Off Topic Coronavirus

[qprbeth]

I certainly wasn't having a dig mate.
You've forgotten more about most of this stuff than most of us will ever know.
As you say, just trying to get the best perspective on it that I can.
You and Beth are very anti the government, so maybe this tips you more a certain way.
Then again, you may be spot on and the government certainly deserve an awful lot of criticism on their handling of this thing.
The worrying thing for me is that we may waste more months before finding out who's right.

You are very right with your comments about this Col.
I have admitted that although what the government are saying seems wrong to what I have been taught and actually what I have done myself in raising antibodies in animals ( which is not quite the same I agree). I have said several times...show me the proof.

Which I have yet to see.

As Stan says the Oxford vaccine now seems to be more effective in one dose 79% than it was as a double doses initially. But maybe they have more results.but it is yet to be published. But the evidence may now be there...and it is right

You are also right Col, I am very anti-government in this. ...I was always ready to admit that no-one would get it right, it is a completely novel experience ; handling a pandemic..my objection has been to the lies, the exaggeration and the u-turns.
Please just tell the truth and when you make a mistake... apologize.

I will take the vaccine the second it is offered...and will happily take the second doses whenever offered 21 days or 12 weeks...just give it to me
That is the only way to get through this.

I too am going to step back...after just saying one last time. Take care of yourselves...every small thing you can do to reduce the risk do it please.

Take the vaccine when offered.

Because it is not a hoax.
It might be a mess but it is not hoax.
(But I will not step back from confronting the Covid-deniers though. I know enough people who are extremely ill and a few people who have now lost dear loved ones to the imaginary virus, to do that.)

Nearly 1000 families are finding that it is real every day

 

[Sooperhoop]

Latest rates per 100k not looking too good. My area has risen from 150ish to 861 in 5 weeks. Tier 5 on it's way? This sort of thing really beggars belief...

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[rangercol]

Latest rates per 100k not looking too good. My area has risen from 150ish to 861 in 5 weeks. Tier 5 on it's way? This sort of thing really beggars belief...

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Beggars belief.
As I said before and got criticism for it, we are getting the ****ing pandemic we deserve.

Utter ****wittery.

 

[rangercol]

You are very right with your comments about this Col.
I have admitted that although what the government are saying seems wrong to what I have been taught and actually what I have done myself in raising antibodies in animals ( which is not quite the same I agree). I have said several times...show me the proof.

Which I have yet to see.

As Stan says the Oxford vaccine now seems to be more effective in one dose 79% than it was as a double doses initially. But maybe they have more results.but it is yet to be published. But the evidence may now be there...and it is right

You are also right Col, I am very anti-government in this. ...I was always ready to admit that no-one would get it right, it is a completely novel experience ; handling a pandemic..my objection has been to the lies, the exaggeration and the u-turns.
Please just tell the truth and when you make a mistake... apologize.

I will take the vaccine the second it is offered...and will happily take the second doses whenever offered 21 days or 12 weeks...just give it to me
That is the only way to get through this.

I too am going to step back...after just saying one last time. Take care of yourselves...every small thing you can do to reduce the risk do it please.

Take the vaccine when offered.

Because it is not a hoax.
It might be a mess but it is not hoax.
(But I will not step back from confronting the Covid-deniers though. I know enough people who are extremely ill and a few people who have now lost dear loved ones to the imaginary virus, to do that.)

Nearly 1000 families are finding that it is real every day

Please don't take a step back.
You're scientific knowledge and input is incredibly helpful.

 

[Steelmonkey]

Latest rates per 100k not looking too good. My area has risen from 150ish to 861 in 5 weeks.

We've gone from around 60 to over 200 in four days, with two outbreaks at local Tesco stores and one at a nightclub that was doing "socially distanced" tables, but was caught having mass partying during the Scottish Cup final two weeks ago...

 

[sb_73]

We've gone from around 60 to over 200 in four days, with two outbreaks at local Tesco stores and one at a nightclub that was doing "socially distanced" tables, but was caught having mass partying during the Scottish Cup final two weeks ago...

This breaks it down to ward level. My ward is at 362, but the one which starts 200 yards down the road is 153. Odd.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/interactive-map

Oops England only.

 

[ELLERS]

Latest rates per 100k not looking too good. My area has risen from 150ish to 861 in 5 weeks. Tier 5 on it's way? This sort of thing really beggars belief...

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Disgusting 2222's! However, they are not to blame remember.

 

[ELLERS]

I too am going to step back...after just saying one last time. Take care of yourselves...every small thing you can do to reduce the risk do it please.

Sod that, you stay right here. You have explained a few things to me on this thread and I learn more after reading some of your posts. I don't care about a 'beef with the government' your insight and views on this subject are respected.
plus I was going to ask you a question on 'Antibodies' so you need to be around.

 

[qprbeth]

Okay hit me with your antibody question Ellers....

Got to admit I have got quite a big beef with some of the advisors too. Some of their showings have been an embarrassment....still holding out that Jean Claude Van Damme might give us good information...but Witty and Valance leave my blood cold.

 

[mustyfrog]

we have 12 active cases in Queensland, all returning overseas travellers who are in hotel quarantine for 14 days, our borders are CLOSED to anyone from declared hotspots in NSW and Victoria

 

[ELLERS]

Okay hit me with your antibody question Ellers....

Got to admit I have got quite a big beef with some of the advisors too. Some of their showings have been an embarrassment....still holding out that Jean Claude Van Damme might give us good information...but Witty and Valance leave my blood cold.

Okay, here we go I have 2 questions

1. let's just say when I was ill in February... it was Covid If I had an Antibody test now it would tell me if I have the antibodies (i had it) correct?
Now let's just say the government does manage to get all the vaccinations done And I get a jab in May/June. I then have an Antibody test would it tell me if I had Covid in the past?

2. let's say my body does have the antibodies (asymptomatic) what advantages do vaccines have if my body already fights it?
I hope that makes sense. thanks

 

[qprbeth]

We are not sure how long the antibodies remain detectable...but those antibodies are made by B lymphocytes with the help of memory T lymphocytes. We think they last a lot longer.

So if you had an antibody test now, you may or may not still be positive...but your body should still be able to fall back on your lymphocytes and they should be able to mount a good response...and you should be pretty well protected ,( if everything works as it should in the books.

2. So you have antibodies...and you get a vaccine. Nothing bad will happen... But the vaccine will give your immune system a kick up the ars*. And those B cells will start giving you even more antibodies...and your anti Virus response will be super strong.

Is that any good.


It is better and cheaper and quicker and perfectly safe just to give you the vaccine rather than mess around with testing people to see if they have ever seen the virus before

 

[ELLERS]

We are not sure how long the antibodies remain detectable...but those antibodies are made by B lymphocytes with the help of memory T lymphocytes. We think they last a lot longer.

So if you had an antibody test now, you may or may not still be positive...but your body should still be able to fall back on your lymphocytes and they should be able to mount a good response...and you should be pretty well protected ,( if everything works as it should in the books.

2. So you have antibodies...and you get a vaccine. Nothing bad will happen... But the vaccine will give your immune system a kick up the ars*. And those B cells will start giving you even more antibodies...and your anti Virus response will be super strong.

Is that any good.


It is better and cheaper and quicker and perfectly safe just to give you the vaccine rather than mess around with testing people to see if they have ever seen the virus before

Thanks, Beth that was perfectly explained.

 

[Steelmonkey]

Okay, here we go I have 2 questions

1. let's just say when I was ill in February... it was Covid If I had an Antibody test now it would tell me if I have the antibodies (i had it) correct?
Now let's just say the government does manage to get all the vaccinations done And I get a jab in May/June. I then have an Antibody test would it tell me if I had Covid in the past?

2. let's say my body does have the antibodies (asymptomatic) what advantages do vaccines have if my body already fights it?
I hope that makes sense. thanks

I had Covid back in April, and was antibody tested in September at work, and it came back negative - not saying they weren't there, but I believe you have to have very sensitive tests to pick up the antibodies after that time.

 

[Steelmonkey]

2. So you have antibodies...and you get a vaccine. Nothing bad will happen... But the vaccine will give your immune system a kick up the ars*. And those B cells will start giving you even more antibodies...and your anti Virus response will be super strong.

Is that any good.


It is better and cheaper and quicker and perfectly safe just to give you the vaccine rather than mess around with testing people to see if they have ever seen the virus before

Next question Beth - my wife has been advised against vaccine at the moment as they don't know how her immune system will react as she is still recovering from Long Covid. She tells me (she's the nurse, so I listen) that Long Covid has sent her immune system into overdrive, which is why there are so many differing symptoms. Any idea from your experience as to how the vaccine would effect her?

 

[Woodyhoopleson]

Okay, here we go I have 2 questions

1. let's just say when I was ill in February... it was Covid If I had an Antibody test now it would tell me if I have the antibodies (i had it) correct?
Now let's just say the government does manage to get all the vaccinations done And I get a jab in May/June. I then have an Antibody test would it tell me if I had Covid in the past?

2. let's say my body does have the antibodies (asymptomatic) what advantages do vaccines have if my body already fights it?
I hope that makes sense. thanks

Did you not listen to any of that Mike Yeadon stuff I posted? He is very well versed on immunology. You would learn a lot.

 

[bobmid]

Next question Beth - my wife has been advised against vaccine at the moment as they don't know how her immune system will react as she is still recovering from Long Covid. She tells me (she's the nurse, so I listen) that Long Covid has sent her immune system into overdrive, which is why there are so many differing symptoms. Any idea from your experience as to how the vaccine would effect her?

Very good question mate

 

[Didley Squat]

we have 12 active cases in Queensland, all returning overseas travellers who are in hotel quarantine for 14 days, our borders are CLOSED to anyone from declared hotspots in NSW and Victoria

True that Musty but they are still letting people in from overseas which has caused this latest outbreak and the shutting of borders.

why make the locals suffer but still let in so called movie stars and crew?

l was talking to a doctor who is treating a terminally ill man ( cancer ) who is in hospital in Sydney.

The man wants to return home to his family in Queensland but the Qld won’t allow it.

They will allow 50,000 unmasked football fans to watch a game but not allow a dying man to see him family for the last time.

Politics at its best.

 

[qprbeth]

Next question Beth - my wife has been advised against vaccine at the moment as they don't know how her immune system will react as she is still recovering from Long Covid. She tells me (she's the nurse, so I listen) that Long Covid has sent her immune system into overdrive, which is why there are so many differing symptoms. Any idea from your experience as to how the vaccine would effect her?

The questions are getting harder...and this is harder to explain.
.
So you get a dose of the virus...and your body should mount a straight forward response...You get ill, and after few days your immune system gets going and takes care of the virus...and you make a recovery. In a couple of weeks you are over it...like a normal cold...( A common cold is caused by a different Corona virus). That is what happens in 70-80 % if cases...some don't even get ill.


What has taken people by surprise is that many people who get serious Covid, or who get prolonged Covid ( longCovid like your wife)... something else goes on.

Everything starts normally, your body raises a response but for some reason the response goes a bit nuclear. Other factors are released. These are called cytokines and give rise to a "cytokine storm ) This is a bit like corporal Jones in dad's army running round panicking and shouting "don't panic, don't panic.

This is a huge destructive response when the immune system is really really worked up and destroys your own body cells that it thinks is hiding the virus...causing destruction of your lungs and other tissue where it thinks the virus is e.g. nervous system, heart and kidneys...the virus also cause your blood to be sticky and that causes the immune cells attack that too.

Some people die from this combination of viral attack and cytokine storm.
It is also why the disease often is seen in two parts...the flu/cold first week,,,that in many marks the full disease....but in some a second week shows a steady decline into breathlessness and ITU.

Many people get over the cytokine storm second week...but are left with residual damage that may take months to years to repair.

So finally the doctor is suggesting that your wife should be wary of the vaccine as it could once again over stimulate the already hyperactive immune system again.

In people who have seen the virus but just raised an ordinary response.....this will not be a problem...as the immune system has already learnt to control the response.

I hope that makes some sense

 

[ELLERS]

Did you not listen to any of that Mike Yeadon stuff I posted? He is very well versed on immunology. You would learn a lot.

Sorry Woody I remember you posted it but can't remember if I only listened to a bit of it. I have listened to so much stuff it has actually confused me.