We´re Better Off Out Of It

[General Melchett]

I think you've said it all in your last paragraph.
We've been shipping soft goals for several seasons, so do we try to bolster the defence - NO!!!!
A lot of our goals were scored by our midfielders last season, not strikers, so do we try to bolster our strikes - NO!!!!
In the last 15 minutes on Saturday, several players could have put more effort in chasing down through balls to try and get something out of the game.
IMO, the main reason for us dropping out of the PL is our failure to beat other teams around us - Villa, Palace and Sunderland.

Unless there is a significant change in players and a real desire to win, next season could well be my last season as an ST holder.

One of my biggest concerns about continuing with Neil revovles around this. The stats earlier this season that we were covering less ground as a team than most oponents was very concerning, Neil as I recall defended this as he wanted his team to work smarter not harder, retaining shape rather than pressing the oposition, but I don't think it works. In the championship it may well do, because the oposition will not have the same quality to take advantage of the time even against a set defense. But as we saw on saturday, the likes of Mata will be dangerous when given time on the ball. I don't think a passive defensive system that keeps it's shape is the way forward. But I think maybe Neil does. How often did we struggle when the oposition pressed us, our ball retention went down the toilet.
Some of the non chasing could have been the sun having got to the players, it could have been resignation, or it could be that they were following instructions to keep the defensive shape. What ever way it was bloody poor.

Bah!

 

[RiverEndRick]

One of my biggest concerns about continuing with Neil revolves around this. The stats earlier this season that we were covering less ground as a team than most opponents was very concerning, Neil as I recall defended this as he wanted his team to work smarter not harder, retaining shape rather than pressing the opposition, but I don't think it works. In the championship it may well do, because the opposition will not have the same quality to take advantage of the time even against a set defense. But as we saw on saturday, the likes of Mata will be dangerous when given time on the ball. I don't think a passive defensive system that keeps it's shape is the way forward. But I think maybe Neil does. How often did we struggle when the opposition pressed us, our ball retention went down the toilet.
Some of the non chasing could have been the sun having got to the players, it could have been resignation, or it could be that they were following instructions to keep the defensive shape. What ever way it was bloody poor.

Bah!

Interesting point GM. IMO heat was certainly a factor against ManUtd and their players were struggling as well. One of the dangers of pressing all the time is that the players run out of energy later on and are more easily picked off by more skillful PL opposition players. Players like Mata will always be dangerous, but when Bassong got caught out, he did recover his ground to block off Rooney in front of goal. The real problem was that neither Olsson or O'Neil got back to cover Mata's run in from the right. I actually thought that overall we contained both Arsenal and ManUtd very well while still producing some good attacking play. The inability to score enough goals is what has undone us in recent games much as it did for CH's squad that relegation season. AN has found a better balance between defence and attack than CH did and we have scored more goals - just not enough!

 

[General Melchett]

Interesting point GM. IMO heat was certainly a factor against ManUtd and their players were struggling as well. One of the dangers of pressing all the time is that the players run out of energy later on and are more easily picked off by more skillful PL opposition players. Players like Mata will always be dangerous, but when Bassong got caught out, he did recover his ground to block off Rooney in front of goal. The real problem was that neither Olsson or O'Neil got back to cover Mata's run in from the right. I actually thought that overall we contained both Arsenal and ManUtd very well while still producing some good attacking play. The inability to score enough goals is what has undone us in recent games much as it did for CH's squad that relegation season. AN has found a better balance between defence and attack than CH did and we have scored more goals - just not enough!

This shouldn't be too bigger problem if their fitness is right. Other teams press much better than we do, to do that they have to work harder and cover more ground. OK if we only have 30-40% of the ball that's a lot of chasing, but arguably we should still be moving and working harder with the ball anyway, too often we don't have the numbers in attack or options for passes. I think Klose's injury has highlighted that perhaps with the wrong personnel the balance is impossible. We carried very little threat against manure after the openning 10 minutes. We did look comfortable for the main at the back but for the error by Seb compounded by Olsson not tracking Mata. but make no mistake this was a diabolical United side. That just made our failings especially second half harder to bear. We were too defensive and had nothing, no way of lifting ourselves when we needed to after they scored.

Bah!

 

[royalbarclayfan]

NORKIE - you seem to have read the first paragraph of #8 and yet still not understood it, that explains perfectly what I mean and I don´t see any real point in repeating it, do you - if it still remains a mystery, then I´m sorry, but you´ll have to stay befuddled.

NO - let me take that back, see if this makes things a bit clearer.

My own opinion, mine and mine alone, is that we would be better off out of the Premier League, better off in the way that we will be more competitive (we certainly couldn´t be less competitive), and better off in the way that we, as fans, will have more fun and enjoyment following our team.

That said, I´m not so arrogant as to assume that anything I say, will, or should be, acted on by the club. Of course the´re going to want to get promoted, of course they´re going to try and get promoted, and so they should, and if by some miracle of fate we do get promoted - then great, I won´t be standing over the sink crying my eyes out in despair. But at the same time, it wouldn´t bother me one scrap, if we were never promoted again. I have begun to hate the Premier League with a passion, for all the money involved, and I could get just as much enjoyment and satisfaction out of following my team in the Championship, or anywhere else for that matter, as I ever have done following them in the PL, more so actually, because apart from the first couple of years, it´s been pretty much misery.

A couple of seasons ago I wouldn´t have felt like this, and would have said that even having just one season up in the Premier League would be worth it, but now I don´t think it is. All this up and down, up and down, is just tearing the club apart, and because I don´t advocate, like others, that we should dump the board and go and find some money from somewhere, I think we´d be better off resigning ourselves to a few seasons in the Championship, because we´ve proven. with the current set up, that we can´t manage more than a couple of consecutive seasons up in the PL anyway.

 

[canary-dave]

What really disappoints me is all the moaners had as much fun as the rest of us "happy clappers" and promised faithfully not to complain if we struggled back in the Prem!

Yeah. Right.

Fickle buggers!

 

[Walsh.i.am]

With respect, RBF, it's going to take a wee while to even begin to contemplate ground enlargement/improvements, etc on championship income. Had we made a (far) better fist of this calamitous season, the TV and media revenues from next year alone would probably have paid to increase CR into a 30,000 stadium, which, with sell out attendances for every single home game is kind of overdue.
She'll have to sell a lot of cookery books to recoup that lost/squandered revenue stream.
There's a sickening stench of a "well, we're financially secure, the rest doesn't matter" ethos surrounding the place at the moment and for me, that ain't the message the board should be sending out.

 

[General Melchett]

I don't think anyone would have promised not to complain, we are Norwich! there will always be something to complain about! Besides, most of our optomism evapourated after the summer window closed. We all know that the PL will be a struggle more often than not, but I dare to dream of a day when we recruit well and finish mid-table. We can with the right management team and recruitment get a modicum of stability in the PL as Swansea and Stoke have before us. That we have failed again when oportunity knocked is poor and I reserve the right to say if it; looks like a turd, smells like a turd and plays like a turd, it's more than likely a turd! our season has been a steaming turd of missed oportunity!

Bah!

 

[RiverEndRick]

I've had feelings both ways on this. One side of me says that the football will be much more enjoyable (and less depressing) in the Championship. The other side says that we should always be aiming as high as we can and that means the PL. I think AN will stay on and he'll have plenty of time to build the squad he wants and hopefully bring on some of the young players we've invested in and sent out on loan for experience. I have no doubt that it would again be a struggle for survival if we do gain promotion, but that's the way it is.

 

[Walsh.i.am]

Tell it how you see it, Generalissimo

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[Walsh.i.am]

I think AN will stay on and he'll have plenty of time to build the squad he wants and hopefully bring on some of the young players we've invested in and sent out on loan for experience.

That may not be guaranteed after this morning's developments, Rick?
But if he does, I hope he:
1) Stops putting square pegs in round holes.
2) Plays his strongest eleven at each opportunity.
3) Stops omitting / casting on the scrapheap decent squad members, such as Hooper, Lafferty, Vadis, at the expense of his personal faves each week (Russell Martin, anyone)

It will be interesting to see how 'masterminding' our relegation affects his strategies and thinking projecting ahead. What has he learned from his mistakes, etc, for example?

 

[SuffolkCanary]

I am trying to look forward to next year as a season of development in the championship, to get rid of some of the older players that are no longer providing consistently good performances for the club and to build with a group of younger/talented players that we can mould into a potential premiership team.

Rudd
Pinto Bennett Klose Toffolo
Thompson/Tettey Howson(C)
Murphy/Redmond Odidja/Maddison Murphy/Brady

Got this far and realised I can't name a striker at the club currently that I would like to see up front. Jerome? - Not somebody I would like to see playing for us next year - despite his scoring record in the Championship. Lafferty? - Never going to get given a chance under AN. Loza? Morris? Doubtful they will ever be good enough. Van Wolfswinkel? For some reason I'd still give him a chance, in the hope that he could rediscover some talent.

 

[Walsh.i.am]

Rudd
Pinto Bennett Klose Toffolo
Thompson/Tettey Howson(C)
Murphy/Redmond Odidja/Maddison Murphy/Brady

You're working on the assumption that both Brady and Klose will be content to stick with a club relegated twice in three years!?
I'm not so sure they will - or should, it's a short career, why waste it floundering around in the Portaloo mud?.

 

[General Melchett]

You're working on the assumption that both Brady and Klose will be content to stick with a club relegated twice in three years!?
I'm not so sure they will - or should, it's a short career, why waste it floundering around in the Portaloo mud?.

I would suspend their pay cuts for a year, add in a good sized bonus for promotion for them and for that matter the rest of the players and if not screw as much money out of any suiters as is possible. Another scenario in which we may miss Mr McNally!

Bah!

 

[SuffolkCanary]

You're working on the assumption that both Brady and Klose will be content to stick with a club relegated twice in three years!?
I'm not so sure they will - or should, it's a short career, why waste it floundering around in the Portaloo mud?.

If Brady goes then Josh Murphy will make that position his own with Jarvis as back up.

If Klose goes then we better buy a few decent defenders sharpish!

 

[royalbarclayfan]

With respect, RBF, it's going to take a wee while to even begin to contemplate ground enlargement/improvements, etc on championship income. Had we made a (far) better fist of this calamitous season, the TV and media revenues from next year alone would probably have paid to increase CR into a 30,000 stadium, which, with sell out attendances for every single home game is kind of overdue.
She'll have to sell a lot of cookery books to recoup that lost/squandered revenue stream.
There's a sickening stench of a "well, we're financially secure, the rest doesn't matter" ethos surrounding the place at the moment and for me, that ain't the message the board should be sending out.

I made no mention of wanting ground enlargements or improvements - don´t know why that was aimed in my direction.

 

[KIO]

I made no mention of wanting ground enlargements or improvements - don´t know why that was aimed in my direction.

With respect RBF, if you want to support a club with no ambition who constantly stagnate in the second tier of English football, I politely suggest you take a trip down the A140 you'd be made to feel most welcome

McNally gone, one to go [HASHTAG]#P45[/HASHTAG] AN

 

[carrowcanario]

You're working on the assumption that both Brady and Klose will be content to stick with a club relegated twice in three years!?
I'm not so sure they will - or should, it's a short career, why waste it floundering around in the Portaloo mud?.

Is it's Brady's & Klose's choice whether they stay or go, I thought they had something called a contract.

 

[royalbarclayfan]

With respect RBF, if you want to support a club with no ambition who constantly stagnate in the second tier of English football, I politely suggest you take a trip down the A140 you'd be made to feel most welcome

McNally gone, one to go [HASHTAG]#P45[/HASHTAG] AN

You´re just one more who´s missing the point KIO. It doesn´t matter a hoot, how much, or little, ambition I have, what´s important is how much ambition the club have, and at the moment (and what seems to be bugging so many of you), their ambition relates pretty much to mine. And now with McNally sadly gone, I can´t see that situation changing.

 

[canary-dave]

With respect RBF, if you want to support a club with no ambition who constantly stagnate in the second tier of English football, I politely suggest you take a trip down the A140 you'd be made to feel most welcome

McNally gone, one to go [HASHTAG]#P45[/HASHTAG] AN

I hope you'll be happy with your lot KIO, with no DM, there'll be no return to the Prem, in fact we're far more likely to go down again!

 

[carrowcanario]

If Brady goes then Josh Murphy will make that position his own with Jarvis as back up.

If Klose goes then we better buy a few decent defenders sharpish!

I'm really am starting to sound like a broken record, but

If Klose stays we need another CB, if he goes we need another 2. Bassong & Martin can Foxtrot Oscar as far as I'm concerned.

As far as strikers are concerned I'd keep Jerome and the rest can get on the bus with Martin & Bassong

Holahan Dorrans & Mulumbo can also buy a ticket for the same bus. I'd replace them with 2 quality midfielders (one AM / play maker and one combative) to give Howson & O'Neil a run for their money. I also think Vadis needs to be given a chance in his preferred position.

I'd keep Brady & Redmond, but Jarvis can go to make room for Josh Murphy.

I'd also keep Ruddy, not a popular view i know. Yes his kicking ain't the best and he's been nervous this seasons, but I think anyone would struggle to play behind Martin & the buffon

We need to construct a strong spine that is not just capable of competing in the championship but also has potential to give us a fighting chance of staying in the PL should we get back there.

To be honest a decent spine to our team has been what has been missing all season and we also seem to have lacked any backbone in many key games.

Some posters on here are for a shock should we return to the Championship, It's moved on, I'm don't think we have.