Club Direction

[Le Tissier's Laces]

I agree. They'll make signings. But will they be of equal quality? The hints dropped to the press are that they see Mane as being already replaced. Hopefully a bluff. Otherwise, incompetence. To get a player of Wanyama's quality will be difficult, but I am not actually stressed about that. I rate the guys we have, but we do need another big lad to compete with Romeu.

Yeah, I hear what you're saying, but that really is the bit we can only wait and see. I wonder over the course of a season if Redmond can produce in the same way as Sadio. Perhaps so as a whole, and in a better team. Players like Nagy (who seems to have gone elsewhere) and Stanciu could be as good as those that they replace - after all, none of us had heard of Mane before he joined us in reality. That's where the trust in the system needs to come in.

As has been said though, I'd be pretty surprised if we don't bring in a surprise that will break our transfer record. Interesting few weeks ahead.

 

[saintrichie123]

The board will never tell the echo too much.......remember when Ron was asked about getting a defender in and he said no......then Toby was signed.
Or when asked about the rumour of Austin being signed.....he said too expensive which then put everyone off the scent then in the background the board signed him. I am sure there will be some surprises yet.

 

[fatletiss]

I would understand all these views (including spaced saint) if we were at August 31st. It's July 9th and all we have is a couple of articles from the press (may or may not be fed by the club - that's just guessing) and a line that says we will spend. Again that line only said decent, but decent might be £30m, £40m, £50m. Nobody knows.

I just don't understand why people are being negative this early. Fine if we didn't have a track record of getting things done, but to date we do have.

As Laces says, I'll be worried too if we make no 'decent' signings, but even on this, we've done pretty well over the last few seasons.

I trust nobody find this disagreement offensive.

 

[......loading......]

I would understand all these views (including spaced saint) if we were at August 31st. It's July 9th and all we have is a couple of articles from the press (may or may not be fed by the club - that's just guessing) and a line that says we will spend. Again that line only said decent, but decent might be £30m, £40m, £50m. Nobody knows.

I just don't understand why people are being negative this early. Fine if we didn't have a track record of getting things done, but to date we do have.

As Laces says, I'll be worried too if we make no 'decent' signings, but even on this, we've done pretty well over the last few seasons.

I trust nobody find this disagreement offensive.

No because you managed to use your polite voice. Bravo.

 

[fran-MLs little camera]

The question is have we anything else to do at the moment apart from argue amongst ourselves. Not until Saints throw us a bone.

 

[----HistoryRepeating----]

We may well sign some fantastic player, we may well pay over the odds for a dud, we don't know as yet. But, there are a lot of signs pointing towards the academy route, that is why people have it in their heads that we may well go into this crucial season a little under prepared.

 

[fatletiss]

No because you managed to use your polite voice. Bravo.

Good. Now we've engaged, let's debate it.

Another question for you from your post:

Why will you only be satisfied if we spend big on a creative player? What if we spend 10m which is not far off what we spent on Tadic and he turns out to be gold dust?

I don't quite understand the hunger for people to judge signings based on their cost. Our record ever signing bombed!

 

[......loading......]

We may well sign some fantastic player, we may well pay over the odds for a dud, we don't know as yet. But, there are a lot of signs pointing towards the academy route, that is why people have it in their heads that we may well go into this crucial season a little under prepared.

This is my point. Some of us have been discussing the signs and hints, the way you would in an Agatha Christie novel, and some are saying "Just wait for the big reveal!". But those discussing the signs enjoy discussing the signs and those who say wait enjoy waiting. Do either side deserve to be insulted for their view? No, definitely not. Vive la difference.

I agree totally with what the signs seem to say, btw.

 

[saintlyhero]

The question is have we anything else to do at the moment apart from argue amongst ourselves. Not until Saints throw us a bone.

I would agree, but I'd rather they threw a stick*

*seeing as we're on the semantics thread

 

[......loading......]

Good. Now we've engaged, let's debate it.

Another question for you from your post:

Why will you only be satisfied if we spend big on a creative player? What if we spend 10m which is not far off what we spent on Tadic and he turns out to be gold dust?

I don't quite understand the hunger for people to judge signings based on their cost. Our record ever signing bombed!

It doesn't have to be big money, but I think getting SM quality at the current inflated prices would equate to £15-20m if we want to keep the same level of ambition we showed two years ago. We can go lower, sure. But if we take last year's signings as indicative of our black box gambles, I'd rather we went for more obvious talent...

 

[fatletiss]

We may well sign some fantastic player, we may well pay over the odds for a dud, we don't know as yet. But, there are a lot of signs pointing towards the academy route, that is why people have it in their heads that we may well go into this crucial season a little under prepared.

Firstly History, this is just another season on
the pitch and I don't see it as any more crucial than the last one was compared to the previous to that. Each season is about the now.

Secondly, did you read my first post on this thread? What it is saying is that we seem to have a bit of a talent hole in the academy and I asked if the Board are buying/bringing in young talent to fill that void to get us back to a position of having some good enough taken to break through in a year or two's time. We could be. We can do that and still sign (hypothetically) 4 X £10m players for the first team.

This would allow us in future years to be able to bring youngsters through - don't underestimate how important this is for all clubs. Look at United and how import at their youth set up is. They won a treble on the back of doing it. Liverpool do it and even City have quality in their lower aged teams.

I have confidence that this is a good move and confidence hat the board will make sure we have enough quality for our first team squad this year.

 

[----HistoryRepeating----]

Very crucial.
When MP came in, it was half way through a season with a settled group. Koeman had a fair bit of turmoil, but he had worked in different countries & was a name who attracted players as we found out. Now with have a guy from France who's good at bringing kids through.

Shuts laptop & walks away while people get angry.

 

[saintlyhero]

The first part makes no sense to me. Last summer Newcastle spent close to £50m and were one of the biggers spenders. Yes they spent again in January in more of a panic, but in the summer window they spent a lot and it didn't work. That wasn't panic spending. They did invest in their squad during the summer.

Maybe I've missed your point here SH, apologies if I have.

No worries, I might be wrong, but before last summer they had about two seasons of sales and no serious re-investment.
Cheaper players purchased from France and I guess that's the fear from some saints fans.

Obviously they had other more serious problems at the club, which made their downturn so dramatic

 

[fatletiss]

It doesn't have to be big money, but I think getting SM quality at the current inflated prices would equate to £15-20m if we want to keep the same level of ambition we showed two years ago. We can go lower, sure. But if we take last year's signings as indicative of our black box gambles, I'd rather we went for more obvious talent...

Ok, but forgive me here for not inderstanding you. This is what you said in that first post on this thread:

"If we spend big on a good creative player I will be satisfied"

That suggested to me you wanted to spend big.

Secondly, the above post suggests you are saying the black box has been good two years ago and not so good last year. That doesn't suggest to me that it will be bad this year; you can choose to hope it will be good again, or choose to think it will be bad - that's just an attitude.

Thirdly, you say it would take £15-20m to get someone of SM talent. Well it didn't the last time, it cost us £11m. We can do it. We did it before.

We sold Lallana. We bought Tadic.
We sold Lambert. We bought Pelle.
We sold Lovren. We signed Toby.
We lost Toby. We signed VvD
We sold Shaw, we signed Bertrand.
We signed Mane

Here is one we've not got right yet:

We sold Morgan. We signed Clasie and Romeu (however they both started to show progress)
We sold Clyne.. Bought Cedric - not proved as good yet.

This is why I am not yet worried. The club have come through and improved every year. We may not improve position again his year, but I have confidence the Board's track record is strong enough to be trusted. This is why I don't understand your being negative... Yet.

Edited to add Clyne.

 

[fatletiss]

Very crucial.
When MP came in, it was half way through a season with a settled group. Koeman had a fair bit of turmoil, but he had worked in different countries & was a name who attracted players as we found out. Now with have a guy from France who's good at bringing kids through.

Shuts laptop & walks away while people get angry.

History, it is a fair point. We don't know what Puel will bring and it is a gamble, I agree. However, if you went back to read the posts when Koeman signed, there were so many people posting about his failures in other countries and how he'd only succeeded in The Netherlands.

 

[......loading......]

Ok, but forgive me here for not inderstanding you. This is what you said in that first post on this thread:

"If we spend big on a good creative player I will be satisfied"

That suggested to me you wanted to spend big.

Secondly, the above post suggests you are saying the black box has been good two years ago and not so good last year. That doesn't suggest to me that it will be bad this year; you can choose to hope it will be good again, or choose to think it will be bad - that's just an attitude.

Thirdly, you say it would take £15-20m to get someone of SM talent. Well it didn't the last time, it cost us £11m. We can do it. We did it before.

We sold Lallana. We bought Tadic.
We sold Lambert. We bought Pelle.
We lost Toby. We signed VvD
We sold Shaw, we signed Bertrand.
We signed Mane

Here is one we've not got right yet:

We sold Morgan. We signed Clasie and Romeu (however they both started to show progress)

This is why I am not yet worried. The club have come through and improved every year. We may not improve position again his year, but I have confidence the Board's track record is strong enough to be trusted. This is why I don't understand your being negative... Yet.

Actually, you've missed off Clyne and his replacement. I did say in this climate Mane's £11m is more like £15-20m. All the signings you list were at a price range which would now be £15-20m. I worry we can still think they cost £8-12m.

I think I have shown I am quite easily pleased, really. So why sweat it? I don't like the club's rhetoric - it has been worryingly limp, and the hints in the papers match up to a reduced rather than an elevated ambition, but we shall see.

 

[----HistoryRepeating----]

History, it is a fair point. We don't know what Puel will bring and it is a gamble, I agree. However, if you went back to read the posts when Koeman signed, there were so many people posting about his failures in other countries and how he'd only succeeded in The Netherlands.

There were concerns then too. I hope that CP has the players attention, if he brings something new to the table that players believe in, then we are laughing all the way.

 

[fatletiss]

Actually, you've missed off Clyne and his replacement. I did say in this climate Mane's £11m is more like £15-20m. All the signings you list were at a price range which would now be £15-20m. I worry we can still think they cost £8-12m.

I think I have shown I am quite easily pleased, really. So why sweat it? I don't like the club's rhetoric - it has been worryingly limp, and the hints in the papers match up to a reduced rather than an elevated ambition, but we shall see.

Yes, I forgot Clyne, but basically we have had more success than not in replacing players. Would you agree?

What about my point on you wanting to spend big? Did I misunderstand?

On your "why sweat it?" line, are you now telling me you don't want to engage in discussions, having complained that people didn't engage in discussion?

 

[......loading......]

Yes, I forgot Clyne, but basically we have had more success than not in replacing players. Would you agree?

What about my point on you wanting to spend big? Did I misunderstand?

Yes, you did. My point was spending big on a creative player would make me happy, not that it was a necessity. And yes, we have been good at replacing players we had to sell. I don't agree we had to sell Mane and I think we got a poor price. I also think selling good players and buying cheap is a gamble which we won't keep winning.

You think we did it before so we'll do it again. I hope we'll do it again. You think what the board has put out since the end of the season has been good. I have been underwhelmed. Not much further to go with this personal debate.

 

[fatletiss]

Yes, you did. My point was spending big on a creative player would make me happy, not that it was a necessity. And yes, we have been good at replacing players we had to sell. I don't agree we had to sell Mane and I think we got a poor price. I also think selling good players and buying cheap is a gamble which we won't keep winning.

You think we did it before so we'll do it again. I hope we'll do it again. You think what the board has put out since the end of the season has been good. I have been underwhelmed. Not much further to go with this personal debate.

So much for engaging people then. I actually think Spaced that you don't want to engage with someone who disagrees with your point or who puts a reasonable counter position across.

Nobody can say I didn't try. I don't think you've really tried. Never mind.