is this really the plan?

[concrete tony]

Havn't posted in a while, been waiting for something to happen but nothing.

I cannot believe that our plan this pre season was to leave everything until the last minute.

Many of us including myself felt that Short would be backing MON this summer. Those heady days of Steve Bruce shopping in Harrods seem gone.

Any new players now will struggle to fit straight into the team at this late stage.

Something must have gone wrong, either our targets have been unsuccessful or Short has failed to back MON. I hope I'm wrong about this but 1 new striker is not enough.

I was going to bite my lip and wait and see but I have a feeling we are going to be let down.

Here's hoping I'm wrong.

 

[poolie_mackem]

The time to judge is when the transfer window slams shut

I think wer going to bring in 6 or 7 really good additions

 

[flandersmackem]

I would relax mate. with the exception of West Ham who are buying anyone with a pulse, nobody has really done any real business. I am sure Short and MoN are on the case. O'Neill is one of the canniest managers in a generation, I have full confidence in him and the club to bring a squad of players together that will improve on what we have seen over the last few years. Short is no mug either...lets show a little faith and see who lines up in a Sunderland shirt for the Arsenal game.

 

[Warmir Pouchov]

To be fair who is buying anyone except the porn boys who are making the same mistakes as their Icelandic predecessors at West Ham. The Euros and Olympics has resulted in a delayed start to the transfer activity.

O'Neill has a pretty patchy transfer record to be honest, never been his strongest suit. But he is a very good manager and its better he is patient and gets the right characters.

The reality is everyone is finding it difficult to get business done. Short has no choice but to back O'Neill. He is committed for the time being, and would have to write off serious money to walk away. Not gonna happen so he has to invest to make anything positive happen or he is just worsening his hand. He has made it clear he wants value though, and there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[flandersmackem]

"O'Neill has a pretty patchy transfer record to be honest, never been his strongest suit"

care to back that up with some decent facts.

 

[QWOP]

"O'Neill has a pretty patchy transfer record to be honest, never been his strongest suit"

care to back that up with some decent facts.

It is a perception he seems to have brought on himself. Although if pressed, I would struggle to name dodgy signings. His penchant for shopping mainly in Britain could be a weakness given financial constraints but apart from that, his signings can't be bad. He got Villa into the top six regularly and that can't just be through epic man management.....!

 

[Warmir Pouchov]

"O'Neill has a pretty patchy transfer record to be honest, never been his strongest suit"

care to back that up with some decent facts.

http://www.astonvilla.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7501688

This is a good one when reviewing his time at Villa. To be fair he is not the one agreeing the fees so Lerner has to accept a lot of the flak too, but some of them lack ability and were bad buys. No way of knowing if O'Neill convinced him to spend 3.5m on Harewood, 8.5m on Reo Coker, Shorey 4m, Sidwell 5.5m, Davies 7.5m but he must have wanted them. Made some poor sales too. Did decent there though so he must have been good on the training ground/tactically. He also made some good signings, some of which went on to make the club a lot of money. Hence the "patchy" term as opposed to poor.

 

[Cest Advocaat]

"O'Neill has a pretty patchy transfer record to be honest, never been his strongest suit"

care to back that up with some decent facts.

I'll back it up with some facts, or shoot it dead.

In 4 years he spent £96.8m
Sold £35m

Net spending £62m for 3 consecutive top 6 finishes. That at a time whent he top 4 where water tight.

Also, lets not forget that Downing, Young and Milner brought the Villains a £59m windfall after he left, so he cost the Midlands outfit a mere £3m in his time there. NET. I think his record stands up to ANY managers in recent times personnally.

Thats a fantastic return on investment considering that they were also nearly relegated the season after he did leave.

 

[Sidthemackem]

His record stands up to most managers, really. Anyone who can win trophies at Leicester and put a fairly ordinary Villa side in the top 6 season after season doesn't have to justify anything. Did well at Celtic too, but that's a bit of a two-horse race, albeit one that he won all the time. I still smile at mags who insist he's not all that while praising Pardew to the rafters.

 

[Warmir Pouchov]

His record stands up to most managers, really. Anyone who can win trophies at Leicester and put a fairly ordinary Villa side in the top 6 season after season doesn't have to justify anything. Did well at Celtic too, but that's a bit of a two-horse race, albeit one that he won all the time. I still smile at mags who insist he's not all that while praising Pardew to the rafters.

I don't think many would dispute he is a good manager who did a good job with Villa but his transfer record was patchy. Just look at that list and you'll see there is as many failures as successes.

 

[Warmir Pouchov]

I'll back it up with some facts, or shoot it dead.

In 4 years he spent £96.8m
Sold £35m

Net spending £62m for 3 consecutive top 6 finishes. That at a time whent he top 4 where water tight.

Also, lets not forget that Downing, Young and Milner brought the Villains a £59m windfall after he left, so he cost the Midlands outfit a mere £3m in his time there. NET. I think his record stands up to ANY managers in recent times personnally.

Thats a fantastic return on investment considering that they were also nearly relegated the season after he did leave.

Cherrypicking the good bits a little here Cest. You have to look at the complete picture. He bought some poor players and many signings were abject failures (Sutton, Agathe, Routledge, Maloney, Salifou, Davies, Sidwell, Reo Coker, Harewood, Shorey). I've had the pleasure of watching Harewood and its hard to fathom where he saw 3.5m-4m worth of talent! No good looking at what the likes of Downing etc brought in after he left (I did touch on that too) without looking at what the others left for Shorey (left for 1m), Sidwell (left for 2m), Harewood (free), Reo Coker(free), Davies(3.5m). Those 5 alone lost the club around 18m alone, wiping out a good chunk of the profit made on the other three. They cost in the region of 34m so you'd hope you buying something with a return value at that level of fees. Its really the lower value transfer where a manager earns his corn.

He did a good job at Villa, but it was down to his managerial skills rather than sterling work in the transfer market in my opinion. Its definitely a patchy record regardless of where he managed to finish.

 

[Sidthemackem]

I don't think many would dispute he is a good manager who did a good job with Villa but his transfer record was patchy. Just look at that list and you'll see there is as many failures as successes.

I don't give a toss about his transfer record; look at the results he was getting. Anyway, we have just had Steve Bruce who's record was the other way round. Brought some good players in, but couldn't get them to play! Before SB we had Roy Keane, whose transfer policy was to buy everyone going and see which were any good later on.

 

[concrete tony]

We seem to have done well off field with new sponsorship deals, shirt deals etc and we should be on a firm footing.

I don't know where we are with debt?

It's on the field where our biggest problems are.

 

[Warmir Pouchov]

I don't give a toss about his transfer record; look at the results he was getting. Anyway, we have just had Steve Bruce who's record was the other way round. Brought some good players in, but couldn't get them to play! Before SB we had Roy Keane, whose transfer policy was to buy everyone going and see which were any good later on.

I don't suppose you would really care about his transfer record, I certainly wouldn't. Its about results mainly (Although I'd rather lose than watch Fat Sams long ball every week). I was simply explaining my comment to Flanders. It probably could be perceived as a negative comment by a Mag on O'Neill for the sake of it. It wasn't, it was just a passing comment on something that seems pretty obvious to me.

Bruce is the prime example of why transfers are only part of the battle. The very fact O'Neill did well with Villa despite some dodgy transfer work suggests the main component fr success is in place. Ability to actually get results and manage the club.

 

[Sidthemackem]

I was really looking forward to Fat Sam getting his teeth into NUFC! Bloody shame he got the hoof, albeit somewhat ironic given his style of play

 

[Warmir Pouchov]

I was really looking forward to Fat Sam getting his teeth into NUFC! Bloody shame he got the hoof, albeit somewhat ironic given his style of play

He had me suicidal. I wouldn't have liked it regardless, just goes against club ethos and everything I've been brought up to believe in on how football should be played. But it would have slightly less infuriating had we had Emile Heskey and Carew up front. We had Owen and Martins though! Fat Fred and his bright ideas eh.

 

[Redan_White]

I would relax mate. with the exception of West Ham who are buying anyone with a pulse, nobody has really done any real business. I am sure Short and MoN are on the case. O'Neill is one of the canniest managers in a generation, I have full confidence in him and the club to bring a squad of players together that will improve on what we have seen over the last few years. Short is no mug either...lets show a little faith and see who lines up in a Sunderland shirt for the Arsenal game.