Off Topic European Debate Thread

Because if we leave then what will likely happen is we'll end up following laws made in Brussels. Only without MEPS and so it will be more undemocratic.

And if we don't then we can wave goodbye to most of the exports we export to the eu

 

But we won't wave goodbye to them as it will still be a buyers market, but I have to be honest I find that giving away sovereignty a bit disrespectful.

 

Do you honestly think if we remove ourselves from the eu countrys will not want to trade with us.
of course not.

 

Right, agree entirely in that respect. I just don't see how it could be amended in such a way.

 

Britain will not wave goodbye to exporting to the EU, just the same as Britain will not wave goodbye to importing hundreds of thousands of cars from EU nations.

What Britain will wave goodbye will be to the EU telling the UK how it does 100% of its trade, whether that trade is done with the EU, or not. Why should the EU decide how the UK trades with Brazil, China, India etc?

Regarding legislation and the EU, much is never debated by MEP's and there are no votes. It is fundamentally undemocratic.

Britain within the EU can never be a self governing democracy.

 

I don't think that they won't want to trade with us. However we will not be holding the cards on the table. Whilst Germany may be keen to do a deal we would have to agree a deal with many uncaring and unwilling nations who wouldn't want us to have a better deal them at all.

The Eu is a superpower. Great Britain is not.

We are a great country with a lot of good history but in order to continue we must be at the head of the table with Germany and France in the Eu.

 

Doors will open elsewhere,I tell you know IF we move out of the EU it will fall like a stack of cards.
Superpower,your joking it is as wobbly as Jelly.

As Peter Hargraves says our skills,our knowledge,our skills are up there with the best in the world that will not be lost.
I personally think it will do us good to stand up on our own two feet.

Malaysia was and is a good example of what can be done when you move away from all the red tape Brussels throws at us,not to mention the wasted money leaving our shores and being wasted on ridiculous things the eu give it too.

 

How are we not a super power look at the G8 for a start we are in there and that's nothing to do with the EU ,permanent member of the UN security council sp don't give disgraceful crap about us being not a super power.

 

Population is the main reason. Not saying we should increase it. Countries with many hundred million populations and even billions are larger than us. With a larger population comes higher Gdp and more influence as in anything the more you have to offer the better you come out if it.

 

We are a great country, but you didn't care about our sovereignty?

If we leave the EU, Germany won't stay in because it's us and Germany propping up the EU.
French ecomony on its knees -
Spanish ecomony on its knees
Italian ecomony on its knees
And why, because they all borrowed and failed, bit like you've been saying since this thread started we need to spend to grow. It's not worked for these has it?
It's us and Germany who are the main benefactors to the unelected regime. We leave the German population will think **** are we bailing out the others let's move away like Britain and go alone.

And I'm still waiting for your answer why it's ok to lose our sovereignty?

 

Could someone answer this for me please? It's been doing the rounds on Channel 4 news, and I'm genuinely interested in the counter argument. Basically:

Leave campaigners claim that the EU membership costs each person in the UK £252 per year.
However we get some back, such as a rebate every year, farming funding, education grants, meaning it actually only costs us £89 per year per person.
Norway, who aren't even in the EU, pay £134 per person per year just to stay in the single market.

So going by that logic, leaving the EU could end up costing us more? As we will 100% have to stay in the EU market surely?

 

Decent post and I largely agree. I'm just not sure if Germany would leave given the amount of immigrants they actually need just to afford to run as a country with a shrinking population. Staying in is beneficial to them in this respect.

I also think the sovereignty thing is overplayed. As it stands most of the EU law we have to adhere to is actually quite beneficial and it's about minor things that we don't necessarily notice but improve our quality of life. My worry is about the EU gaining more control though (as it has constantly). In that respect I can see our sovereignty shrinking.

 

Nope 100% we give more to the eu than we get back,not to mention the red tape for small to medium business that being part of the eu enforces on us.

I'm in business.have been for 28 years,employ a team of ten staff,I tell you now,every one of us wants out,why because we are concerned where our once great country is heading.
Those staff range from 19 to 65 years old.

Why do we need the eu,we are the 5th richest country in the world.
Watch the eu tumble once we vote out.

 

Mate, you didn't even read my post. I didn't claim that we get more from the EU than we give...

 

What is wrong go and see the mass graves where our fathers,their fathers,and their fathers died fighting to save this country from being taken over by other europeans.
Gradually, and very cleverly, that is happening through the eu,without going to war.

 

But if Germany goes alone, they then can take who ever they want into their country. Making them pick the best of profession from countries like the India, who can make a big difference.

 

I saw that video as well, and someone did counteract it (not back to the full amount) but I can't remember it. If I see it again I will post it for you.

 

Cheers. It's basically the only niggling point for me. Other than that, for me:

OUT: I'm 24 and seriously struggling to buy a house, despite (without being arrogant) earning a hell of a lot more than most my age. The thought of needing another 4 Birmingham's by 2030 is frightening, particularly for public services, I don't see a problem with sovereignty right now (it's no different to our unelected House of Lords) but I do see there being a problem in the future with the way it's escalating. Economically I think we will struggle for some years but in the long term we will come back, we are the fifth richest country in the world after all. The thought of Turkey joining is disgusting, and shows the EU has lost its morals.

IN: There is a hell of a lot of uncertainty, we could see a fair few years or serious struggling for a while. I don't want to lose our Human Rights Act. I'm worried that the right-wing will take over politically. I hate extreme followers of both wings with a passion but I see the right as being much more dangerous than the left. And people love to ignore it, but the EU has done a hell of a lot for us in terms of personal rights and peace. People can scaremonger about terrorism but it's because we live in a more informational age. The number of people dying in Europe through terrorism has been declining for 20/30 years. There's no guarantee of a good deal and no guarantee we won't have to listen to the ECHR.

Still not 100% sure, but I think I'm out...