Junior Hoilett
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Well, we'll be between 11th and 20th I'd say, hopefully nearer the former. We have a young vibrant squad most of whom now have a year's experience at the top level, so that bodes well.
A couple more to come probably, so that should make us competitive. I have faith in the manager, so let's see.
Can see you guys staying up next season, which is the main thing initially.
A couple more to come probably, so that should make us competitive. I have faith in the manager, so let's see.
Can see you guys staying up next season, which is the main thing initially.
I didn't actually say we were a step up. I just said we can't be viewed as a step down. I honestly think we're about equal.
Norwich City finished above Aston Villa last season, which of the two did Paul Lambert think was the step up?
Southampton can outdo Norwich in terms of...
- transfer fees paid
- wages and overall budget
- average crowd size
- stadium quality and size
- financial resources
- quality of training ground
- quality of academy and academy facilities
etc etc
In the same way Aston Villa outdo Norwich in a most of those things and Paul Lambert left, Saints outdo Norwich as well.
In which of the categories above am I wrong?
If that is you basis for who has the higher valued squad and you think it "is the only measure" there really is no hope.
Arrogant enough for you!?
AHAHA!! Not dispelling the arrogance at all, no!
I think I should have been clearer- in terms of better squads, the only objective measure we have is their value according to an independent source.
There is a slight problem here. Firstly, we don't know why Lambert left other than that Villa are a bigger club and he's getting paid better. Nothing about their transfer spending suggests they have more money. The only solid thing we can says it sounds like the Norwich board weren't prepared to back him for his ambitions. Secondly, and more importantly, Southampton are nothing like Villa. Big clubs have attractions that bely their league position- e.g. Newcastle. You do not have that at all. Really laughable to suggest you are anything like Villa compared to us.
As for transfer fees- yes you do seem to be splashing the cash at the moment, but I think Hughton is being careful with his money. We spent a lot last season because, like you, the squad needed a major upgrade.I haven idea on wages and budget, but it does surprise me if yours is so high. I've been meaning to ask you lot- are you happy with the heavy spending given the previous financial difficulties you've Ben in? That's why our board are so careful.
League attendances:
So'ton average 26,420 (overall including cup matches 24,786)
Norwich average 26,548
From wikipedia
Be careful what you ask for! Our crowd capacity is always absolutely maxed, so that's why we have abetter attendance than you- our stadium is far too small with c.3500 on the season ticket waiting list. You simply can't see Norwich at home unless you are an away fan or season ticket holder.
So yes, your stadium is bigger, but we have larger (just) crowds... And we'll have even bigger once the new stand is built. I seem to remember we had consistently larger crowds than you when we were in League one too.
As for the rest re. Facilities, how could you possibly know? I won't deny that you've had a period where your youth team has produced some very good players, but so did we until about 2000 and then it all just dried up, it happens! Although part of our problem has been the 90 mile rule because there are apparently more seals than people within 90 miles of Carrow Road! Now that the FA have scrapped that we should be in a much better position.
You have, of course, omitted to mention things like- who has won a major trophy most recently, who has the highest league position both now and ever...
All of these things are bollocks, we can sit here measuring cocks all day and get nowhere. The bottom line is, and the only assessment of attractiveness of club, is that if you were a free agent footballer, entirely objectively, and you were offered Norwich or Southampton, I think it would be a very, very close call. Naturally, I'm convinced they'd go for Norwich, simply because we've got the security of a year in the Prem. I'm sure you could think of several reasons why you think eyd rather not. Ultimately, pointless.
In response to letissier - about how arrogance and results are linked- I thought was clear- if you have this over mighty belief that you are better than x, y, and z in the league because you are somehow bigger, I can see your fans getting rapidly frustrated when x, y, and z actually turn out to be pretty good. Fans will get on players backs, not be behind them and the crowd gets restless. Then it all goes tits up. I say is from experience- us Norwich fans dealt very poorly with drawing against Wigan and Fulham at home and it didn't help us in the matches. Fortunately, we were a little more humble usually. If your lot perceive that about us (with something like e twelfth-largest support in the country) it's going to be the same with a lot of clubs, and I think that's dangerous. I get that you did well in the Championship, but so did we. The Prem is a different ball game. Teams like Wigan survive year on year for a reason.
As for ncgandy's post- I apologise to all you Saints fans for the rant earlier. I should have realised that this moron would go and post on your forum too
. I hope you realise we completely disassociate ourselves from him. As Gandy pointed out, I thought our relationship has been good in the past and I want to keep it that way. The reason for the overreaction was partly because we've had an infestation of tedious, arrogant QPR fans recently and it has put me off the board, so I jumped to conclusions here.In all honesty, I think you'll do well this season- just remember that for any team outside the top eight, at times it's tough don't let it get you down!
Fail to see how this is a wum? How is it any different to others saying we are looking at getting Snodgrass to Leeds fans? All I have done is repeat a rumour I heard about lallana. Never said we will get him - dont particularly want him anyway, hes a pretty mediocre player...
Well let's just take a look at that. I would argue I'm not being arrogant, it is more the case of you not being aware of the situation at Southampton...
You only need to take a quick look at that website to see it isn't a reliable source, it is littered with factual inaccuracies so why trust their opinion on subjective matters?
As I will show in a minute, Southampton have very high ambitions which the Norwich board are unlikely to match.
- Southampton are owed by the estate of a multi billionaire that is spending to get the club to compete towards the top of the Premier League.
- They are debt free.
Not worried at all, the club is very well run and has huge resources behind it, it seems you are completely unaware of that.
Those attendances you listed are comparing a Premier League club with one in the Championship. Next season St. Mary's will see an average of over 30,000 as it did in every season it has had in the Premier League.
Early plans for expanding St Mary's to 50,000 seats and developing the land around the stadium show the ambition of the owners...
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Because I'm aware what Colney is like and Southampton this summer are spending £15 million+ upgrading Staplewood...
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Sorry but Norwich's Colney training ground doesn't come close to what is currently being built at Staplewood.
Bale, Walcott, Oxlade-Chamberlain etc etc Norwich's academy hasn't come remotely close to producing players like that, let alone some of the others Saints have produced in recent years. Saints have one of the top academies in the country and are putting more money into it now than ever before.
Our academy is far more established. To blame the 90 minute rule is a nonsense, Southampton are by the English Channel, yet they set up satellite academies is places Bath to pick up youngsters from the South West and Southern Wales. It is how we got Gareth Bale!
We can do if you want, not sure it helps your argument...
- Southampton 2nd in the top flight 1984
- Norwich 3rd in the top flight 1993
- Southampton this summer can show prospective new players the £15 million+ development of the training ground currently underway.
- They can show them the plans for expanding the stadium to 50,000 seats
- They can show them the ambition of bringing in players like Rangers captain Steven Davis, Nathaniel Clyne, Jay Rodriguez
The Markus Liebherr estate has the ambition and more importantly the resources to take Southampton a long way and is doing so without accruing any debt for the club.
Unless you can prove Norwich can equal or match that, it is you being arrogant, not me...
Because you posted an obviously ridiculous rumour on the Saints' board
I just said I heard the rumour and asked if he was any good? They can just say, that rumour is way off the mark and we think he is good.How is it inflammatory to say a rumour I heard and ask if theyve heard anything of it? Didnt say it would happen or that he wants to go to us. Stop being so touchy. Dread to think what you are like in real life if that winds you up but I'd suggest you get anger management classes boi.
I just said I heard the rumour and asked if he was any good? They can just say, that rumour is way off the mark and we think he is good.How is it inflammatory to say a rumour I heard and ask if theyve heard anything of it? Didnt say it would happen or that he wants to go to us. Stop being so touchy. Dread to think what you are like in real life if that winds you up but I'd suggest you get anger management classes boi.
Read post #325 for a list of reasons why one of Southampton's best players won't be leaving to join Norwich anytime soon.
http://www.not606.com/showthread.php/156253-Junior-Hoilett?p=3176846&viewfull=1#post3176846
To be fair I hadnt heard of all these plans, guess that shows the media bias towards London clubs and the big 4 that I havent. Does sound very promising if all these things come true but have heard these sorts of things from clubs like Blackburn, leeds before... That swimming pool doesnt look overly impressive though have to say
It isn't a pipe dream, it is currently being built and will be finished by next summer. The Liebherr's don't mess around with empty promises!
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If you think the Liebherr estate have taken Southampton into the Premier League for bottom half/mid table finishes you are in for a shock. They intend to have the club competing at the very top, hence the 50,000 stadium plans and £15m+ training ground upgrade.
Fair enough, good for you then. Sounds like exciting times. Sorry to seem daft but what does it mean by Liebherr estate? Is it his sons? Are they Soton fans?
Did find it funny that yu posted all these amazing pictures of new stadium and great training facilities and then the smallest swimming pool of all time lol
Did find it funny that yu posted all these amazing pictures of new stadium and great training facilities and then the smallest swimming pool of all time lol
You say 50,000 stadium plans? What does that mean, are they actually gonna do it or is it just an idea. Are they seeking planning permission and has a date been set?
Since he died, all we know is the club is owed by "the estate of Markus Liebherr". There are unsubstantiated rumours he left the club a huge amount of money to play with. Looking at the plans for the stadium and training ground, they may well be true.
It isn't really a swimming pool. It is part of the medical facilities at the training ground and is a hydrotherapy pool with a raisable floor to help players recuperate from injuries. Also in that room are hot and cold plunge pools. It is all about recovering from sports injuries, not have fun in a large swimming pool or swimming lengths. It doesn't need to be big to do that, it is the size it is for a reason.
YellowLittle
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The things that can be done with a powerful and rich owner....
The one thing I would say ambition wise Southampton are superior but if we had a powerful owner with that sort of money I am sure our board will be just as ambitious. It's purely because we don't have that billionaire behind us and for us to match Lambert's ambition we will have to risk our financial structure which is not worth it after nearly going into administration in League 1. So when you say our board are unlikely to match Southampton's ambition I am pretty sure we would if we had that sort of backing. No Norwich fan can grumble about how well out board have done in backing managers and matching realistic ambition. But you are right, but just backing them up why they can't show that sort of ambition, maybe they are but at a lot patient route because we simply havn't got £15 mill to upgrade training facilities.
I think Southampton are going about it the right way to be fair, you could go down the QPR route and buy has beens, monster wage players or young, exciting prospects i.e Clyne, Rodriguez. And I think that's why you'll be fine and probably reach where you want to be.
Good luck anyway for the season but one thing we do beat you on is Holt is better than Lambert
The one thing I would say ambition wise Southampton are superior but if we had a powerful owner with that sort of money I am sure our board will be just as ambitious. It's purely because we don't have that billionaire behind us and for us to match Lambert's ambition we will have to risk our financial structure which is not worth it after nearly going into administration in League 1. So when you say our board are unlikely to match Southampton's ambition I am pretty sure we would if we had that sort of backing. No Norwich fan can grumble about how well out board have done in backing managers and matching realistic ambition. But you are right, but just backing them up why they can't show that sort of ambition, maybe they are but at a lot patient route because we simply havn't got £15 mill to upgrade training facilities.
I think Southampton are going about it the right way to be fair, you could go down the QPR route and buy has beens, monster wage players or young, exciting prospects i.e Clyne, Rodriguez. And I think that's why you'll be fine and probably reach where you want to be.
Good luck anyway for the season but one thing we do beat you on is Holt is better than Lambert
you obviously missed the bit about it all being pointless cock-swinging! As I said, we've both got things we can say to make ourselves sound harder, better, faster, stronger... But it's useless! Most outsiders would see us, right now, on a par.Tranfsermarkt, in fact, is the closest freely available thing that we have to the formal valuation companies that clubs hire when assessing players, btw. It can be a month or so out-of-date at times, but generally is excellent and highly reliable.
A) If you keep up with some of the more ridiculous comments, you're in danger of sounding like QPR Mark II (see my signature)
B) You're talking about the future, not the present. I don't care where So'ton will be in five years, where they are now is a freshly promoted Premier League side. You're only kidding yourself if you don't see that.
I can't be arsed to go through all your redundant points, but suffice to say that if you think Norwich's academy in the 80s and 90s wasn't producing footballers as good as Walcott, you are clearly under 25 years old. Nothing wrong with that, but bear in mind that your view is somewhat warped. Blaming the 90 min rule is not nonsense- there's a reason our club suffered for it- Norfolk is sparsely populated. if you can't understand the problem there, and the direct link between that rule and the decline of Norwich's academy, I'm afraid we're just going to have to end here.
Also bear in mind that you freely admitted those factilities are being built. I.e. They're not there yet...
In particular- the stadium. not built. We had bigger crowds than you in League 1, bigger in the Championship. I don't see the point in you building a 50k stadium when you can't fill a 32k stadium.
Don't get me wrong, I think your club is ambitious- I never suggested they weren't (and I think the signings you've made are very good- much better than QPR's signings). So are we- were redeveloping the academy, we're getting a new stand if we stay up, etc., etc. Specifically what yellow little said above, I really think you're going about it the right way, whereas QPR's version of "ambition" looks like a recipe for disaster.
But you have to admit, right here, right now. An objective outsider would look simply at the fact that we have a squad of proven Premier League players. Sure, in three years time you might be massive, but right now, whether you like it or not, you're the newbies. And a little bit of humility wouldn't go amiss. Otherwise, as I said above, the mentality will see you in trouble should fans get on the players' backs. Norwich fans are in general well aware of our place in the football hierarchy, and it's not that high, so we're grateful that we're at a level we can maintain. It's not arrogance to say we're currently higher in the League table than you. As I said, I like So'ton, think they're doing things right and I don't want to fall out with a bunch of fans simply because of this WUM we haven't banned yet.
At the moment it isn't anything concrete but the chairman has mentioned he wants to expand on a number of occasions.
Then this summer with our season tickets we got a DVD that included pictures of a stadium redevelopment...
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The film on the DVD...
[video=youtube;z_ndrjHuxRo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_ndrjHuxRo&feature=player_embedded[/video]
Since then a player we have been linked with - Alexander Buttner has said in an interview with the Dutch press that the Southampton chairman told him they want to expand St Mary's to 50,000 seats.
I remember when we were both in Div One and you won at our place and all your fans came on here and said that it PROVED that you were actually the best team in the Division, despite the fact that you finished God knows how many points behind us, even once the ten point deduction was taken into consideration.
Two seasons on, and here you are just as arrogant as ever. I actually think you will do well this season and I also predict you will finish ahead of us. But the arrogance of your supporters really cheeses me off big time. Swansea supporters are much nicer and actually have far more to show off about than you guys do.
Clearly, being in Division One taught you guys nothing whereas it taught the Norwich supporters the value of humility. You are like Leeds without the history.
Two seasons on, and here you are just as arrogant as ever. I actually think you will do well this season and I also predict you will finish ahead of us. But the arrogance of your supporters really cheeses me off big time. Swansea supporters are much nicer and actually have far more to show off about than you guys do.
Clearly, being in Division One taught you guys nothing whereas it taught the Norwich supporters the value of humility. You are like Leeds without the history.
Like I said it does all seem very good but from what you have said its all very unclear. You dont really know what the Liebher estate means and who they are and you dont know for sure about the stadium plans so could be a load of hot air.
However the plans for the training facilities do look very impressive and its obvioulsy exciting times for your club and player wise you seem to be going about it in the right way - signing young, hungry, reaosnably priced players which is what you Southampton fans deserve after a few rough years. I dont know where it has come from that I am trying to wind up Soton fans. I like Southampton, feel they are similar to us in several ways and are a team I like to see do well. I support Norwich but my favourite second teams are Southampton, Derby County, River Plate, Borussia Dortmund, Roma and Woking
However the plans for the training facilities do look very impressive and its obvioulsy exciting times for your club and player wise you seem to be going about it in the right way - signing young, hungry, reaosnably priced players which is what you Southampton fans deserve after a few rough years. I dont know where it has come from that I am trying to wind up Soton fans. I like Southampton, feel they are similar to us in several ways and are a team I like to see do well. I support Norwich but my favourite second teams are Southampton, Derby County, River Plate, Borussia Dortmund, Roma and Woking
It is a nonsense site as it doesn't take into account factors at individual clubs. For example Southampton have rich backers and therefore little reason to sell someone like Lallana. That then drives up the price compared to a club desperate for money. The values on that website cannot be taken seriously. They even do daft things like give monetary values to players that have announced there retirement or soon to be out of contract. It is a terrible website!
Not at all, QPR are buying older players and putting them on huge wages whilst still at a small stadium with small gates. Southampton are signing players in their early 20's (Rodriguez, Clyne etc) with huge potential but on relatively small wages.
QPR have also made claims of infrastructure improvements, nothing concrete has happened yet. Southampton have started work on their £15m training ground upgrade.
As I just said, work has already started on the training ground, parts of it are already finished and being used. Prospective players can look at the training ground as evidence of the clubs ambition and resources.
Maybe because you'd find it hard to form a rebuttal?
The academy system started in 1998.
You have already admitted Norwich haven't produced many players of note since before 2000, that is over 12 years ago! Southampton's academy has one of the best records in the country in those 12 years.
Losing the 90 minute rule won't make that much difference to Norwich, how many parent are going to spend over 3 hours a day driving their children to training and back?
Still shows to a player that in the very near future they could be at a club with those facilities and it is not a mere pipe dream.
Absolute rubbish. Every season in the Premier League at St Mary's the club averaged over 30,600. Including the year we were relegated in 20th place! So weren't exactly fun to watch yet still averaged over 30,000.
Hang on, just now you were saying we are QPR mark II. Make your mind up!
Which would you prefer, Jacob Butterfield or Steven Davis in central midfield next season?
Would you have liked Norwich to sign Nathaniel Clyne or Jay Rodriguez? Do you think that if Norwich were in for those they would have picked Norwich over Southampton? Could Norwich even afford them?
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