Mark Sampson done one.

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You seriously think the PFA went it negotiations without consulting her? Of course they discussed all possible compensation options with her. She may not have demanded it but she certainly will have been aware of it and approved it, otherwise it wouldn't have even been on the table.

She's a 30 year old footballer, she'll know as much about UK tax rules, as I know about making a soufflé.
 
Bit patronising that OLM. She's got a first class law degree, she may well have exercised her brain cells on UK tax law.

I wasn't suggesting she was an idiot, she's quite obviously a very bright woman, but the PFA negotiated the terms of the settlement and I'm sure it was them who specified the terms (she's a lawyer, not an accountant).
 
I wasn't suggesting she was an idiot, she's quite obviously a very bright woman, but the PFA negotiated the terms of the settlement and I'm sure it was them who specified the terms (she's a lawyer, not an accountant).
Agreed, but it was still patronising.

I'm a self-employed computer programmer not an accountant but I know about the tax regulations that can affect me because I looked them up and asked people questions. She could easily have done then same and instructed the PFA what terms she wanted them to negotiate for her.

I also know how to make a souffle.
 
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I wasn't suggesting she was an idiot, she's quite obviously a very bright woman, but the PFA negotiated the terms of the settlement and I'm sure it was them who specified the terms (she's a lawyer, not an accountant).

You don't need specialist knowledge to know a tax exemption on 'lost earnings' is immoral, you're not recouping lost earnings, you're making money on top of what you would have earned, essentially profiting from the situation.

She will have seen the settlement before it was presented, she had the chance to remove that part, if indeed this was just about justice and not money she would have asked them to take it out.
 
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Are we still talking about a football manager and his players? For as long as I can remember a manager's success has been measured by just such a display of popularity and loyalty (among other things). Why is this reaction different to any for Slutsky, Brown, Silva, Bruce - such things have been used, on here and elsewhere, as a barometer of team spirit for all time. Two set back (in a photo snapshot) is being used as proof of discord, you talking of sucking up and fear - really? Sounds like the same evidence based accusations as used by the Witchfinder General; or the Ched Atkins hang him high lynch mob.

The players. You may well be right about him legally having a case for unfair dismissal, the FA are to blame for this fiasco as far as I can see.

I just wonder whether he may well let sleeping dogs lie, as it is likely what went on at Bristol would be dragged through the mud, which might be more damaging for him. It may be better for him to have a go at the FA and get them to settle out of court so to speak, as that might suit both parties.

I have never liked the guy, I think he is arrogant, and appeared to feel that he was shot proof and water proof, and could say and do whatever he liked and get away with it. Well great credit to Aluko and the other girl for coming out and not letting it get swept under the carpet.
 
Maybe let's not.

It was you who said you are not an expert, I've simply said that, perhaps, you are correct. Your childish response is correct, I am not an expert, nor have I claimed to be. I have managed teams in excess of 50 and also owned my own company and employed folk, so I do claim to have a decent knowledge, through thorough training, of how things are in matters such as this... Oh.

You totally miss my point which is stated elsewhere on this thread. I don't support racism, nor his humour. The Judge (barrister) took great pain to make the point that she does not believe he is racist. That's it. If his humour was construed as racist then it must have been because his humour was poor, as as a non-racist it could not possibly have been deliberately racist - could it? Perhaps it was a genuine unthinking mistake that should have been handled outside of the realms of racism.

I do not admire Sampson's style (successful bugger, though), nor do I admire the actions of Aluko, who is far more intelligent than Sampson.

I think there is a case for unfair dismissal on the grounds of constructed cause (not a technical term) and I believe it should be prosecuted. I feel strongly about this as it is the FA at it's very worse and should be the last straw before something serious happens. But somehow...

It was a childish response to what I saw as an initial childish response, Fez. Maybe let's both be grown-ups about it? As for my record, I have also managed large teams and am often used as 'independent official' who semi-frequently sits in on employment disputes within my company (someone between the union and HR if you like). All very mundane (I spend a fair bit of time listening to 'experts'), but probably, along with a long-standing admiration of women's football, what aroused my interest in this matter. As for the racism, I'm sure you know as well as I do that racism isn't a black and white issue, if you'll pardon what I promise you isn't a horrible pun. The judge stated that he isn't racist, but essentially discriminated against someone based on her colour. I think the only person who can truly answer what his intentions were (and broadly speaking, where racism is concerned I think that intent and context are of key importance) is Sampson. If the allegations against Kendall are proved to be true, however, it does all paint a picture of a worrying atmosphere within the set-up. We disagree for the most part on Aluko's actions, which I doubt is going to alter much.

I agree with your final sentence in full. The comments from David Bernstein this morning, if you've read them, are pretty telling.
 
It was a childish response to what I saw as an initial childish response, Fez. Maybe let's both be grown-ups about it? As for my record, I have also managed large teams and am often used as 'independent official' who semi-frequently sits in on employment disputes within my company (someone between the union and HR if you like). All very mundane (I spend a fair bit of time listening to 'experts'), but probably, along with a long-standing admiration of women's football, what aroused my interest in this matter. As for the racism, I'm sure you know as well as I do that racism isn't a black and white issue, if you'll pardon what I promise you isn't a horrible pun. The judge stated that he isn't racist, but essentially discriminated against someone based on her colour. I think the only person who can truly answer what his intentions were (and broadly speaking, where racism is concerned I think that intent and context are of key importance) is Sampson. If the allegations against Kendall are proved to be true, however, it does all paint a picture of a worrying atmosphere within the set-up. We disagree for the most part on Aluko's actions, which I doubt is going to alter much.

I agree with your final sentence in full. The comments from David Bernstein this morning, if you've read them, are pretty telling.

Her colour wasn't mentioned at all and is completely irrelevant, he made reference to the geographical location from which her family were travelling from, that's it, no mention of race or colour, anything people choose to interpret from what he said is conjecture.
 
Her colour wasn't mentioned at all and is completely irrelevant, he made reference to the geographical location from which her family were travelling from, that's it, no mention of race or colour, anything people choose to interpret from what he said is conjecture.

The ruling said: "I have concluded that on two separate occasions, MS has made ill-judged attempts at humour, which, as a matter of law, were discriminatory on the grounds of race within the meaning of the Equality Act 2010." That's a mention of race, which is what I was referring to above. I get what you're saying but from my reading of everything on this I don't see how it is 'completely irrelevant'.
 
Everything seems black and white these days.

Sure I wouldn't ever think of making an ebola joke like that, but at the same time I very much doubt he's racist, most people aren't.
 
I wasn't suggesting she was an idiot, she's quite obviously a very bright woman, but the PFA negotiated the terms of the settlement and I'm sure it was them who specified the terms (she's a lawyer, not an accountant).
I think the chances of a qualified lawyer signing an agreement without knowing all the details within it, are approximately zero.
 
Agreed, but it was still patronising.

I'm a self-employed computer programmer not an accountant but I know about the tax regulations that can affect me because I looked them up and asked people questions. She could easily have done then same and instructed the PFA what terms she wanted them to negotiate for her.

I also know how to make a souffle.

True, I worded it very poorly.

I've never attempted a souffle.
 
She's a 30 year old footballer, she'll know as much about UK tax rules, as I know about making a soufflé.
Bit patronising that OLM. She's got a first class law degree, she may well have exercised her brain cells on UK tax law.
I wasn't suggesting she was an idiot, she's quite obviously a very bright woman, but the PFA negotiated the terms of the settlement and I'm sure it was them who specified the terms (she's a lawyer, not an accountant).
Agreed, but it was still patronising.

I'm a self-employed computer programmer not an accountant but I know about the tax regulations that can affect me because I looked them up and asked people questions. She could easily have done then same and instructed the PFA what terms she wanted them to negotiate for her.

I also know how to make a souffle.


Isn't it amazing how a seemingly harmless comment can be taken offence at ...

... although I am not saying it is as offensive as the stupid jokey remarks, just a point immediately made.
 
It was a childish response to what I saw as an initial childish response, Fez. Maybe let's both be grown-ups about it? As for my record, I have also managed large teams and am often used as 'independent official' who semi-frequently sits in on employment disputes within my company (someone between the union and HR if you like). All very mundane (I spend a fair bit of time listening to 'experts'), but probably, along with a long-standing admiration of women's football, what aroused my interest in this matter. As for the racism, I'm sure you know as well as I do that racism isn't a black and white issue, if you'll pardon what I promise you isn't a horrible pun. The judge stated that he isn't racist, but essentially discriminated against someone based on her colour. I think the only person who can truly answer what his intentions were (and broadly speaking, where racism is concerned I think that intent and context are of key importance) is Sampson. If the allegations against Kendall are proved to be true, however, it does all paint a picture of a worrying atmosphere within the set-up. We disagree for the most part on Aluko's actions, which I doubt is going to alter much.

I agree with your final sentence in full. The comments from David Bernstein this morning, if you've read them, are pretty telling.

I really do not see what was childish about my original post, I simply used your own words to agree with you. My growing up was done a long time ago and I have been viewing this as fairly as I am able (with the information available).

Your involvement in disputes must surely have given you a good insight to matters such as this, so why so coy, our life experience should stand us in good stead?

The barrister who judged this review said he wasn't racist, Sampson has said he isn't racist. I have only ever discussed the situation and cause of Sampson's dismissal from the England post; Kendall was never given as a part of the reason. Or do you know something other to that?

I have yet to see Bernstein's comments.