Head Coach Performance

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Scout73 said:
Bad appts can happen in football but the best clubs will realise it quickly n do something about it. The fact fans are chanting for him to go already says it all, once you lose the fans its a long road back n i just dont see him doing it

He isnt a leader imo, he might be great on the training field but a lot of his job is man management n thats where he fails for me

I dont think hes the only problem with the coaching set up tho, i think whoever comes in nxt has to be allowed to bring in the people they trust. Think keeping dodds n proctor for the sake of contunity is just wrong. We need to be brave as a club to get back to where we should be n i think admitting we made a mistake with Beale should be the start

Of course there will be people saying he needs time to implement his ideas however the way we are playing is identical to how rangers played under him

A bad start against stoke n the ground will turn toxic. The atmosphere sounded so bad last night n the loudest we were, was when he got boo'd at the time - never a good sign
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Need to give him a chance and frankly if we do sack him the person who appointed him should be booted out too. You can't give an inexperienced manager with a development pedigree less than 2 months. It would be ridiculous. Did I want him? No. Do I like him? Not particularly..but he deserves more of a chance than some are giving him. The performances and structure of team.under him nowhere near as bad as some make out. The mistake.was appointing him but at least give him a.chance.
 
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Mackem74 said:
Need to give him a chance and frankly if we do sack him the person who appointed him should be booted out too. You can't give an inexperienced manager with a development pedigree less than 2 months. It would be ridiculous. Did I want him? No. Do I like him? Not particularly..but he deserves more of a chance than some are giving him. The performances and structure of team.under him nowhere near as bad as some make out. The mistake.was appointing him but at least give him a.chance.
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This ^^ Exactly how I feel about the whole thing.
 
Mackem74 said:
Need to give him a chance and frankly if we do sack him the person who appointed him should be booted out too. You can't give an inexperienced manager with a development pedigree less than 2 months. It would be ridiculous. Did I want him? No. Do I like him? Not particularly..but he deserves more of a chance than some are giving him. The performances and structure of team.under him nowhere near as bad as some make out. The mistake.was appointing him but at least give him a.chance.
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He’s had one. We’ve seen enough. Joke of an appointment.
 
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It's not looking good for him and I can't see any signs of improvement any time soon.
This could be a new record for the least number of games for a Sunderland manager.
- currently held by Paolo Di Canio who reached 13.

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RTB said:
It's not looking good for him and I can't see any signs of improvement any time soon.
This could be a new record for the least number of games for a Sunderland manager.
- currently held by Paolo Di Canio who reached 13.

You must log in or register to see images
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Aye, looking back we wouldn’t have had any of this if we’d listened to him.
 
You cannot separate player ability and coach performance as if there is no relationship. There is. A key ingredient to our performance levels not being as good as last year is the squad is considerably poorer. In my opinion that is inarguable. It would have been impossible for Mowbray to replicate what he did because he had been given a sub-standard tool kit.

The presence and experience we have lost is ridiculous. Baath, Gooch, Stewart, Embleton. The talent of Amad. The invaluable contributions of Michut and Gelhardt. The recruitment team have failed the coaching team badly with the players brought in. They look way below the level they need to be at. And please dont say they havent had a chance, no coach worth anything would play a player if he thought they werent good enough. This is elite level, not grassroots, or academy football. You dont put players into a team hunting playoffs to develop them. If Mowbray thought Hemir was the answer, Hemir would have played. Same with Adil. I keep reading he had his favourites which is just nonsense really, he was a professional who knew he needed to get results to keep his job. If these players were up to it they would have played. Mid table is about their level as a group.

Now Beale has definitely had a poor start. Everyone knows I think the Mowbray sacking was an appalling decision and I dare say somebody has some serious questions to answer there. I accept performances were in decline, but it was a sacking they seemed desperate to make, and some fans seemed desperate to see. I said at the time the most inexperienced squad in the league, and a really inexperienced hierarchy, needed an experienced man. It is crystal clear the players were relying on Mowbray for that experienced conversation and words of guidance. The club thought they could get some young overseas coach and we would have the De Zerbi affect. It was naive in the extreme. Why would a coach on the up come here. They arent stupid and they know the squad has gone backwards. They probably also know you get the bullet if you have a poor run. Any aspiring young coach will think twice about us, trust me. Even more so if we dont let them bring their own team along for the ride. We seem so naieve when it comes to coaches and what they need to be successful it is mind boggling. I honestly dont think Speakman knows what it takes to be an elite coach at this level, and when they land in his lap he cant deal with them.

So Beale can be criticised. I have no problem with that. But if anyone thinks a new coach, without his own team, without some serious investment in the squad, and without time, will walk in and have us flying at the top end of this league I would suggest they are sorely mistaken. We had a golden opportunity in the summer window to make decisions that would make this team push on. We failed to do so. We can sack Beale, but be prepared for another 2 week piss about and then appointing somebody who is free. If they do it then just get somebody like Nathan Jones in immediately and give him allowances regarding playing squad. But for god sake give him 3 or 4 championship hardened players to help this squad out. They will need to pay him mind...
 
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FellTop said:
You cannot separate player ability and coach performance as if there is no relationship. There is. A key ingredient to our performance levels not being as good as last year is the squad is considerably poorer. In my opinion that is inarguable. It would have been impossible for Mowbray to replicate what he did because he had been given a sub-standard tool kit.

The presence and experience we have lost is ridiculous. Baath, Gooch, Stewart, Embleton. The talent of Amad. The invaluable contributions of Michut and Gelhardt. The recruitment team have failed the coaching team badly with the players brought in. They look way below the level they need to be at. And please dont say they havent had a chance, no coach worth anything would play a player if he thought they werent good enough. This is elite level, not grassroots, or academy football. You dont put players into a team hunting playoffs to develop them. If Mowbray thought Hemir was the answer, Hemir would have played. Same with Adil. I keep reading he had his favourites which is just nonsense really, he was a professional who knew he needed to get results to keep his job. If these players were up to it they would have played. Mid table is about their level as a group.

Now Beale has definitely had a poor start. Everyone knows I think the Mowbray sacking was an appalling decision and I dare say somebody has some serious questions to answer there. I accept performances were in decline, but it was a sacking they seemed desperate to make, and some fans seemed desperate to see. I said at the time the most inexperienced squad in the league, and a really inexperienced hierarchy, needed an experienced man. It is crystal clear the players were relying on Mowbray for that experienced conversation and words of guidance. The club thought they could get some young overseas coach and we would have the De Zerbi affect. It was naive in the extreme. Why would a coach on the up come here. They arent stupid and they know the squad has gone backwards. They probably also know you get the bullet if you have a poor run. Any aspiring young coach will think twice about us, trust me. Even more so if we dont let them bring their own team along for the ride. We seem so naieve when it comes to coaches and what they need to be successful it is mind boggling. I honestly dont think Speakman knows what it takes to be an elite coach at this level, and when they land in his lap he cant deal with them.

So Beale can be criticised. I have no problem with that. But if anyone thinks a new coach, without his own team, without some serious investment in the squad, and without time, will walk in and have us flying at the top end of this league I would suggest they are sorely mistaken. We had a golden opportunity in the summer window to make decisions that would make this team push on. We failed to do so. We can sack Beale, but be prepared for another 2 week piss about and then appointing somebody who is free. If they do it then just get somebody like Nathan Jones in immediately and give him allowances regarding playing squad. But for god sake give him 3 or 4 championship hardened players to help this squad out. They will need to pay him mind...
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Cracking post and sums it very well in my opinion.

We have over achieved and unfortunately just don't have that x factor this season to get us out of sticky spots
 
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FellTop said:
You cannot separate player ability and coach performance as if there is no relationship. There is. A key ingredient to our performance levels not being as good as last year is the squad is considerably poorer. In my opinion that is inarguable. It would have been impossible for Mowbray to replicate what he did because he had been given a sub-standard tool kit.

The presence and experience we have lost is ridiculous. Baath, Gooch, Stewart, Embleton. The talent of Amad. The invaluable contributions of Michut and Gelhardt. The recruitment team have failed the coaching team badly with the players brought in. They look way below the level they need to be at. And please dont say they havent had a chance, no coach worth anything would play a player if he thought they werent good enough. This is elite level, not grassroots, or academy football. You dont put players into a team hunting playoffs to develop them. If Mowbray thought Hemir was the answer, Hemir would have played. Same with Adil. I keep reading he had his favourites which is just nonsense really, he was a professional who knew he needed to get results to keep his job. If these players were up to it they would have played. Mid table is about their level as a group.

Now Beale has definitely had a poor start. Everyone knows I think the Mowbray sacking was an appalling decision and I dare say somebody has some serious questions to answer there. I accept performances were in decline, but it was a sacking they seemed desperate to make, and some fans seemed desperate to see. I said at the time the most inexperienced squad in the league, and a really inexperienced hierarchy, needed an experienced man. It is crystal clear the players were relying on Mowbray for that experienced conversation and words of guidance. The club thought they could get some young overseas coach and we would have the De Zerbi affect. It was naive in the extreme. Why would a coach on the up come here. They arent stupid and they know the squad has gone backwards. They probably also know you get the bullet if you have a poor run. Any aspiring young coach will think twice about us, trust me. Even more so if we dont let them bring their own team along for the ride. We seem so naieve when it comes to coaches and what they need to be successful it is mind boggling. I honestly dont think Speakman knows what it takes to be an elite coach at this level, and when they land in his lap he cant deal with them.

So Beale can be criticised. I have no problem with that. But if anyone thinks a new coach, without his own team, without some serious investment in the squad, and without time, will walk in and have us flying at the top end of this league I would suggest they are sorely mistaken. We had a golden opportunity in the summer window to make decisions that would make this team push on. We failed to do so. We can sack Beale, but be prepared for another 2 week piss about and then appointing somebody who is free. If they do it then just get somebody like Nathan Jones in immediately and give him allowances regarding playing squad. But for god sake give him 3 or 4 championship hardened players to help this squad out. They will need to pay him mind...
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I don’t think anybody, well at least I don’t, expect a new coach to suddenly make everything rosey. As you say there’s no golden bullet here. But this guy just isn’t the right fit and it’s pretty clear.

I remember the national press saying the club were really taken aback by the fan reaction when he was leaked and the writing has been on the wall since then frankly. I feared he’d never win those doubters around, and he won’t. What I hadn’t expected was that so many of those who were willing to give him a chance, would turn so quickly.

personally I’d just have Dodds until end of season and then appoint a first choice in the summer, somebody who the fans can get behind.

rightly or wrongly, a figurehead the fans believe in is so important for a football side. Beale may well be a tremendous coach and I have no ill feeling towards him as a human. But he is just not a figurehead. Certainly not for us.
 
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FellTop said:
You cannot separate player ability and coach performance as if there is no relationship. There is. A key ingredient to our performance levels not being as good as last year is the squad is considerably poorer. In my opinion that is inarguable. It would have been impossible for Mowbray to replicate what he did because he had been given a sub-standard tool kit.

The presence and experience we have lost is ridiculous. Baath, Gooch, Stewart, Embleton. The talent of Amad. The invaluable contributions of Michut and Gelhardt. The recruitment team have failed the coaching team badly with the players brought in. They look way below the level they need to be at. And please dont say they havent had a chance, no coach worth anything would play a player if he thought they werent good enough. This is elite level, not grassroots, or academy football. You dont put players into a team hunting playoffs to develop them. If Mowbray thought Hemir was the answer, Hemir would have played. Same with Adil. I keep reading he had his favourites which is just nonsense really, he was a professional who knew he needed to get results to keep his job. If these players were up to it they would have played. Mid table is about their level as a group.

Now Beale has definitely had a poor start. Everyone knows I think the Mowbray sacking was an appalling decision and I dare say somebody has some serious questions to answer there. I accept performances were in decline, but it was a sacking they seemed desperate to make, and some fans seemed desperate to see. I said at the time the most inexperienced squad in the league, and a really inexperienced hierarchy, needed an experienced man. It is crystal clear the players were relying on Mowbray for that experienced conversation and words of guidance. The club thought they could get some young overseas coach and we would have the De Zerbi affect. It was naive in the extreme. Why would a coach on the up come here. They arent stupid and they know the squad has gone backwards. They probably also know you get the bullet if you have a poor run. Any aspiring young coach will think twice about us, trust me. Even more so if we dont let them bring their own team along for the ride. We seem so naieve when it comes to coaches and what they need to be successful it is mind boggling. I honestly dont think Speakman knows what it takes to be an elite coach at this level, and when they land in his lap he cant deal with them.

So Beale can be criticised. I have no problem with that. But if anyone thinks a new coach, without his own team, without some serious investment in the squad, and without time, will walk in and have us flying at the top end of this league I would suggest they are sorely mistaken. We had a golden opportunity in the summer window to make decisions that would make this team push on. We failed to do so. We can sack Beale, but be prepared for another 2 week piss about and then appointing somebody who is free. If they do it then just get somebody like Nathan Jones in immediately and give him allowances regarding playing squad. But for god sake give him 3 or 4 championship hardened players to help this squad out. They will need to pay him mind...
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Probably the best post about Beale and the situation.
 
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FellTop said:
You cannot separate player ability and coach performance as if there is no relationship. There is. A key ingredient to our performance levels not being as good as last year is the squad is considerably poorer. In my opinion that is inarguable. It would have been impossible for Mowbray to replicate what he did because he had been given a sub-standard tool kit.

The presence and experience we have lost is ridiculous. Baath, Gooch, Stewart, Embleton. The talent of Amad. The invaluable contributions of Michut and Gelhardt. The recruitment team have failed the coaching team badly with the players brought in. They look way below the level they need to be at. And please dont say they havent had a chance, no coach worth anything would play a player if he thought they werent good enough. This is elite level, not grassroots, or academy football. You dont put players into a team hunting playoffs to develop them. If Mowbray thought Hemir was the answer, Hemir would have played. Same with Adil. I keep reading he had his favourites which is just nonsense really, he was a professional who knew he needed to get results to keep his job. If these players were up to it they would have played. Mid table is about their level as a group.

Now Beale has definitely had a poor start. Everyone knows I think the Mowbray sacking was an appalling decision and I dare say somebody has some serious questions to answer there. I accept performances were in decline, but it was a sacking they seemed desperate to make, and some fans seemed desperate to see. I said at the time the most inexperienced squad in the league, and a really inexperienced hierarchy, needed an experienced man. It is crystal clear the players were relying on Mowbray for that experienced conversation and words of guidance. The club thought they could get some young overseas coach and we would have the De Zerbi affect. It was naive in the extreme. Why would a coach on the up come here. They arent stupid and they know the squad has gone backwards. They probably also know you get the bullet if you have a poor run. Any aspiring young coach will think twice about us, trust me. Even more so if we dont let them bring their own team along for the ride. We seem so naieve when it comes to coaches and what they need to be successful it is mind boggling. I honestly dont think Speakman knows what it takes to be an elite coach at this level, and when they land in his lap he cant deal with them.

So Beale can be criticised. I have no problem with that. But if anyone thinks a new coach, without his own team, without some serious investment in the squad, and without time, will walk in and have us flying at the top end of this league I would suggest they are sorely mistaken. We had a golden opportunity in the summer window to make decisions that would make this team push on. We failed to do so. We can sack Beale, but be prepared for another 2 week piss about and then appointing somebody who is free. If they do it then just get somebody like Nathan Jones in immediately and give him allowances regarding playing squad. But for god sake give him 3 or 4 championship hardened players to help this squad out. They will need to pay him mind...
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Excellent post mate. A perfect description of how things truly are.
 
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Speakman and his poor recruitment are to blame, the new manager has very little chance to do well, it would be very difficult to fill TM's shoes
Mind, last night was awful
 
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I think beale will be here until the end of the season at least unless its absolutely catastrophic. Problem is I think the next head coach is dodds, that's why he got the assistant job, and then we will just carry on as we are
 
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