How long do we give him?

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JM Fan said:
Excellent post Rick.

My gripe is that last season, even when players were fit, the starting 11 seemed to change for most games and my lasting memory of that is when he opted to play RM against Liverpool at home and all the fans who were in the pub thought wtf!!!!
I accept that he made changes to the starting11 against QPR, but they were pretty much ‘like for like’ and no real change in the formation or tactics and obviously Olsson’s sending off didn’t help matters on Saturday and still only 1 striker, yet when we were in the Championship in 14-15, he occasionally played both Jerome and Hooper from the start. I don’t know if you were at the under 23 game against Celtic, but I was very impressed by Canos, in much the same way as I was impressed by somebody named Wilshire when we played Arsenal reserves about 6 or 7 years ago – so what do I know???? Has Canos even made it to the bench for the first team???? Also, where was Pritchard on Saturday???
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Well argued, JM fan and it's good to be back to discussing the football. IMO, the choice of Oliveira and Naismith was a considerable tactical change, especially for an away game. Oliveira has different attributes than those of Jerome, who is usually the first choice for away games. Naismith is more of an AM/2nd strker option than either Wes or Pritchard. He has 4 goals in 11 matches so far this season and he did an excellent job of helping to reorganise the team after Olsson was sent off as well as carrying a threat up front which culminated in his excellent headed goal (which I had a perfect view of at the match). That energised our fans who had been singing throughout but at last had something real to really cheer about. Not that they were down at any time - when we went 2 goals down they immediately responded with "We're going to win 3-2!" Unfortunately, being down to 10 men meant that it wasn't realistic to switch to a 4-4-2. Instead, AN brought on Josh to replace the tiring Naismith and provide a 3 pronged pacey attack which did carry a threat in the closing stages which made QPR fans nervous. "We were definitely shaky after you scored" was their assessment on the tube away from the ground afterwards. As for Canos (and I'm a fan as well), IMO it's Jacob who is keeping him out of the side. The latter played well and he is much better than Redmond at tracking back when the ball is lost and as I said, he only just missed with a lovely swerving shot that hit the crossbar.
 
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RiverEndRick said:
Well argued, JM fan and it's good to be back to discussing the football. IMO, the choice of Oliveira and Naismith was a considerable tactical change, especially for an away game. Oliveira has different attributes than those of Jerome, who is usually the first choice for away games. Naismith is more of an AM/2nd strker option than either Wes or Pritchard. He has 4 goals in 11 matches so far this season and he did an excellent job of helping to reorganise the team after Olsson was sent off as well as carrying a threat up front which culminated in his excellent headed goal (which I had a perfect view of at the match). That energised our fans who had been singing throughout but at last had something real to really cheer about. Not that they were down at any time - when we went 2 goals down they immediately responded with "We're going to win 3-2!" Unfortunately, being down to 10 men meant that it wasn't realistic to switch to a 4-4-2. Instead, AN brought on Josh to replace the tiring Naismith and provide a 3 pronged pacey attack which did carry a threat in the closing stages which made QPR fans nervous. "We were definitely shaky after you scored" was their assessment on the tube away from the ground afterwards. As for Canos (and I'm a fan as well), IMO it's Jacob who is keeping him out of the side. The latter played well and he is much better than Redmond at tracking back when the ball is lost and as I said, he only just missed with a lovely swerving shot that hit the crossbar.
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Thanks Rick and it's always good to get the view of someone who's been to the game. I was pleased to see that 'Basil' actually started for once and it was good to rest Jerome once in a while - I just wish he'd do the same for Brady, as I don't think he's had a good game fo weeks now.
Yes, it seems as though Jacob has got back to how he was playing in the first few games, but I'd like to see Canos on the bench occasionally, but I guess I'll get to see him both next Monday and Tue 6th against Swansea and hope we can win both, so that we progress to the last 16 of the Checkatrade Trophy..
 
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Oliveira had to start soon. To justify the hype they made of finally signing a striker. I think it was wrong this week though. Him on his own up front. That's not the kind of player he is!! He's technical. He takes people on. He likes to run and dribble, move out wide.

A lone striker role!?......Why did he ever think that!? Yes he is tall, 6'1 or whatever, but he is in no way a target man or a focal point!!
 
Forgot_My_Lines said:
Oliveira had to start soon. To justify the hype they made of finally signing a striker. I think it was wrong this week though. Him on his own up front. That's not the kind of player he is!! He's technical. He takes people on. He likes to run and dribble, move out wide.

A lone striker role!?......Why did he ever think that!? Yes he is tall, 6'1 or whatever, but he is in no way a target man or a focal point!!
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I've watched Basil playing in the U23 games, he looks strong, can pass accurately has a powerful shot that he's not afraid to use and has good spatial awareness. He needs to play more for the first team with Jerome!
 
ilovedelia said:
I've watched Basil playing in the U23 games, he looks strong, can pass accurately has a powerful shot that he's not afraid to use and has good spatial awareness. He needs to play more for the first team with Jerome!
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What, you mean TWO strikers????? Go and wash your mouth out with soap and water!!!! <laugh>
 
Forgot_My_Lines said:
Oliveira had to start soon. To justify the hype they made of finally signing a striker. I think it was wrong this week though. Him on his own up front. That's not the kind of player he is!! He's technical. He takes people on. He likes to run and dribble, move out wide.

A lone striker role!?......Why did he ever think that!? Yes he is tall, 6'1 or whatever, but he is in no way a target man or a focal point!!
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Oliveira did OK really, but it's hard to judge given that we played with only 10 men after the 2nd minute. He worked hard and ran the channels but his chances were limited by circumstances. He did link up well with Naismith and Jacob at times but QPR always had the extra man to make it difficult. I'd like to see both of them start against Derby to see what they could do with 11 men.
 
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RiverEndRick said:
I'd like to see both of them start against Derby to see what they could do with 11 men.
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I think we need to start off with a 4-4-2, if only to give McClaren - and every other manager in this division, something a little different to ponder.
Far too predictable as things are and so easy for the oppo to negate - witness Wessi's dwindling contributions of late, when he has featured.
 
Cromercanary said:
I think we need to start off with a 4-4-2, if only to give McClaren - and every other manager in this division, something a little different to ponder.
Far too predictable as things are and so easy for the oppo to negate - witness Wessi's dwindling contributions of late, when he has featured.
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I'd love to see it, and if we can attack more, then there will be fewer opportunities for the defence to have another 'lapse'!!!!!
 
Cromercanary said:
I think we need to start off with a 4-4-2, if only to give McClaren - and every other manager in this division, something a little different to ponder. Far too predictable as things are and so easy for the oppo to negate - witness Wessi's dwindling contributions of late, when he has featured.
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I'm not so sure a 4-4-2 is less predictable than a 4-2-3-1 or a 4-1-4-1, Cromer. With Brady dropping back to LB due to Olsson's suspension, we don't have the orthodox wingers to make that work. The strength of our squad is in the central AM role with Wes, Naismith and Pritchard to choose from. None of our strikers are well suited to a 4-4-2 either, IMO. The main disadvantage is the 4 man midfield, especially when playing away from home. I'd prefer to see Naismith playing behind the striker because of his versatility. He has the qualities of a striker when attacking, but he also has the vision to read the game, create space for himself and pick out telling passes to others coming into the box. As important, however, is his abilty to track back when the ball is lost and he was like a terrier in this regard against QPR, which helped to keep us in the game. Wes has developed some ability in this regard, but it is the principal weakness of Pritchard's game. Like Redmond, he seems to lack either the inclination or the ability to take on defensive responsibilities when required.

I'm also not sure that Derby is make or break for AN either, as 3 of our next 4 games are at home. By this week-end, we'll have played 8 games at home and 10 away, whereas Brighton will have played 10 games at home and 8 away. It's crazy that this sort of scheduling occurs and the league table doesn't really mean much until the homes and aways are equal, which will be 4 matches from now.
 
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RiverEndRick said:
As for the comparisons with the U23s, IMO the style is different because the players are different. Had James Morrison been available the style would have been more like the first team with him playing as the AM behind Morris. As for the formation, AN has varied between a 4-2-3-1 and a 4-1-4-1 throughout the season and often shifting to a 4-4-2 for the last 20 minutes or so if we're chasing the game, so it isn't exactly set in stone.
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Interesting that the U23 manager has the ability to change the formation & tactics depending on player availability and form, where as AN ?
 
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oldcanariesfan said:
Hardly a surprise is it ?
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Goes back to the MFW article I posted earlier. They can make popular or deeply unpopular (and sometimes incorrect) decisions, but as long as 26,000 troop in religiously every home match, which they do - (and there's still a waiting list for S/Ts <yikes>) why would they bat an eyelid.
They made it clear in that Times article, it's about what they want, and everybody else - including 'the best fans in the world' can go take a hike :(
 
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Cromercanary said:
Goes back to the MFW article I posted earlier. They can make popular or deeply unpopular (and sometimes incorrect) decisions, but as long as 26,000 troop in religiously every home match, which they do - (and there's still a waiting list for S/Ts <yikes>) why would they bat an eyelid.
They made it clear in that Times article, it's about what they want, and everybody else - including 'the best fans in the world' can go take a hike :(
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Exactly!!!
 
ilovedelia said:
Well it's up to us now, the supporters; if this dire situation continues then we need voice our feelings on match days, it worked with Hughton! We keep being told that "it's our club" and would be nothing without its fantastic support, so we should have a say!
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So as per usual the board backs the manager when it's obvious he's lost the players and most of the supporters. Why, oh why do they do this every time, he's NOT going to turn things around, he's NOT going to get the fans back on board, all that will happen is that a toxic atmosphere will ensue and AN will suffer abuse from the fans.
A man will leave here under a cloud when in reality the club should be saying thanks Alex for those wonderful memories but it's time for you to move on, so he can leave with his head held high.
 
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KIO said:
So as per usual the board backs the manager when it's obvious he's lost the players and most of the supporters. Why, oh why do they do this every time, he's NOT going to turn things around, he's NOT going to get the fans back on board, all that will happen is that a toxic atmosphere will ensue and AN will suffer abuse from the fans.
A man will leave here under a cloud when in reality the club should be saying thanks Alex for those wonderful memories but it's time for you to move on, so he can leave with his head held high.
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Just goes to emphasise how out of touch Delia and co are - how things have changed in 5 years!!!
 
KIO said:
So as per usual the board backs the manager when it's obvious he's lost the players and most of the supporters. Why, oh why do they do this every time, he's NOT going to turn things around, he's NOT going to get the fans back on board, all that will happen is that a toxic atmosphere will ensue and AN will suffer abuse from the fans.
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It would even suggest that they've not even bothered making contingency plans, just in case <yikes> we lose again at Derby and then at home to Brentford?
Edit - if, if we lose at Derby, then Leeds,,Fulham, Sheff Wed, Bristol City and Preston could all, based on their own results, leapfrog us in the table :(
And anyway, KIO, it's NOT obvious he's lost the players, that very nice shimmying two-stepper Mr Ed Balls told me so <ok> (or should that be side-stepper, as in ignoring crucial issues at his club?)

"He knows we've got to do better in the future but at the same time I think he's somebody we know can do this. The players are with him" <doh>
From BBC site: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/38090105
 
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