Match Day Thread Addicks v Shrimpers

[lardiman]

Michael Kightly is still a good player, but the rest of the Southend players you wouldn’t give two bob for. Southend at home when they are down to ten men is the sort of game you must win to have any hope of promotion - yet we never looked remotely like winning that game today. Over the last 6/7 transfer windows we have collected a lot of players with similar traits - small, lightweight, talented on their day, injury prone. Vetekole’s performance as a centre forward today was horrible, and when you augment a lame duck striker with two gadfly wingers with hearts the size of frozen peas ....no wonder we can’t score.

I agree almost completely with this.

Perhaps it's a bit harsh to say we 'never remotely looked like winning' as their keeper did pull off two terrific saves during that period after we equalised, when it seemed for a while like we had enough momentum to force in a second goal.
But as a general comment on the whole game I do broadly agree with the sentiment.

Charlton huffed and puffed (as they say) and pressed many attacking moves, but never seemed to have a player in the right place at the right time who was able to provide the finish. Vetokele has been on social media recently so I understand, raising hopes among the gullible by saying he will try to return to his best.
Yeah, OK Igor. Just let us know when you're going to begin trying a bit harder.

And the assessment of our other players as 'lightweight' is spot on.
I won't deny Southend were playing anti-football for a lot of the time after they lost a player - that's only to be expected. But if we cannot effectively counter that obvious tactic in a team as absolutely average as SUFC then Charlton don't deserve to go back to the Championship.
And there were too many scary moments towards the end of that match where Southend counter-attacks (many stemming from possession needlessly given away in midfield) could have produced a 1-2 away win.

 

[User deleted as requested]

I agree almost completely with this.

Perhaps it's a bit harsh to say we 'never remotely looked like winning' as their keeper did pull off two terrific saves during that period after we equalised, when it seemed for a while like we had enough momentum to force in a second goal.
But as a general comment on the whole game I do broadly agree with the sentiment.

Charlton huffed and puffed (as they say) and pressed many attacking moves, but never seemed to have a player in the right place at the right time who was able to provide the finish. Vetokele has been on social media recently so I understand, raising hopes among the gullible by saying he will try to return to his best.
Yeah, OK Igor. Just let us know when you're going to begin trying a bit harder.

And the assessment of our other players as 'lightweight' is spot on.
I won't deny Southend were playing anti-football for a lot of the time after they lost a player - that's only to be expected. But if we cannot effectively counter that obvious tactic in a team as absolutely average as SUFC then Charlton don't deserve to go back to the Championship.
And there were too many scary moments towards the end of that match where Southend counter-attacks (many stemming from possession needlessly given away in midfield) could have produced a 1-2 away win.

Fosu and Marshall cannot complain when they are dropped now. It really is a very basic requirement in a winger to be able to beat the first man with a cross. Vetekole is an absolute shadow of the player he once was, he looks incapable of anything. He’s got no pace, no physical presence, and couldn’t even jump.

 

[lardiman]

Mark Marshall has started 5 league games this season;

1 win ... (against Shrewsbury back in August)
2 draws ... (against the mighty Fleetwood and Southend)
2 defeats ... (Sunderland and Barnsley)

Granted Marshall is only one of eleven players in the starting line-up, but his record against decent opposition is poor this season.
It seems Bowyer has only ever played him reluctantly, and with good reason.
~~~~~~
Fosu's record for the 13 league games he has started is marginally better;

5 wins
4 draws
4 defeats

But his personal league win rate of 38% (5/13) is lower than the whole team's league win rate of 50% (16/32)
~~~~~
Vetokele has only started 3 league games this season. Not enough to support meaningful analysis.
Just for the record though, Igor has started in one win (against Walsall) and two draws (Luton and Southend).

 

[CafcFactsStats]

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[lardiman]

Yes, unfortunate.

Bielik has picked up a yellow card in each of his three latest starts.

 

[ElfsborgAddick]

Williamson is talking to himself on ITTApologist on the matchday thread

Weirdo.

 

[Whats up Doc]

Fosu and Marshall were laughably not our worst players, Igor should be put down he was absolutely dreadful, the Southend physio was quicker than him. Ridiculous not to win that match, my already poor opinion of CP has sunk even lower

 

[lardiman]

Fosu and Marshall were laughably not our worst players, Igor should be put down he was absolutely dreadful, the Southend physio was quicker than him. Ridiculous not to win that match, my already poor opinion of CP has sunk even lower

What did Chris Powell do that was so offensive?

He only did what we have praised Lee Bowyer for doing earlier this season when Charlton got in the faces of better teams and disrupted their play - refused to be lightweight and bullied off the ball.
Charlton were clear favourites to win that game. And the referee made Southend pay for their anti-football with a straight red card within 30 minutes. But still we could not score 2 goals against 10 men of clearly inferior quality.
So Powell has sunk even lower in your opinion for what - refusing to just surrender?

And what did Powell do to earn your poor opinion of him in the first place?

If it's that Sheffield United FA Cup quarter-final I won't be surprised, though I will never understand it.
The promotion season and the Championship season after that - the only time since 2006 that Charlton have reversed the long term decline since we lost our Premiership status. All of that apparently counts for nothing.

And I get criticised for refusing to give my undying devotion to Lee Bowyer!

The man who threw away an FA Cup second round home game just a few months ago.
A Duchatelet stooge who has achieved nothing so far, and is only now apparently realising what a sorry mug his boss has made of him.
Right now Chris Powell towers above Lee Bowyer as far as I'm concerned, comparing what each one of them has contributed to this Club both as player and as manager.

I can understand Royston's casual disrespect for Jimmy Seed, Charlton's undisputed greatest manager ever, because he doesn't like the great man's grandson. But I will never understand the low opinion so many forum members have of Chris Powell.
The only manager since Alan Curbishley who has achieved anything at CAFC.

I genuinely would like to know why he is so unpopular with some members of some Charlton forums.
Perhaps it is just another manifestation of the 'anti Charlton Life' thing that seems to be going on both here and on ITTV.
Please let me know if it is actually more than that. Because if that's all it is, it's actually laughable.

 

[User deleted as requested]

What did Chris Powell do that was so offensive?

He only did what we have praised Lee Bowyer for doing earlier this season when Charlton got in the faces of better teams and disrupted their play - refused to be lightweight and bullied off the ball.
Charlton were clear favourites to win that game. And the referee made Southend pay for their anti-football with a straight red card within 30 minutes. But still we could not score 2 goals against 10 men of clearly inferior quality.
So Powell has sunk even lower in your opinion for what - refusing to just surrender?

And what did Powell do to earn your poor opinion of him in the first place?

If it's that Sheffield United FA Cup quarter-final I won't be surprised, though I will never understand it.
The promotion season and the Championship season after that - the only time since 2006 that Charlton have reversed the long term decline since we lost our Premiership status. All of that apparently counts for nothing.

And I get criticised for refusing to give my undying devotion to Lee Bowyer!

The man who threw away an FA Cup second round home game just a few months ago.
A Duchatelet stooge who has achieved nothing so far, and is only now apparently realising what a sorry mug his boss has made of him.
Right now Chris Powell towers above Lee Bowyer as far as I'm concerned, comparing what each one of them has contributed to this Club both as player and as manager.

I can understand Royston's casual disrespect for Jimmy Seed, Charlton's undisputed greatest manager ever, because he doesn't like the great man's grandson. But I will never understand the low opinion so many forum members have of Chris Powell.
The only manager since Alan Curbishley who has achieved anything at CAFC.

I genuinely would like to know why he is so unpopular with some members of some Charlton forums.
Perhaps it is just another manifestation of the 'anti Charlton Life' thing that seems to be going on both here and on ITTV.
Please let me know if it is actually more than that. Because if that's all it is, it's actually laughable.

Did you go to the Southend game Lardi ?

The charge sheet against Powell’s team was a long one -

Negative football
Numerous dirty late tackles
Cynical time wasting from 20 min onwards
Petulance towards the ref

 

[lardiman]

Did you go to the Southend game Lardi ?

The charge sheet against Powell’s team was a long one -

Negative football
Numerous dirty late tackles
Cynical time wasting from 20 min onwards
Petulance towards the ref

Yes I was there.

The negative football and late tackles were hardly a surprise tactic.
Southend were never going to try to match us for playing football. That would have meant certain defeat for them. We all knew that.

The cynical time wasting should have been stopped by the officials but it never, ever is. I was angry but not surprised when only 6 minutes of stoppage time was announced - it should have been at least 10.
Time wasting is never punished, but we cannot honestly say that Charlton teams have never done it in similar circumstances?
The best way to counter Southend's time-wasting would have been to score a second goal against them. We had enough chances.

The sad fact is that Charlton were nowhere near good enough on Saturday.
Getting annoyed with Southend is not going to solve that problem. We aren't playing them again this season.

But unless we learn to overcome the problems Southend created for us, every lower mid-table bunch of cloggers is going to fancy their chances against us from now until early May. There will be no point moaning about dirty opposition tactics when we miss out on promotion yet again.
We need to fix it, not feel sorry for ourselves.

 

[User deleted as requested]

Powell is a dud as a manager, and I will always believe that for as long as I have got a hole in my backside.

One fluke season at Charlton where he did well to buy promotion with the Carl Jenkinson money.

That Sheff Utd Cup Q/F performance is indelibly etched on my mind, who was manager that day?

Sacked after 18 months of dross at Huddersfield - Wagner improved the same team 100 fold.

Turned on by the Southend fans after 12 months of consistent mediocrity.

Powell is Karl Robinson in a snazzy suit !

P.S: Remember how the Wally Collective on CL used to talk of Powell as the next Spurs manager

He wouldn't even get the gig for Spurs Birds Team now

 

[ForestHillBilly]

Silly that the SCP debate still rages. The tables don't lie, and winning L1 with a record points haul was a terrific achievement. Sure he had weaknesses as well as strengths, but he deserves a place in the Charlton Hall of Fame for his fantastic contribution as a player, and his spell as manager was a happy one for the majority of fans.BTW the owners then weren't perfect. Why he gets pilloried now is odd. His predecessors, Parky and pardew don't get the same criticism, nor do the succession of failures which came after Riga.

 

[Sat In Greenwich]

Did you go to the Southend game Lardi ?

The charge sheet against Powell’s team was a long one -

Negative football
Numerous dirty late tackles
Cynical time wasting from 20 min onwards
Petulance towards the ref

he got a point out of a game that he was expected to lose. he has poorer quality players than we had, playing away from home. what's not to respect about that?

 

[lardiman]

Charlton fans who won't give an ex-manager any credit for winning a league with 101 points, lifting a trophy and gaining promotion, should look to themselves before criticising fellow fans who won't give our current manager any credit because he has achieved absolutely nothing so far.

So we lost an FA Cup quarter-final five years ago - when the team was in a false position in the Championship with four league games in hand, partly because of a great Cup run that Powell himself was responsible for, and partly because the Valley was an unplayable quagmire.

How far did Charlton get in the FA Cup this season?

 

[Ken Shabby]

I really don't see why this is even worth the debate. But for what it's worth, CP turned up on saturday with a bang average squad for a match his team were roundly expected to lose, and despite being down to ten men, nicked a point, which I have no doubt they were very happy with. While I dislike those sort of tactics when exercised against us, it's silly to decry a manager from asking his team to try and salvage a point with those sort of tactics. They didn't really have the sort of players who were going to overwhelm us with free flowing football, especially after the red card. And people have lauded Bowyer putting some much needed backbone into our team. Well, Powell just did a number on him with the same tactics.

 

[ForestHillBilly]

The last 2 end-of-season home games under SCP were terrific occasions, let's not forget, although Hartlepool fans deserve a lot of credit. A packed Valley, a genuine rapport between player, fans and manager, expressed during a lap of honour which had been pretty excruciating in previous years.

 

[Whats up Doc]

I simply enjoy watching Lee Bowyers Charlton than I ever did Powell’s. How many times did CP bring Dorian Dervite on when we had a single goal lead late on in games, and how many times did the opposition equalise. I’m sure Lardi will have statistics for this

 

[lardiman]

With the form Blackpool and Doncaster Rovers are in, I would say there is a distinct possibility Charlton could lose to both of these teams.
That would leave us clinging on to 6th place after the third poor February in successive seasons.

Personally I find little enjoyment watching a team that is at a huge disadvantage before it even walks onto the pitch because of the skinflint policies of its failed owner. Lee Bowyer might have had a chance of winning this league, even pushing towards 100+ points, if his squad was not subject to Duchatelet's tight-fisted vindictiveness. Bowyer is paying the price for years of endemic incompetence at the Club, and the financial consequences of season after season of piss-poor stewardship.

Chris Powell was naive at times and his substitutions were often ineffective, or even counter-productive. But poor old Bowyer has nothing to bring off the bench even if he does the tactical nouse that Powell lacked, because Charlton's 2018-19 squad has less depth than the skin on a rice pudding.

Peterborough are the team who are currently imploding and tumbling away from the top 6.
That could be Charlton very soon, unless Bowyer can perform yet another couple of miracles and get some results out of the games against Blackpool and Doncaster - teams who are far superior to the likes of Southend and Fleetwood.

 

[User deleted as requested]

Doncaster 3 Southend 0 tonight

Weegie Addick & Curb It in tears over on Cardigan Life, and having to be kept away from sharp objects.

 

[User deleted as requested]

With the form Blackpool and Doncaster Rovers are in, I would say there is a distinct possibility Charlton could lose to both of these teams.
That would leave us clinging on to 6th place after the third poor February in successive seasons.

Personally I find little enjoyment watching a team that is at a huge disadvantage before it even walks onto the pitch because of the skinflint policies of its failed owner. Lee Bowyer might have had a chance of winning this league, even pushing towards 100+ points, if his squad was not subject to Duchatelet's tight-fisted vindictiveness. Bowyer is paying the price for years of endemic incompetence at the Club, and the financial consequences of season after season of piss-poor stewardship.

Chris Powell was naive at times and his substitutions were often ineffective, or even counter-productive. But poor old Bowyer has nothing to bring off the bench even if he does the tactical nouse that Powell lacked, because Charlton's 2018-19 squad has less depth than the skin on a rice pudding.

Peterborough are the team who are currently imploding and tumbling away from the top 6.
That could be Charlton very soon, unless Bowyer can perform yet another couple of miracles and get some results out of the games against Blackpool and Doncaster - teams who are far superior to the likes of Southend and Fleetwood.

@lardiman

I hate to let reality intrude on your narrative, but since Lee Bowyer became Charlton Manager he had not been given 1p to sign a player. Not a penny.

Powell, by his own admission, was given the £1,000,000 fee Arsenal paid for Carl Jenkinson to build a team.

That’s a colossal difference