Off Topic Boxing

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I'm sure he can't sleep at night knowing you (or anyone else) doesn't rate him mate <laugh>

All opinions smokey, the fact he done what no other heavyweight in 11 years was able to do means I 'rate' him higher than those who haven't ;)
 
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beeforsalmon said:
I'm sure he can't sleep at night knowing you (or anyone else) doesn't rate him mate <laugh>

All opinions smokey, the fact he done what no other heavyweight in 11 years was able to do means I 'rate' him higher than those who haven't ;)
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He's top of the pile no doubting that he beat the best and only proven world class boxer out there and made him look utter ****e in doing so. Many are giving Joshua credit for breathing life back into heavyweight boxing but it was Tyson Fury who blew the division wide open and made it interesting again. Because of his victory over Klitschko people are paying more attention to the Anthony Joshua's, Joseph Parkers, Luiz Ortiz's out there.

And it is just my opinion but he showed nothing near that level in any of his previous fights to even hint that he had the ability to pull it off so until he proves it wasn't a one off, Tyson Fury, in my eyes anyway, is not a good boxer.
 
Personally I think it highlighted just what a pile of old tosh Wladmir Klitschko has fought for ten years. Beating a few bums in Germany in front of their procession-loving crowds. I think Fury will beat him again through his sheer unpredictability and awkwardness and he deserves credit.

A real heavy like Lewis would have hammered Wlad to bits. Vitali I on the other hand, who had an absolute war with Lewis, was an animal of a heavyweight. Got a lot of time for him as a fighter- quality heavy.

Fury is unbeaten and can do no more than he has in beating the man at the time.

Whilst I do think Joshua will end up the better fighter I do think AJ has plenty of skills and variety still to learn and that Fury could cause him difficulties at this stage in their careers.
 
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On June 29, 2003, WBC champion Lennox Lewis climbed into the ring for the last time in his wonderful career. His opponent that night in Los Angeles was Vitali Klitschko. What unfolded that evening will be remembered down through the ages as one of the all time great heavyweight matches. TopClass mentioned the fight on the boxing thread, so it seemed a good idea to kick things off with this war. Onya Toppy. <ok>

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Good fight Cyc thanks for posting, can't believe it was so long ago! At the time I loved Lewis and was fully behind him but looking back objectively as I've got more and more into boxing I think he was a little bit over rate, much like Larry Holmes
 
Cyclonic said:
Strange that Smoke, over the years I've sort of warmed to the man's career. I wasn't really a fan. But you'd know a damn sight more about him than me.
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I doubt that very much Cyc. I'm sure you've forgotten more than I know. I love discussing boxing more than anything because it's so subjective, no one is right or wrong it's all about opinions and what each individual likes. I was a big Lewis fan at the time and still am, I think what he achieved was amazing but looking at it objectively (and maybe a bit cynically) it's easy to pick holes in his record. It's so difficult to judge as we'll never know how all these different heavyweights through time would have done against each other but when I look at Lewis against Jack Johnson, Joe Louis, Ali/Frazer/Foreman et al, Marciano, a peak Tyson, a peak Holyfield. I'm not sure he deserves his name in that company.

Just my opinion of course as if you look at most top 10, 15, 20 lists of heavyweights Lewis is always up there in them. Maybe in another 20years I'll look back and have a different view, maybe I'm just romanticising the 'older' eras because I like my boxing history, maybe I watch a load of YouTube videos of Lewis later today and remember what I liked so much about him at the time and change my mind, I can be quite fickle like that ha ha!
 
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Lewis fought a couple of fighters later in their career which questions his legacy that little bit (Holyfield/Tyson) But these guys were running from him for a long time, well at least Don King was perhaps.

Loved Lewis, would have loved to see him against other generational stars and I too have become more objective about his career over the years but please don't give me that old pony about a 'peak' Tyson. He was a classic American hype job who lost all of his career defining fights and even still people can't accept it. Who were the best 'peak' fighters he ever fought? Holmes was done when they fought, he'd been beaten by Douglas by 1990, couldn't work out a way to beat Holyfield. So who were these great fighters he was beating? Frank Bruno IMO is about as far as it stretched.

Tyson was exciting, scary, and a new breed of heavyweight. BUT, he never quite fulfilled his promise and I wish we had that acknowledgement when we talk about him. He was ****ing brilliant for he heavyweight scene but when we review him on balance- he falls short, marginally, of Lewis and Holyfield.

Had he beaten Lewis/Holyfield in the mid 90s, he'd go down as an absolute great but they were the benchmark and although he had lots going on behind the scenes, he lost those defining fights. (Lewis fight should have happened 7 years earlier id say)
 
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TopClass said:
................ Frank Bruno IMO is about as far as it stretched.
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and he nearly got knocked out by him. had forgotten that Williams beat him up. Tyson was a typical bully. Beat up lesser fighters but, up against a boxer with class and size and a ko punch, no chance.
 
TopClass said:
Lewis fought a couple of fighters later in their career which questions his legacy that little bit (Holyfield/Tyson) But these guys were running from him for a long time, well at least Don King was perhaps.

Loved Lewis, would have loved to see him against other generational stars and I too have become more objective about his career over the years but please don't give me that old pony about a 'peak' Tyson. He was a classic American hype job who lost all of his career defining fights and even still people can't accept it. Who were the best 'peak' fighters he ever fought? Holmes was done when they fought, he'd been beaten by Douglas by 1990, couldn't work out a way to beat Holyfield. So who were these great fighters he was beating? Frank Bruno IMO is about as far as it stretched.

Tyson was exciting, scary, and a new breed of heavyweight. BUT, he never quite fulfilled his promise and I wish we had that acknowledgement when we talk about him. He was ****ing brilliant for he heavyweight scene but when we review him on balance- he falls short, marginally, of Lewis and Holyfield.

Had he beaten Lewis/Holyfield in the mid 90s, he'd go down as an absolute great but they were the benchmark and although he had lots going on behind the scenes, he lost those defining fights. (Lewis fight should have happened 7 years earlier id say)
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This.

Lewis was/is way underrated in my view, he didnt get the mass media support he should have, they were too busy with 'big Frank'... Never seen a heavyweight with a better jab, it was just a piston in your face. Was he an all time great? I don't really know tbh as I've only seen snippets of the 'greats' on YouTube but he was as good if not better as any heavyweight I've seen in my era. He beat both Holyfield and Tyson and I'd rate him fractionally over those two but it's a very close call.

Regards Tyson, he was awesome to watch, a one off and easily the boxer I've watched most of on YouTube but this completely arrogant viewpoint held by some that a 'prime' Mike Tyson would have destroyed Lennox Lewis (likely he was also past HIS prime when they fought) or anyone else is frankly laughable. The same prime (or very dam close) Mike Tyson got beat by Buster Douglas FFS <laugh>

But I do love watching his fights. He's an interesting character, I read a few sports books and his autobiography is certainly a decent read.
 
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Cyclonic said:
On June 29, 2003, WBC champion Lennox Lewis climbed into the ring for the last time in his wonderful career. His opponent that night in Los Angeles was Vitali Klitschko. What unfolded that evening will be remembered down through the ages as one of the all time great heavyweight matches. TopClass mentioned the fight on the boxing thread, so it seemed a good idea to kick things off with this war. Onya Toppy. <ok>

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What a fight this was- the most underrated heavy battle of the last few decades and a shame that we never got the rematch.

THAT uppercut <yikes>
 
Last night in Japan, the world got to see one of the greats of modern day boxing, Shinsuke Yamanaka, look to defend his WBC World Bantamweight Title against a former long reigning champion Anselmo Moreno of Panama. Since beating Christian Esquivel for the vacant title nearly five years ago, Yamanaka has run rampant through the Bantamweight ranks. He stands second only to Gennady Golovkin as the longest reigning, active champion in boxing today. His opponent was the former WBA Bantamweight Champion Anselmo Moreno, a gent who'd had the pleasure of holding that belt for about six years, before relinquishing it to move up a division. Of late though, his form has taken a bit of a slide, but his last seventeen bouts had all been world title fights. They had a previous meeting in September last year when Yamanaka retained his WBC belt with a hotly contested, split points decision. The two southpaws began bombing each about a minute into the first round.

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Quite a few fighters seem to be winning world titles on the back of a handful of bouts. Another gets his chance today. That man is the Ukraine Olympic gold medallist and amateur world champion Olexandr Usyk who has just the 9 fights behind him. 9 fights, 9 wins and 9 KOs. He fights the Pole, WBO Cruiserweight Champion Krzysztof Glowacki, who dropped Marco Huck for the first time before putting him to sleep. The clip below gives a glimpse of what just turn out to be a possible star of the very near future. Betting is interesting. The champ Glowacki is 77-29 and Usyk 8-15.

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On the undercard tonight, keep an eye out for Anthony Yarde. Supposedly the next big thing. Not much on youtube to go on at the moment though.
 
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Indeed. Ive never seen him fight, just heard his name start to pop up on some youtube channels and podcasts i watch.
 
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