Off Topic General Election

yorkshirehornet said:
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If you read these papers........ beware

I understand that the Sun may be prosecuted for its headline this morning
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I have never seen newspapers in the rest of Europe telling their readers how to vote in the way the British press do - at least not so directly. The character of some of the press in the Uk. makes me ashamed of my country - and I don't want to feel that way. To think that there are some people in the rest of Europe who still think that Britain is a model of democracy <laugh> (although I understand it's nothing to laugh about).
 
colognehornet said:
I have never seen newspapers in the rest of Europe telling their readers how to vote in the way the British press do - at least not so directly. The character of some of the press in the Uk. makes me ashamed of my country - and I don't want to feel that way. To think that there are some people in the rest of Europe who still think that Britain is a model of democracy <laugh> (although I understand it's nothing to laugh about).
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I cannot say that I read many of the European papers apart from the French ones. It is very true that they provide a real insight into what candidates are saying, with the pros and cons, but then largely they allow the voters to make up their own minds. I can only guess that they believe that people are mature enough to work things out without having them spoon feeding them.
 
It is the very same rags with non dom tax dodging owners that are scared of losing their money. It always comes to this. As much as I have a genuine dislike for Corbyn (I come from an Army family) I hope he gets in and takes them for every penny that he can.
 
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I have over the past couple of days found election material from all of the main candidates for the French parliamentary elections in my letter box. Four pages from each of them, giving detailed facts and figures about why you should vote for them. If the average person here is able to read and understand, why is it not thought possible to tell the UK elector similar facts and figures?
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
I have over the past couple of days found election material from all of the main candidates for the French parliamentary elections in my letter box. Four pages from each of them, giving detailed facts and figures about why you should vote for them. If the average person here is able to read and understand, why is it not thought possible to tell the UK elector similar facts and figures?
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Because politics is a game to the major parties here? I've received similar from the SNP, yet the Tory (or Ruth's Party as it calls itself here) version bangs on about stopping the SNP, Independence and very little else, as does the LibDem version. Unbelievably, the Labour version promotes voting Tory to stop the SNP...

After the flooding we had here yesterday I was half expecting the Polling Station to be closed - thankfully the Emergency Services worked wonders overnight, pumping the water into the sea. The fully-funded by the SNP Emergency Services I should add... :)
 
In the Channel Islands, we get the UK dailies and I just find 4 things that I like about them - sports pages, crosswords and other puzzles, non-political cartoons and TV listings. The Jersey Evening Post has no political bias - that's relatively easy when nearly all your politicians are independents, although the group calling itself Reform Jersey may change that if they learn from the mistakes made by the former Jersey Democratic Alliance. That had people standing for all seats, and most of them were standing for re-election. Normally, if you are standing for re-election, you'll get voted back in due to the low turnouts here, but 3 of the JDA members lost their seats and none of those who weren't already in the States got in - they disbanded after that.
 
Just to add on the press here in Spain the press certainly back a side.

Strangely here the Socialists (the old party called PSOE) has a leader who resigned on principal but then went to the grass roots and was re-elected. Sort of a parallel with Corbyn but the guy here is a bit of a looker. He certainly speaks his mind and is honest.

But enjoy the night one and all
 
colognehornet said:
Of course it was 'not good enough', it is only 'good enough' when the last Tory has left Westminster.
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Corbyn has been walking around smirking like a cat, somebody needs to remind him he actually lost and was well behind the Tories in votes and seats. The expectation was so bad that a heavy defeat is seen as a victory. The Labour Party has fallen that low.
 
superhorns said:
Corbyn has been walking around smirking like a cat, somebody needs to remind him he actually lost and was well behind the Tories in votes and seats. The expectation was so bad that a heavy defeat is seen as a victory. The Labour Party has fallen that low.
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They were 2% behind SH. That does not constitute a heavy defeat. Their result proved 2 things - firstly that it is possible for a left leaning Labour Party to top 40%, and secondly that the youth can be mobilized to vote - thus by passing the right wing media. He has also cemented his position in the party through this result. It is also now a known fact that he can outperform May, and they are well set up for winning a repeat election - which, the Tories will certainly try to avoid.
 
The Tories won and Labour lost - that is a simple fact. In number of votes and in MPs elected.
But the Tories must feel like they lost and Labour that they won - a paradox.
If neither party learns from the election though things are not likely to change much from here.
The Tories need to try to find a leader who actually understands what it is like to be an ordinary person rather than just saying they do. They also need to try to come up with some real decent policies. In this election they managed to annoy just about everyone - not least people who had been prepared to vote for them.
Labour need to understand that people like to be bribed and will vote for their own self interest but that people also need to believe that they can deliver. The Tories totally failed to hit at the credibility of Labour's giveaway promises. They ignored economics because TM cannot stand Philip Hammond and kept him in a cupboard. That would not happen again. If I were a Tory in this election I would have pointed out that JC would again bankrupt the UK and that this time it would need even more years of austerity to follow - I wonder how many people would vote for another 10 years of real government cuts.
What I fail to understand is why the LibDems failed to propose strong centrist policies which allied to their anti brexit stance should have given them far more votes. Instead Farron spent the entire election sniping at TM. When will politicians learn that the public prefer positive visions to fear and hate.
 
EdHorn said:
The Tories won and Labour lost - that is a simple fact. In number of votes and in MPs elected.
But the Tories must feel like they lost and Labour that they won - a paradox.
If neither party learns from the election though things are not likely to change much from here.
The Tories need to try to find a leader who actually understands what it is like to be an ordinary person rather than just saying they do. They also need to try to come up with some real decent policies. In this election they managed to annoy just about everyone - not least people who had been prepared to vote for them.
Labour need to understand that people like to be bribed and will vote for their own self interest but that people also need to believe that they can deliver. The Tories totally failed to hit at the credibility of Labour's giveaway promises. They ignored economics because TM cannot stand Philip Hammond and kept him in a cupboard. That would not happen again. If I were a Tory in this election I would have pointed out that JC would again bankrupt the UK and that this time it would need even more years of austerity to follow - I wonder how many people would vote for another 10 years of real government cuts.
What I fail to understand is why the LibDems failed to propose strong centrist policies which allied to their anti brexit stance should have given them far more votes. Instead Farron spent the entire election sniping at TM. When will politicians learn that the public prefer positive visions to fear and hate.
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That would suggest that he's done it before which is not true, the global financial crash was not caused by the Labour Party, in fact it was Gordon Brown's intervention which saved it from being much worse!

Edit:- I highlighted this which didn't show up in post:-

I would have pointed out that JC would again bankrupt the UK and that this time it would need even more years of austerity to follow
 
colognehornet said:
They were 2% behind SH. That does not constitute a heavy defeat. Their result proved 2 things - firstly that it is possible for a left leaning Labour Party to top 40%, and secondly that the youth can be mobilized to vote - thus by passing the right wing media. He has also cemented his position in the party through this result. It is also now a known fact that he can outperform May, and they are well set up for winning a repeat election - which, the Tories will certainly try to avoid.
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Labour have nearly 60 seats less than the Tories, most would describe that as a substantial defeat. The heads of the young were turned by the unaffordable student costs bribe. I'm glad he is there to stay he is one of the Tories best assets.
 
EdHorn said:
The Tories won and Labour lost - that is a simple fact. In number of votes and in MPs elected.
But the Tories must feel like they lost and Labour that they won - a paradox.
If neither party learns from the election though things are not likely to change much from here.
The Tories need to try to find a leader who actually understands what it is like to be an ordinary person rather than just saying they do. They also need to try to come up with some real decent policies. In this election they managed to annoy just about everyone - not least people who had been prepared to vote for them.
Labour need to understand that people like to be bribed and will vote for their own self interest but that people also need to believe that they can deliver. The Tories totally failed to hit at the credibility of Labour's giveaway promises. They ignored economics because TM cannot stand Philip Hammond and kept him in a cupboard. That would not happen again. If I were a Tory in this election I would have pointed out that JC would again bankrupt the UK and that this time it would need even more years of austerity to follow - I wonder how many people would vote for another 10 years of real government cuts.
What I fail to understand is why the LibDems failed to propose strong centrist policies which allied to their anti brexit stance should have given them far more votes. Instead Farron spent the entire election sniping at TM. When will politicians learn that the public prefer positive visions to fear and hate.
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Ed. It has been stated here many times, and proved by many economists, that the idea that Tories are better for the economy is a myth. It is also a fact that if you compare the records of Tory and Labour years in office, since 1945, the Tories have spent more (per year in office) and also borrowed more, and repaid less than Labour has. It is the Tories who will eventually bankrupt Britain by a) the legal costs of Brexit and b) endangering our relationship to our best partners and customers. It is they who are pedalling the dangerous illusion that there can be such a thing as a successfull Brexit - because no deal, of any sort, can be better than the one we have already.
 
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