by having them on at the same time, under the same conditions, in the same F1 Car, which is never going to happen is it? If you know what I mean, basically I'm saying that you can't compare who is the better F1 driver by testing them in a road car, same as you can't include a goal scored in 5 a side kick about down the local park in goal of the season competitions.
 
Typical_Terry said:
There seems to be a bit of a dislike for Vettel for some reason amongst F1 fans, I absolutely rate the guy and he's a really nice bloke too by all accounts. I don't get how he's being made out to be this sack of skin that's behind the wheel of a super car that wipes out the competition. If you do enough research you'll find a billion and one quotes from Adrian Newey singing the praises of Vettel. He gives the technical team so much feedback that they can make minor changes to his car to improve it's performance. Webber didn't have anything like the understanding of the Red Bull car like Vettel does, it's not favouritism, he just gets the very best out of that machine because he knows how it behaves in every way.

The Top Gear test track is not done under race conditions, so as a point of reference it's flawed. Sebastian Loeb would wipe the floor with Hamilton, Vettel, Schumacher or whoever over a WRC stage, it's a different sport and one that former F1 driver Robert Kubica is barely able to compete in alongside the likes of Latvala and Ogier. Comparisons could surely only be drawn on who is the better driver by having them on at the same time, under the same conditions, in the same F1 Car, which is never going to happen is it? If you know what I mean, basically I'm saying that you can't compare who is the better F1 driver by testing them in a road car, same as you can't include a goal scored in 5 a side kick about down the local park in goal of the season competitions.
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No idea where this dislike of Vettel came from.
I was voicing my opinion on his merits as a driver.
Nothing personal.
His own team mate knows he has been given preferential treatment by the Red Bull team.
The reason Vettel and his team are world champions is the car.

You want to keep ****ing over him more power to your wrist.
But please don't deride my opinion as down to dislike.

I dislike Fergie with a passion, but do respect what he has achieved.
 
I didn't say you dislike him MR, I just said there's a general opinion of him being disliked. Chill.

To put it down to the car is naive though, I'm going to debate that because quite simply it's not. Of course RB give Seb preferential treatment, he's the better driver! It's not like a mother and a father where they have to treat them both equally as if they're kids, every team has a senior or preferred or favourite driver. I've presented you with the fact that Newey has stated it is Vettel's attention to detail that separates him from the rest at the minute, surely you have to appreciate that the guy at the top of Red Bull has this to say rather than just dismiss it as me "****ing over him".

Your opinion on his 'merits' as a driver is that he is a pilot behind a machine and that it's 'all the car'. Why bother having Vettel at all then? Surely anybody would do to drive the car. I'm fairly certain every other driver comes at a discounted rate and he's hardly a poster boy is he? Why not go for Hamilton when he left McLaren...because they knew Vettel is a better driver and Webber was good enough to bring in enough points to comfortably get the constructors championship.
 
Typical_Terry said:
I didn't say you dislike him MR, I just said there's a general opinion of him being disliked. Chill.

To put it down to the car is naive though, I'm going to debate that because quite simply it's not. Of course RB give Seb preferential treatment, he's the better driver! It's not like a mother and a father where they have to treat them both equally as if they're kids, every team has a senior or preferred or favourite driver. I've presented you with the fact that Newey has stated it is Vettel's attention to detail that separates him from the rest at the minute, surely you have to appreciate that the guy at the top of Red Bull has this to say rather than just dismiss it as me "****ing over him".

Your opinion on his 'merits' as a driver is that he is a pilot behind a machine and that it's 'all the car'. Why bother having Vettel at all then? Surely anybody would do to drive the car. I'm fairly certain every other driver comes at a discounted rate and he's hardly a poster boy is he? Why not go for Hamilton when he left McLaren...because they knew Vettel is a better driver and Webber was good enough to bring in enough points to comfortably get the constructors championship.
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You quoted ME then said it. Chill!

You are stating your opinion on Vettel it doesn't make it fact.
You want to continue your ****fest over Vettel fine, doesn't alter the actual fact it is the car.
As someone else said if Kimi had a better car he would wipe the floor with your pet driver.
Which of course you derided.
IMO Webber is the better driver of the two, who was royally shafted by RedBull.
Your poster boy comment shows just how much you are grasping.
If you don't think he is lauded in the huge German market and elswhere, you are either lying or totally deluded.
Put that against the tiny Aussie market.
 
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