Indeed. The risk v reward just doesn’t stack up to hold off, at least based on what we know. Seems over-cautious.
Off Topic Coronavirus
- Thread starter Sooperhoop
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Indeed. The risk v reward just doesn’t stack up to hold off, at least based on what we know. Seems over-cautious.
I read somewhere a few days ago that this blood clotting had occurred after people in different Countries had been vaccinated from the same Batch of the AZ vaccine, which had been distruted in 17 European Countries including Austria and Denmark, but not the UK. I wonder if it's possible that there is something wrong with this particular Batch of the vaccine, which seemed to be the implication in that News report as the clotting apparently has not been reported in the UK. Any experts know?
Absolutely.
Makes you wonder what The Netherlands, Ireland etc are up to suspending the roll out.
More politics being played maybe?
It’s possible that there is one contaminated batch, but that does not say much for the quality control systems either of AZ or the regulators, who run checks on all batches. Admittedly all are working under extreme pressure to keep volume up. However, even if there is a problem with a batch or two, the incidence of clotting is still so low as to be within ‘normal’ expectations regardless of vaccination.
Dunno Col. excessive caution more likely. Delaying jabs doesn’t help anyone. Like Blymie above I do recall now being asked if I was on a any blood thinning medication when I got my jab, so perhaps there is a perceived risk here too. But the numbers of incidents available to the public at least are tiny. It would be chronically daft, not to mention illegal, for either AZ or the regulator to suppress safety information.
Also just noticed that vaccination passports, of a type, already exist. I have the NHS app on my phone (not the test and trace app) because it makes repeat prescriptions very quick and easy. I noticed today that in my health record/medicines section the dose of vaccine I had on 3 March is recorded in some detail. Presumably this is a more dependable ‘proof’ of vaccination than the little card they give you with the batch number on when you get the jab. Quite impressed that everything is joined up enough to get on my central record, especially as I didn’t book the jab via my GP.
My mrs is on blood thinners, her consultant informed her that they ask that question due to any excessive bleeding when being injected with the needle.
In Norway the Government Health organisation are reporting today that 3 health workers became seriously ill after getting the AZ vaccination. What was common to the 3 was blood clotting, low blood platelets, and after that bleeding inside the head, an uncommon combination apparently. One of them a previously healthy woman under 50 died yesterday, the 2 others are in a serious condition, one partially responding to treatment. Another person died earlier after taking the AZ vaccine. I can well understand why they want to check any correlation between these serious illness and the AZ vaccine, before starting the vaccinations with AZ again. Seems similar has been reported in various European countries.
Now that is odd description Oslo, low platelets mean your blood can't clot (usually). Likewise intracranial bleeds are also not really a symptom.There are anecdotal responses of flu vaccines having a problem, if the patient is on warferin (blood thinning ) medication
"fatal intracranial bleeding possibly due to an interaction between warfarin and inactivated influenza vaccination"
Looks as though half the cases are reported as thrombosis and causing clots...there are another series of reports of near the opposite action.
As Stan says if you look at the number of jabs given, these do not really become statistically significant above the norm, but that does not help the individuals.
If it is one batch...then there might be a connection that needs following up
It’s very odd indeed.
One thing is sure though, that a significant number of people in the countries where the use of the AZ vaccine has been suspended, and possibly elsewhere (like here) will be extremely reluctant to have it when jabs are resumed. This will be another brake on the vaccination programme.
If people start digging into this with just a bit of knowledge the whole thing could grind to a halt. There are 63 pages of yellow card analysis (those reports of health issues post a vaccine jab) for the AZ vaccine and 61 for the Pfizer one, in pdfs in the attached link. It is impossible to say how many of these issues were directly linked to the vaccine and how serious (death or something else is the level of granularity) they are. I can imagine looking at these could be terrifying, but honestly it isn’t.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...irus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting
They were reports of one Batch before the weekend but not mentioned with regard to the 3 health workers in Norway today. Though it has been in Italy. People who have had the AZ jab in Norway are being asked by Health authorities to contact a hospital if they have blue marks under their skin.without a known cause and that don't go away when pressed with a glass, bad sickness for more than 3 days, or signs of a stroke.
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France, Germany and Italy all suspended Astra Zeneca vaccine now. This really doesn't seem wise, people there were already reluctant to take this jab after Macron's stupid comments. Not good.
From what I’m reading the level of blood clots and related issues in those who have had the AZ vaccine is actually lower than you would expect in the same number of the general population.
This response from these countries is nuts, unless they have info which they are not sharing with anyone else. Otherwise it’s lemming like behaviour, and as you say the damage to confidence will be immense.
It’s ours too. If large numbers of people aren’t vaccinated anywhere in the world it increases the number of hosts in whom the virus can mutate perhaps to a degree that the current vaccines won’t work at all. When that, inevitably, gets here, it all starts again.
The numbers with these side effects seem tiny. The risks they tell you about before you give consent to general anaesthesia are much more scary.
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Something really strange is going on. I don’t want to believe it’s political, but it’s a choice between that, mass idiocy, or information being withheld.
Even the BBC were today questioning whether it may be political, to take attention away from their own poor roll out.
But this will just make their roll out worse! And Norway isn’t even in the EU.......I’m still inclining to mass hysteria amongst the decision making classes....
****ing weird, to put it mildly.