Match Day Thread Sunderland AFC v Coventry City - Saturday 9th November 2024 - KO 15:00

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Your Prediction:

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Nacho said:
I think Neil can and will be a good finisher, he just needs a cooler head in front of goal. I reckon a lot of his current shortcomings (not that there's many) are because he's too keyed up as a passionate Sunderland fan living the dream on the pitch.

As he gets older and matures these issues will fade away.
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I hope you're right mate, I think he's a great talent ...

... but he's 23 years old, in a month, so time is ticking.

The emergence of much younger midfield players like Rigg and Jobe, who are scoring, has probably highlighted Neil's shortcomings more. Whatever has to happen the club need to make sure he can strike a ball cleanly ... it's a basic.

Lucky19672 said:
On the Neil shooting thing, imo give the captaincy back to Luke and let Dan concentrate on the midfield.

Yes, I know it won't happen, but putting it out there.
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I've been saying that for months mate, it's just wrong imo.

I wasn't going to mention this but ...

... at the end of the Preston game, the players, led by O'Nien, came to applaud the away end which was greatly appreciated. Dan Neil shuffled around the centre circle then glanced at the Sunderland supporters, briefly clapped and went straight down the tunnel.

As the captain of Sunderland that just wasn't right imo.
 
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FellTop said:
For the record, I think he technique is all wrong on long distance shots. He gets in the wrong body shape. If you compare the body shape of Jobe as he strikes, V Neil, it is really evident why Neil misses.

I said on here a couple of weeks ago I woulr bet good money Regis has him in the defensive drills not the attacking ones. Nothing to stop Neil spending an hour a day hitting volleys and half volleys from the D after training. I just dont believe it is something his coaches, or himself, prioritise.

One of my all time favourite midfielders is Jan Molby. I have told on here before the story about what he was told when he was signed at Liverpool. He was one of the first deeper lying players in this country I remember. A lot like Neil he was poor from distance. But look at his record on penaties! It is because he could pass it in. I wouldnt mind 50p on Neil hitting a decent penalty. He would hit the side netting 9 out of 10, assuming his mind is calm, which seems a strength of his.

If I were his coach I wouldnt discourage him shooting. But I would encourage him to only do it if he can take touch. But I am not as expert as them in charge. Interesting to see it any improvement comes.
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That's the comparison I was trying to make to Beckham practising his free kicks after regular training. Practice can make perfect, particularly if, during this practice session, someone is analysing things you have pointed out, like body positioning.
 
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Smug in Boots said:
I hope you're right mate, I think he's a great talent ...

... but he's 23 years old, in a month, so time is ticking.

The emergence of much younger midfield players like Rigg and Jobe, who are scoring, has probably highlighted Neil's shortcomings more. Whatever has to happen the club need to make sure he can strike a ball cleanly ... it's a basic.



I've been saying that for months mate, it's just wrong.

I wasn't going to mention this but ...

... at the end of the Preston game, the players lead by O'Nien came to applaud the away end which was greatly appreciated. Dan Neil shuffled around the centre circle then glanced at the Sunderland supporters, briefly clapped and went straight down the tunnel.

As the captain of Sunderland that just wasn't right.
Click to expand...

It's a good point that Jobe and Rigg being so impressive at the age they are makes Neil seem like he could be more advanced at 22, but those two are almost freakishly good and mature for their age.

In most other teams a young 22 year old CM learning a DM role would be given more leeway but he's one of our more senior players in terms of minutes and experience and he's highlighted more. There's no issue about if he can strike a ball cleanly he hits it beautifully, but only when he's calm and surely that will come with time and maturity.
 
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Nacho said:
.

In most other teams a young 22 year old CM learning a DM role would be given more leeway but he's one of our more senior players in terms of minutes and experience and he's highlighted more. There's no issue about if he can strike a ball cleanly he hits it beautifully, but only when he's calm and surely that will come with time and maturity.
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I'm trying so hard not to be argumentative but, to be honest, this is where the defence of Dan falls down. The role doesn't make him kick the ball away and be sent off, dive into a pointless needless tackle to give away a penalty or slice a shot while under no pressure.

I keep seeing his errors, like allowing his man to walk away from his marking at Luton, to be excused because he's 'learning a slightly different midfield role' ...

... that's clearly not the reason and 'learning the DM role' can't be used every time.
 
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Smug in Boots said:
I'm trying so hard not to be argumentative but, to be honest, this is where the defence of Dan falls down. The role doesn't make him kick the ball away and be sent off, dive into a pointless needless tackle to give away a penalty or slice a shot while under no pressure.

I keep seeing his errors, like allowing his man to walk away from his marking at Luton, to be excused because he's 'learning a slightly different midfield role' ...

... that's clearly not the reason and 'learning the DM role' can't be used every time.
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He's still very young, every player makes mistakes even veterans. I think he's a little bit immature for his age but he'll catch up. Maybe a bit of patience needed to give him room to grow into the role, he certainly hasn't been doing a bad job.
 
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I was going to say “We all know Dan will try his best but I don’t think it is a position that suits him” .But He has done the job he has been asked by the club . But as a dm every mistake stands out to the fans . But the good work he does is not really seen. He never stops chasing and tracking the ball but when it goes wrong it stands out. If you are up front and loose the ball there is little concquenence and is ignored by the fans .
 
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Lucky19672 said:
On the Neil shooting thing, imo give the captaincy back to Luke and let Dan concentrate on the midfield.

Yes, I know it won't happen, but putting it out there.
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Don't understand that at all. They are both captain as it is. Club and team respectively as part of the leadership group.

So it would effectively just be stripping Neil of the captaincy which will do far more damage to a young lady's confidence than anything else.

I'd be backing the lad to grow into the role personally.

I don't give a **** of he can shoot from distance in the same way I don't care if Ballard can take corners or Mayenda can save penalties.
 
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Smug in Boots said:
I'm trying so hard not to be argumentative but, to be honest, this is where the defence of Dan falls down. The role doesn't make him kick the ball away and be sent off, dive into a pointless needless tackle to give away a penalty or slice a shot while under no pressure.

I keep seeing his errors, like allowing his man to walk away from his marking at Luton, to be excused because he's 'learning a slightly different midfield role' ...

... that's clearly not the reason and 'learning the DM role' can't be used every time.
Click to expand...

I will keep saying it. In easier games, he will be absolutely fine. Look like the ultimate baller, dropping back into the back 4, being the quarter back and just spraying passes about etc. I really don't want to demish this but I honestly reckon I could get the boots back out and do that without any serious pressure or press on me. Had half a pitch of freedom to do it.

Harder games like Luton and Watford etc when it's pressed and it's duel based, he stands out a mile for me and losses of concentration area and have been more prominent due to being under the pressure in the role. I think this will happen against more competitive teams.

It's really hard to turn a very good 8 into a 6. If you have all the possession it's possible but if you notice, we seem to have conceded this to nearly all opponents for a while. I love Dan as a player however, for the reasons above it's going to an interesting season for him IMO.
 
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Smug in Boots said:
I'm trying so hard not to be argumentative but, to be honest, this is where the defence of Dan falls down. The role doesn't make him kick the ball away and be sent off, dive into a pointless needless tackle to give away a penalty or slice a shot while under no pressure.

I keep seeing his errors, like allowing his man to walk away from his marking at Luton, to be excused because he's 'learning a slightly different midfield role' ...

... that's clearly not the reason and 'learning the DM role' can't be used every time.
Click to expand...
You see his errors but you don't seem to see what he brings to the team

Neil has been very good recently, and was our best CM against Preston. Yes it was a poor shot and his finishing isn't great but there's so many professionals that have played a lot higher than Neil that are like that as well

Neil has made a couple of mistakes that have been punished this season but he's also had a lot more good games than bad, yet people keep bringing up the couple of errors he's made

RLB has made him captain for a reason and has given him so much tactical responsibility this season, that says a lot about the player
 
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Smug in Boots said:
I'm trying so hard not to be argumentative but, to be honest, this is where the defence of Dan falls down. The role doesn't make him kick the ball away and be sent off, dive into a pointless needless tackle to give away a penalty or slice a shot while under no pressure.

I keep seeing his errors, like allowing his man to walk away from his marking at Luton, to be excused because he's 'learning a slightly different midfield role' ...

... that's clearly not the reason and 'learning the DM role' can't be used every time.
Click to expand...

Both of the points you’ve made about his shooting and defensively capabilities are bang on for me, which is why I think he’s only really suited to play as the 8, which is the easier of the “three midfield roles”. Jobe is 4 years younger and looks like he has everything to play all across the midfield.


Sacking Robins is a massive decision for them but they’ve reinvested heavily and they can’t really afford another average season so I’m not all that surprised on that front even if I do think he’s a good manager. Hopefully their heads are down and another win to nil at home. 2-0 the lads.
 
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A win tomorrow would make our current results true promotion form.

In contrast teams we 'have to be worried about', Burnley, Leeds and West Brom, have only won 4 of the last 18 games. Their form is erratic so if we keep plodding along at this rate we'll finish top six imo. Sheff Utd have the Sheffield derby so our home game takes on huge significance. Wednesday just beat Norwich 2-0 so they obviously aren't as bad as I thought.
A draw there, with a win for Sunderland, would put us 4 points clear with 15 games played.

There comes a point when it's impossible not to believe it can continue.
 
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Smug in Boots said:
A win tomorrow would make our current results true promotion form.

In contrast teams we 'have to be worried about', Burnley, Leeds and West Brom, have only won 4 of the last 18 games. Their form is erratic so if we keep plodding along at this rate we'll finish top six imo. Sheff Utd have the Sheffield derby so our home game takes on huge significance. Wednesday just beat Norwich 2-0 so they obviously aren't as bad as I thought.
A draw there, with a win for Sunderland, would put us 4 points clear with 15 games played.

There comes a point when it's impossible not to believe it can continue.
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Your last point does it for me

I’m fully convinced already we have what it takes to be top 2.
 
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Smug in Boots said:
A win tomorrow would make our current results true promotion form.

In contrast teams we 'have to be worried about', Burnley, Leeds and West Brom, have only won 4 of the last 18 games. Their form is erratic so if we keep plodding along at this rate we'll finish top six imo. Sheff Utd have the Sheffield derby so our home game takes on huge significance. Wednesday just beat Norwich 2-0 so they obviously aren't as bad as I thought.
A draw there, with a win for Sunderland, would put us 4 points clear with 15 games played.

There comes a point when it's impossible not to believe it can continue.
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Only teams I’m worried about are Leeds. Burnley and Sheffield Utd. We are better than the rest imo.

Burnley have surprised me with how bad they’ve been so far, yet somehow they’re only 6 points behind us. When I was looking at some data (which i know you think is a load of shyte :emoticon-0102-bigsm) I was shocked to see them sitting in 22nd for SoT - only Portsmouth and Swansea sitting lower than them. They were a team who used to dominate games and create clear cut chances for fun. They do have a LOT of good players out injured though so I expect them to have a good second half of the season. I’m not writing them off just yet
 
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Scout73 said:
You see his errors but you don't seem to see what he brings to the team

Neil has been very good recently, and was our best CM against Preston. Yes it was a poor shot and his finishing isn't great but there's so many professionals that have played a lot higher than Neil that are like that as well

Neil has made a couple of mistakes that have been punished this season but he's also had a lot more good games than bad, yet people keep bringing up the couple of errors he's made

RLB has made him captain for a reason and has given him so much tactical responsibility this season, that says a lot about the player
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Neil was very good against Preston under a lot of pressure Him and Rigg held the team together Losing Jobe has proved to be a big miss. Wasn’t massively impressed with Browne when he was given Jobes responsibility Hopefully when our new DM is fit he can fill the gaps as injuries and suspensions kick in. Bizarrely just reading about how well Ekwah is doing in France
 
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