WAR! What is it good for?

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Just been reported on SKY that Islamic State terrorists have released their own footage of yesterdays atrocity.

I've not posted it up, but the content is available on Twitter via other sources, it's quite extreme. I caught a few seconds and thought ok that's enough.
 
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Treble said:
I think the way Putin will play it will be to try to galvanise public support by saying "look we're being attacked from all sides".

I doubt he'll try and link IS to Ukraine, but he'll use it to say back me bcos I need to protect you from everyone who's out to get us (his main purpose of course will be to use that to continue his invasion of Ukraine).
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Could backfire on him though. A lot of Russians will be thinking “What’s the point of a strongman President, if he can’t protect us from terrorists at home, and he can’t defeat Ukraine despite sending millions of our sons into the meat grinder?”
 
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Archers Road said:
Could backfire on him though. A lot of Russians will be thinking “What’s the point of a strongman President, if he can’t protect us from terrorists at home, and he can’t defeat Ukraine despite sending millions of our sons into the meat grinder?”
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Yeh but as we've seen in Israel, they may not like him but they'll largely support what he's doing no matter how barbaric or batshit crazy it is. Especially when the media narrative is controlled, blocking out as much of what is actually being done and making sure all news outlets only report what he wants. Lots of parallels between both.
 
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Treble said:
Yeh but as we've seen in Israel, they may not like him but they'll largely support what he's doing no matter how barbaric or batshit crazy it is. Especially when the media narrative is controlled, blocking out as much of what is actually being done and making sure all news outlets only report what he wants. Lots of parallels between both.
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Maybe, but it’s not that long since an armoured column led by a renegade war chief advanced on Moscow (before unexpectedly turning back). I’d be wary of assuming Putin’s position in Russia is unassailable. An unpopular war led to the downfall of the last Tsar.
 
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Archers Road said:
Maybe, but it’s not that long since an armoured column led by a renegade war chief advanced on Moscow (before unexpectedly turning back). I’d be wary of assuming Putin’s position in Russia is unassailable. An unpopular war led to the downfall of the last Tsar.
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Prigozhin who's plane happened to drop out of the sky , unexplained ?
No loss there he was equally as evil .
Used to silence the opposition by having them held in the ground while he smashed their heads in with a sledge hammer .
Russia will just be a succession once Putin finally goes .
Gorbachev was the only hope and Yeltzin the drunk paved the way for Putin .
I fear we will never see a different Russian it hasn't changed much in 100 years
 
Edelman said:
Prigozhin who's plane happened to drop out of the sky , unexplained ?
No loss there he was equally as evil .
Used to silence the opposition by having them held in the ground while he smashed their heads in with a sledge hammer .
Russia will just be a succession once Putin finally goes .
Gorbachev was the only hope and Yeltzin the drunk paved the way for Putin .
I fear we will never see a different Russian it hasn't changed much in 100 years
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Not sure about that. It seems to me that Russia has gone through more changes in the last 100 years, than almost any other country I can think of.
 
Edelman said:
Prigozhin who's plane happened to drop out of the sky , unexplained ?
No loss there he was equally as evil .
Used to silence the opposition by having them held in the ground while he smashed their heads in with a sledge hammer .
Russia will just be a succession once Putin finally goes .
Gorbachev was the only hope and Yeltzin the drunk paved the way for Putin .
I fear we will never see a different Russian it hasn't changed much in 100 years
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You sure that weren't Negan in The Walking Dead?
 
Archers Road said:
Not sure about that. It seems to me that Russia has gone through more changes in the last 100 years, than almost any other country I can think of.
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They are in exactly the same position they where 100 years ago .
Objection ends in internment or quite often death .
They might not be the military power they once where but they can snuff out anybody that they wish and it will only result in mild world wide condemnation .
 
Edelman said:
They are in exactly the same position they where 100 years ago .
Objection ends in internment or quite often death .
They might not be the military power they once where but they can snuff out anybody that they wish and it will only result in mild world wide condemnation .
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100 years ago they’d just come out of a 6 year civil war. The rouble had collapsed, the country was exhausted, and the government of the nascent Soviet Union was almost bankrupt.
 
Archers Road said:
100 years ago they’d just come out of a 6 year civil war. The rouble had collapsed, the country was exhausted, and the government of the nascent Soviet Union was almost bankrupt.
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The current regime are currently sucking money out of public spending to fund the war .
Conscripts have no choice but to fight .
There's no freedom of speech and political opposition or people who speak Die .
Surely you can't think that that's progress because they now have Oil and Gas reserves .
It sounds pretty much like going back decades to me .
 
Edelman said:
The current regime are currently sucking money out of public spending to fund the war .
Conscripts have no choice but to fight .
There's no freedom of speech and political opposition or people who speak Die .
Surely you can't think that that's progress because they now have Oil and Gas reserves .
It sounds pretty much like going back decades to me .
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I didn’t say it was progress. I made the point that Putin’s grip on power may not be anywhere near as secure as he wants everyone in Russia and beyond to think it is; and that Russia has a long history not only of tyranny, but also of uncertainty and upheaval.
 
Archers Road said:
I didn’t say it was progress. I made the point that Putin’s grip on power may not be anywhere near as secure as he wants everyone in Russia and beyond to think it is; and that Russia has a long history not only of tyranny, but also of uncertainty and upheaval.
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It will likely just end up with a succession when he eventually dies
 
What I don't understand about this IS attack in Moscow, why did the gunmen allow themselves to be captured?

My assumption for such a extreme event as that is you go in knowing you are going to lose your life, and if you allow yourselves to be captured you will wish you were dead, so I'm not getting it.

It makes me question the people Russia claim to have caught, are they not really the attackers, and where are the real attackers if so?
 
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brb said:
What I don't understand about this IS attack in Moscow, why did the gunmen allow themselves to be captured?

My assumption for such a extreme event as that is you go in knowing you are going to lose your life, and if you allow yourselves to be captured you will wish you were dead, so I'm not getting it.

It makes me question the people Russia claim to have caught, are they not really the attackers, and where are the real attackers if so?
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You are right to question and almost certainly correct in your doubt
 
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brb said:
What I don't understand about this IS attack in Moscow, why did the gunmen allow themselves to be captured?

My assumption for such a extreme event as that is you go in knowing you are going to lose your life, and if you allow yourselves to be captured you will wish you were dead, so I'm not getting it.

It makes me question the people Russia claim to have caught, are they not really the attackers, and where are the real attackers if so?
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pretty much my first thought but apparently they do look like the guys in the IS video but no idea how good the pics are etc
 
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brb said:
What I don't understand about this IS attack in Moscow, why did the gunmen allow themselves to be captured?

My assumption for such a extreme event as that is you go in knowing you are going to lose your life, and if you allow yourselves to be captured you will wish you were dead, so I'm not getting it.

It makes me question the people Russia claim to have caught, are they not really the attackers, and where are the real attackers if so?
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All weird, the events of the shooting and the bombing all add up, but the subsequent Russian governments account of events no longer add up.

They all piled into cars and started driving towards... ****ing Ukraine? I just checked, Google gives it a 6hr 50 minute drive.

Just does not make sense at all. I thought the bombs at the concert hall definitely would have been suicide bombs.

Then you see four deranged terrorists with their hands up, being patted down at a Russian police car.

When does that EVER happen?
 
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Welshie said:
All weird, the events of the shooting and the bombing all add up, but the subsequent Russian governments account of events no longer add up.

They all piled into cars and started driving towards... ****ing Ukraine? I just checked, Google gives it a 6hr 50 minute drive.

Just does not make sense at all. I thought the bombs at the concert hall definitely would have been suicide bombs.

Then you see four deranged terrorists with their hands up, being patted down at a Russian police car.

When does that EVER happen?
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Perhaps this was an Aber type inside job, Russians sacrificed to justify all out assault on Ukraine, and then those bastards from ISIS pretend it was them to pretend they are still relevant
 
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duggie2000 said:
Perhaps this was an Aber type inside job, Russians sacrificed to justify all out assault on Ukraine, and then those bastards from ISIS pretend it was them to pretend they are still relevant
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Always possible. But I'm gonna go for Occam's Razor.

The Russian government isn't as big, scary and strong as it thinks. Its a lot easier monitoring and controlling poor as **** city folk and villagers.

They panicked and just tried to look like they sorted it, keep people confident.
 
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duggie2000 said:
Perhaps this was an Aber type inside job, Russians sacrificed to justify all out assault on Ukraine, and then those bastards from ISIS pretend it was them to pretend they are still relevant
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I thought in the released video by Isalmic State that the terrorists were speaking in Arabic?

Also why would the terrorists wait around for 60-90 mins for the Russian forces to turn up, you get in, do the job, get out or in the case of normal ISIS assults blow yourself up. The Russians knew this attack was going to happen, so why did it take them so long, and then what, they want us to believe that four men walk out and say fair cop guv, oh btw we got our passports on us, so you can check our ID. Don't hurt us boss and we will talk, pull my hair abit and put your boot near my face to make it look authentic lol.
 
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