Match Day Thread Burnley v Saints Saturday 10th August 3pm

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The biggest disapppointment for me (apart from the fact that we were starting with the same defence as last season), is that we have the same weak mentality when we conceed which is a bigger problem then just having poor defenders. I'm hopeful that with the inclusion of our captain, with Romeu moving further back to sit in front of the defence and hopefully Danso coming in and doing a better job than Stephens/Vestergaard we can become less mentally fragile. This was a bad day at the office, and I don't have big expectations for the season as we didn't do as much business as I was hoping for in the transfer window, but I'm still confident that we will rarely have such bad days this season. Baby steps. Evolution not revolution. We've still got much the same squad as last season so let's not go expecting brilliance right from the off.
 
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I do understand the frustration, it does feel like Groundhog Day. But it will take a few windows to sort the mess that Les Reed left behind.

I think we just need to adjust our expectations to ‘staying up’ again. We have the right manager, we just need to be patient and support the team.
 
Osvaldorama said:
I do understand the frustration, it does feel like Groundhog Day. But it will take a few windows to sort the mess that Les Reed left behind.

I think we just need to adjust our expectations to ‘staying up’ again. We have the right manager, we just need to be patient and support the team.
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If our expectations remain just staying up, how long will the manager stick about? Dejected body language yesterday and his comments that he was not sure how our team compared to others in the league suggest a man who is not as comfortable here as we might like him to be. We need to start showing some ambition again and do more than just balance the books.
 
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Osvaldorama said:
I do understand the frustration, it does feel like Groundhog Day. But it will take a few windows to sort the mess that Les Reed left behind.

I think we just need to adjust our expectations to ‘staying up’ again. We have the right manager, we just need to be patient and support the team.
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You are of course totally right-how dare you be this rational on a Sunday...!! I’ve seen Saints snatch defeat from the jaws of victory many times over the years and so haven’t hit the panic button.

My concern is about the general direction the club is going in; and if I’m honest, I don’t think I’ve made my mind up yet.

The driver of our train atm is Ralph and we all (mostly) love having him at the helm. He’s positive, enthusiastic, realistic and most of all he improves the players, we saw this in spades last season... when he arrived we were dead and buried and the pastor had already done the whole last rites thing.

We all know he will go at some point and want that to be later rather than sooner; he was promised considerable backing from the ITKs on here and my worry is the stage of the club and how far we have come. I doubt very much that he was promised the world as long as he was patient for 12-18 months and IF he walked away for a better offer-where we would be.

The window was a shocker in my own opinion and gives me a more accurate indication of where we are now.

Financially.... not that great. We aren’t prepared to take a hit on the myriad of players we need shot of.

Signings... with exception of Che, it’s questionable at best. I have big reservations about Ings and at what level anyone sanctioned signing him for such a large sum. I know Reed was still here then, but still...!

Other clubs overtaking us... one of the things I think Saints have been quite good at is living in their own bubble of what improvement looks like... the bigger issue is how we compare to other clubs. Spending is no guarantee to success, we all know that but speculating to accumulate is a thing too as long as it’s controlled.

I expect a long and in parts tricky season.... maybe a cup run.... but it feels a bit like the football version of austerity lives at St Mary’s.
 
VocalMinority said:
Our tendency to collapse was worse before Hasenhuttl arrived. He brought through valery who was one of our best players yesterday and this new CB who's not been here long enough to play yesterday.

If you remember before Ralph got here for comparison then it's hard to say he's not gone some way to sort out the defence.

As I said at half time yesterday, our defence were on top.
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They didn’t have a shot on target before the 63rd minute.
 
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ChilcoSaint said:
Once again, I would remind you that JWP was our JOINT HIGHEST goal scorer last season.
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I said aside from free kicks. We need to be more of a threat from open play.

JWP has done nothing wrong, but we should not be looking to him for goals. It’s great that he has improved his game to where he can chip in a few. But it’s BAD that JWP’s 7 goals made him top scorer. It’s not his fault, but it is still a big problem.

People are talking about how we played 5 at the back and still gave up 3 goals. Yet we also played 2 strikers and failed to score. If your back line sucks and cannot defend, and your front line sucks and cannot score...There’s not a whole lot a good midfielder can do to help.

We need to figure out how to get more goals from our forwards or strikers or whoever is in advanced positions. And then that opens up our ability to play an extra midfielder or for the support players like JWP to be more effective by supplying the scorers. We shouldn’t be looking to JWP to score 15 goals a season.
 
I Sorry I Ruined The Party said:
I said aside from free kicks. We need to be more of a threat from open play.

JWP has done nothing wrong, but we should not be looking to him for goals. It’s great that he has improved his game to where he can chip in a few. But it’s BAD that JWP’s 7 goals made him top scorer. It’s not his fault, but it is still a big problem.

People are talking about how we played 5 at the back and still gave up 3 goals. Yet we also played 2 strikers and failed to score. If your back line sucks and cannot defend, and your front line sucks and cannot score...There’s not a whole lot a good midfielder can do to help.

We need to figure out how to get more goals from our forwards or strikers or whoever is in advanced positions. And then that opens up our ability to play an extra midfielder or for the support players like JWP to be more effective by supplying the scorers. We shouldn’t be looking to JWP to score 15 goals a season.
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I agree, I think! But equally, don’t make things worse for ourselves by playing our top scorer out of position, like we did yesterday. And if the strikers aren’t able to score themselves, there is nothing wrong with them occupying defenders while other players step in. That’s one thing Ralph demanded when he first arrived.
 
fatletiss said:
I think every fan knew we needed some changes in our defenders. No doubt about that.

I thought every fan knew (because the club told us) that we had to shift players before we could buy, once we’d signed a couple of players. We signed a winger and a striker (positions that for several windows fans had rightly been saying we needed) and were then told that players would have to leave before anymore came in. Now I know some are going to say “well we should have signed a defender first” but sometimes life isn’t like that and we signed the players that we wanted who cane available. And as sure as eggs are eggs, if we’d gone into this season without a new winger and striker, those fans would have been moaning.

Do some fans think we haven’t been trying to sell some of these players, that would allow us to buy knew ones? Sadly we couldn’t shift them. Now that is down to previous bad decisions on signings, or signings that haven’t worked out (again that happens). The club made it clear that players would have to go, whether to free up transfer fees or cash, but we were told this. We knew. The club can’t make players leave.... as several fans pointed out about Charlie. They have contracts.

Now we can understand that, or we can keep focusing on that negative and bring it up time and time again, because until the majority of those unwanted players are gone, that fact remains and the bit that gets me is THE CLUB TOLD US! I think it is healthier to understand and remember what was said, than to keep moaning about it. It is what it is.

It was **** yesterday, but it was just one game. It doesn’t mean the sky is falling in. We have a good coach who showed last season that he can work with poor players and we need to give him the patience and support that he can can do enough again whilst the club try to move players on in the next window.

I agree with what SotonOldboy said about Burnley being flattered, as I thought they were very poor until we made them look half decent. They will get beaten by other teams, but that is football. City got stuffed by Palace last season. Chelsea lost 5 to Bournemouth. It’s football.


Over the course of the season, there is going to be some more **** and some good. I’m ready for both.
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Fats, my problem was I got caught up in all the pre-season hype with postings about how Ralph was working with the team to press high and hunt for the ball in packs or "the net" as he called it, well for all the hype and anticipation for the new season and opening game, nothing has changed and that has frustrated a lot of fans. So I will lower my expectations until we rise above them. I do not believe this team is a team that will get relegated, but lets hold back with the "top 8 finish" predictions by some on here, until we can put in consistent performances.
 
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SotonOldBoy said:
Fats, my problem was I got caught up in all the pre-season hype with postings about how Ralph was working with the team to press high and hunt for the ball in packs or "the net" as he called it, well for all the hype and anticipation for the new season and opening game, nothing has changed and that has frustrated a lot of fans. So I will lower my expectations until we rise above them. I do not believe this team is a team that will get relegated, but lets hold back with the "top 8 finish" predictions by some on here, until we can put in consistent performances.
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Anybody is allowed to predict any finish that they wish SOB, it's not like typing it will actually affect the reality.
 
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SotonOldBoy said:
Fats, my problem was I got caught up in all the pre-season hype with postings about how Ralph was working with the team to press high and hunt for the ball in packs or "the net" as he called it, well for all the hype and anticipation for the new season and opening game, nothing has changed and that has frustrated a lot of fans. So I will lower my expectations until we rise above them. I do not believe this team is a team that will get relegated, but lets hold back with the "top 8 finish" predictions by some on here, until we can put in consistent performances.
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As Ralph (and others) have said, it's tough to press high against a team preparing to launch the ball over your head with half a gale behind them every single time they have the ball. Not every team will be able (or willing) to play that against us.

Vin
 
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Saints_Alive said:
I have complete faith in Ralph to sort things out, top ten finish for me (but I don't expect or demand it before anybody jumps on me!).
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Everton, Leicester, West Ham, Wolves and Watford. All I'm sure will be targeting 7th spot. To finish in the top 10 requires us to finish above at least two of those five, maybe more.

Very, very tough ask in my book.
 
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st_brendy said:
Everton, Leicester, West Ham, Wolves and Watford. All I'm sure will be targeting 7th spot. To finish in the top 10 requires us to finish above at least two of those five, maybe more.

Very, very tough ask in my book.
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Just a personal opinion Brendy, I think we will get better as the season progresses. We are certainly capable of beating all of those teams and only our slow start skewed the perception of last season. Plus I believe the squad is stronger and better organised and not one bad opening day performance at windy Turf Moor will change that.
 
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ChilcoSaint said:
I agree, I think! But equally, don’t make things worse for ourselves by playing our top scorer out of position, like we did yesterday. And if the strikers aren’t able to score themselves, there is nothing wrong with them occupying defenders while other players step in. That’s one thing Ralph demanded when he first arrived.
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If our strikers cannot score, we are screwed. That’s why my concern is with our other top scorer perhaps being played out of position.

I agree that JWP should not have been playing there, but I am not too concerned about that as I think Hasenhuttl would have used Hojbjerg if available.

The problem is if we had played Hojbjerg then there STILL might not be a place to play JWP. Through no fault of his own. I’m actually trying to find a way to keep JWP in the lineup and rely on him as a big part of the team.

But the way it is now, we are five at the back plus a defensive mid. Or If we go to four, we probably need two defensive-ish mids to screen. And we need two strikers plus at least at least one other player to score.

So when you try to make up a lineup, you feel like “Well we need six defenders and four scorers.” Obviously that doesn’t work. So we need to figure out a way to get more goals and stop more goals out of the attacking and defending positions we have, so that JWP can do all the things in between, which is what he is good at.
 
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Onionman said:
As Ralph (and others) have said, it's tough to press high against a team preparing to launch the ball over your head with half a gale behind them every single time they have the ball. Not every team will be able (or willing) to play that against us.

Vin
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So what preparation did Ralph have for not being able to press against a team preparing to launch the ball over your head with half a gale behind them every single time they have the ball, we did go in at half time and discuss this I hope. I guess the wind in the north is much worse and rain wetter and colder than in the south.
 
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