Off Topic Coronavirus

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colognehornet said:
A second lockdown wouldn't work Staines because it wouldn't have the compliance of the population. The fact is that this second wave of infection has not been accompanied by a rise in the number of deaths or of cases classified as serious/critical - and this pattern is repeated in all other Western European countries. It is not a question of time lapse because the second wave actually began around the first week in August (the time lapse between the peak of infections and the peak of deaths was around 2 weeks during the first wave). Exactly why there is a discrepancy between new infection figures, hospitalizations and deaths is unknown - various answers have been put forward - but the logical outcome is that this virus will go the way of all other viruses and will mutate into a milder (just as infectious but less deadly) form, in the same way as happened with the Spanish, Asiatic and Hong Kong flu epidemics - which are still with us today ! The question is 'how quickly is it mutating' ? and 'is it happening already' ? At any rate it would be impossible for any Western Government to embark on a second total lockdown without an exit strategy against a background of very low fatality. In the end I think that the virus will bring itself to an end - I know that our ego would like to believe that we beat it but that is not how these things work. The question is - how quickly will it mutate into a form which is similar to seasonal flu and how will governments decide that this point has been reached.
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So am I right in thinking you agree with me somewhat and realise that any lockdown does not and will not work ?
I’ve made my views clear and if I’m reading your post right, we are on a pretty similar vein of thought.
 
Staines R's said:
So am I right in thinking you agree with me somewhat and realise that any lockdown does not and will not work ?
I’ve made my views clear and if I’m reading your post right, we are on a pretty similar vein of thought.
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Bewilderingly, the Great British public actually wants to be locked down. The only resistance to the government's Covid measures came when the instructions weren't seen to be clear enough. Of course, people can choose to lock themselves away without it being compulsory, but most seem to resent others having a choice not to. Given that we're now told that you're more likely to contract the virus at home than anywhere else, this seems counter-intuitive.
 
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Stroller said:
Bewilderingly, the Great British public actually wants to be locked down. The only resistance to the government's Covid measures came when the instructions weren't seen to be clear enough. Of course, people can choose to lock themselves away without it being compulsory, but most seem to resent others having a choice not to. Given that we're now told that you're more likely to contract the virus at home than anywhere else, this seems counter-intuitive.
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As I’ve said before Strolls, unless there is a total and enforced lockdown (which I absolutely disagree with) then it’s all meaningless anyway.
 
Staines R's said:
So am I right in thinking you agree with me somewhat and realise that any lockdown does not and will not work ?
I’ve made my views clear and if I’m reading your post right, we are on a pretty similar vein of thought.
Click to expand...
I was fully in favour of the last lockdown Staines and I think there is no doubt that it saved lives. Only in Britain's case it was too late and too haphazard. You are right that I am sceptical about a second one - particularly with Christmas not so far away. Unless a lockdown is of Chinese proportions, involving the military in maintaining it and then involving shutting down all borders completely and waiting for the rest of the World to catch up then it will not achieve the desired outcome. It may slow down the rate of infection but will not eradicate it completely and it would start to spread again as soon as restrictions were lifted. In the long term only the virus can bring itself to an end, we will never eradicate this completely but will have to learn to live with it. This involves reliable information and clarity from government, and both have been lacking so far. It must be obvious to any thinking person that large clusters of people indoors constitutes a high risk scenario and that they are taking risks also with other people's lives - just as outdoor activities are relatively safe by comparison. It must also be obvious that, for most of us, putting a mask on in high risk scenarios is little more than an inconvenience at worst, and is showing respect for the rights of others. For me a mask is a sign of respect for other people, not respect for government. My real wish would be to live in a society which can regulate itself without laws always having to be imposed from above (I would rather that there was no 'above').
 
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YorkshireHoopster said:
Jesmond is the one part of Toon where you will struggle to hear a Geordie accent at all - primarily Queens English with plenty of Europeans working in the hotels and gangs of builders from everywhere else except the North East.
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I’ve never found that, though I don’t doubt it’s a bit more ‘diverse’ than other bits of town. I’ve had the startling experience of being served half decent Thai food in the restaurant attached to the Cairn Hotel by a 6 foot 4 Geordie lad.
Stroller said:
Sounds like a good idea to me.
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That’s what they’ve been doing round this way since April. My local hospital is ‘non COVID’, it’s like Fort Knox to get into. Emergencies were sent elsewhere.
 
colognehornet said:
I was fully in favour of the last lockdown Staines and I think there is no doubt that it saved lives. Only in Britain's case it was too late and too haphazard. You are right that I am sceptical about a second one - particularly with Christmas not so far away. Unless a lockdown is of Chinese proportions, involving the military in maintaining it and then involving shutting down all borders completely and waiting for the rest of the World to catch up then it will not achieve the desired outcome. It may slow down the rate of infection but will not eradicate it completely and it would start to spread again as soon as restrictions were lifted. In the long term only the virus can bring itself to an end, we will never eradicate this completely but will have to learn to live with it. This involves reliable information and clarity from government, and both have been lacking so far. It must be obvious to any thinking person that large clusters of people indoors constitutes a high risk scenario and that they are taking risks also with other people's lives - just as outdoor activities are relatively safe by comparison. It must also be obvious that, for most of us, putting a mask on in high risk scenarios is little more than an inconvenience at worst, and is showing respect for the rights of others. For me a mask is a sign of respect for other people, not respect for government. My real wish would be to live in a society which can regulate itself without laws always having to be imposed from above (I would rather that there was no 'above').
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Great post and puts my thoughts down exactly. While I’m not totally convinced about the mask thing....out of respect to others I’m more than happy to have the slight inconvenience of wearing one
 
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Stroller said:
I will, with Dido Harding in charge I know my personal information is safe.
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Having just read up about it, it seems like it’s just a way to remind people to social distance, and gets it wrong 33% of the time due to the way Bluetooth works.

I might think about it if the alert of having being been near someone who thinks they are ill for fifteen minutes (in my case only likely to be a member of my family) came with a guaranteed 30 minute turnaround test for both the perhaps infected person and myself, so we could both then take the appropriate action rather than operating in this information vacuum. As that is not going to happen and as Dido Harding is, as you imply, not to be trusted with any personal data, it’s a no from me.
 
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colognehornet said:
I was fully in favour of the last lockdown Staines and I think there is no doubt that it saved lives. Only in Britain's case it was too late and too haphazard. You are right that I am sceptical about a second one - particularly with Christmas not so far away. Unless a lockdown is of Chinese proportions, involving the military in maintaining it and then involving shutting down all borders completely and waiting for the rest of the World to catch up then it will not achieve the desired outcome. It may slow down the rate of infection but will not eradicate it completely and it would start to spread again as soon as restrictions were lifted. In the long term only the virus can bring itself to an end, we will never eradicate this completely but will have to learn to live with it. This involves reliable information and clarity from government, and both have been lacking so far. It must be obvious to any thinking person that large clusters of people indoors constitutes a high risk scenario and that they are taking risks also with other people's lives - just as outdoor activities are relatively safe by comparison. It must also be obvious that, for most of us, putting a mask on in high risk scenarios is little more than an inconvenience at worst, and is showing respect for the rights of others. For me a mask is a sign of respect for other people, not respect for government. My real wish would be to live in a society which can regulate itself without laws always having to be imposed from above (I would rather that there was no 'above').
Click to expand...

I'm no medic, Cologne, but I'm not sure I agree that only the virus can bring itself to an end. I don't think it would end itself, it would mutate and persist. Without an effective vaccination, it will continue ad infinitum imo
 
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Goldhawk-Road said:
I'm no medic, Cologne, but I'm not sure I agree that only the virus can bring itself to an end. I don't think it would end itself, it would mutate and persist. Without an effective vaccination, it will continue ad infinitum imo
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When I said end, I didn't really mean it would vanish Goldie - more that it would mutate into a less deadly form. The logic being that it is not in the interests of the Virus to kill its host - but needs to mutate into a milder form in order to spread more effectively. In the end it will go the same way as the Spanish, Asian or Hong Kong flu - which are all still with us but have mutated into milder forms which just blend into different strains of seasonal flu.
 
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colognehornet said:
When I said end, I didn't really mean it would vanish Goldie - more that it would mutate into a less deadly form. The logic being that it is not in the interests of the Virus to kill its host - but needs to mutate into a milder form in order to spread more effectively. In the end it will go the same way as the Spanish, Asian or Hong Kong flu - which are all still with us but have mutated into milder forms which just blend into different strains of seasonal flu.
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I see, thanks for clarifying. This short article is interesting:

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-06-sars-virus-coronavirus-wont.html

It makes your point about the virus becoming endemic like flu or the common cold, but also concludes that, because its characteristics enabling it to endure (infecting people more than once etc) are as yet not fully known, a safe and effective vaccine is desirable
 
I downloaded the new NHS app onto my 4 year old android no problem

It tells me to check into places when I enter...so it can tell me if someone infected has been there when I have.

I have spent the morning in the metropolis that is Aylesbury...I have been in a number of big shops ( no I wasn't searching for plasterboard to hoard!!)...
None of the big shops or places had this facility yet...and knew nothing about it..

I have learnt that I am in a medium risk area. The King's Covid19App says I am in a low risk area.
Who to believe?
 
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qprbeth said:
I downloaded the new NHS app onto my 4 year old android no problem

It tells me to check into places when I enter...so it can tell me if someone infected has been there when I have.

I have spent the morning in the metropolis that is Aylesbury...I have been in a number of big shops ( no I wasn't searching for plasterboard to hoard!!)...
None of the big shops or places had this facility yet...and knew nothing about it..

I have learnt that I am in a medium risk area. The King's Covid19App says I am in a low risk area.
Who to believe?
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Just downloaded and I am up and running with 2 mins. I don’t know what the fuss was about on the news today. Probably just moaning for the sake of it. Fab app as well!
 
ELLERS said:
Just downloaded and I am up and running with 2 mins. I don’t know what the fuss was about on the news today. Probably just moaning for the sake of it. Fab app as well!
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Although if I find out in 3 months that my information has been left of a memory stick on a bus and ended In Chinese hands I won’t be happy.
 
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