Winter Transfer Window

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Spurs or Sex? said:
I'm probably gonna get people's hopes up only to be shattered at 11pm but here goes...

Most of the older posters on this site may remember I've had the odd tip off over the years, I was told about AVB taking charge about 24 hours before the media got a sniff and done a thread on it at the time, was told about a new deal for Bale which was announced about a week later on the OS and was also told that Ade had joined permanently about 48 hours before it was announced, a text forwarded to me from my mates' mate (no idea what the guy does or how he gets info for the record - unless he's just a lucky guesser!) has said that a bid has gone in for Saido, no idea if that's just gone in or if it went in earlier on today and is being mulled over/ rejected/ accepted by WBA but he reckons the club is quietly confident, especially as they hope Pritch's loan may have sweetened negotiations and got Levy back in Peace's good books. For what it's worth I'm taking this all with a huge pinch of salt as my gut instinct says no one is coming in now but thought I'd share it anyway.
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Okay, I now have my hopes up that we’ll have a deal for Berahino fall through at the last moment.

In fact, I don’t want him for half the price we’d likely pay for him. I don’t like his attitude, I don’t think he’d be a good fit for our system, and I would rather take my chances with Alli/Son/Chadli. I’m disappointed we didn’t get Dembélé junior, not because I prefer him to any/all of those for the remainder of this year, but because I think 5 million or so would be good business, and provide us with someone who could be better than who we have next year.

I’m also a little annoyed that after a window where we did business early, we’re back to the old scrambling around. Another point is that while I don’t think improving our striker situation is feasible this window, I think we could have done so last window, and we could have gotten a Stambouli type to give Dier the rest he never gets.

On the other hand: we have an excellent group of talented young players who are all eager for playing time, and who have played together under Pochettino for at least half a year. While we don’t have adequate cover at DM or striker, there’s something to be said for playing players out of position rather than bumping players looking for minutes farther down the pecking order. My hope is that Pochettino will be resourceful and flexible in how he uses this squad. Somehow, some way, he has to avoid burning out Kane and Dier. Dier’s the harder one of the two to replace, I think. If we got a decent right back, Alderweireld might be able to do the job. I think we know at this point that nobody else could, with the exception of Dembélé, who shouldn’t replace him due to his injury history.
 
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Citizen Kane said:
I trust the latter more than the former, who frankly has no better than a 50/50 record when it comes to success stories on the pitch and in the dug out. I'd also be more inclined to agree with your point if this was a new development and approach that began after Poch's arrival. But it didn't. It's a dogmatic stubbornness, naivety, call it what you will that has hindered our progress more or less every year since Martin Jol took the club up to a level it hadn't yet reached in PL history. Saying it's quite possible such a striker doesn't exist is a fair point, but one that is almost totally undermined by the fact that we deemed Moussa Dembele a good enough prospect to table a bid, have that bid accepted, agree personal terms with the lad and see him through his medical. So, clearly, suitable targets were identified and approached. The sticking point was - as per f***ing usual - our almost pathological stupidity in assuming that come the last 48 hours of the window, the footballing world will down tools and see to it that Tottenham Hotspur FC will get their man in on time. We knew that Fulham are in dire financial straits and can only bring players in on loan. We knew how crucial Dembele is to their chances of survival, yet we leave them precisely one weekend to bring in a replacement - on loan - and expect them to blithely agree to commit footballing suicide by sending their second best player to us in the middle of a relegation battle.

I'm sorry to sound so agressive PS and I'm absolutely not having a dig at you personally mate <cheers> you and I have had our differences over what constitutes an 'improvement to the squad', and I respect your opinion.

But surely, surely this just smells of the usual Levy bullsh*t that we go through every single transfer window, regardless of who the manager is? I'll tell you what, if we finish in the top 4 this year I still won't be happy as I genuinely think that with depth up front we could challenge for the title. Arsenal have failed to strengthen, Leicester are a glorified pub team and City are now managed by a lame duck. We will never get a better shot at it this side of the new stadium.

This isn't about trust. This is about a dogmatic chairman taking complete advantage of a dogmatic manager.
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It's got to the point where I would be happy to take Dembele in the summer so as to avoid more of this farcical nonsense. Up to now, we haven't even got that! Unbelievable
 
I still don't understand the whole Dembele II situation. We clearly wanted him and were mere details away (medical passed, terms agreed seemingly) from getting a player we wanted for a price everybody was happy with. If we wanted him anyway for the long term why didn't we just buy him once it was clear he would have to stay at Fulham regardless, then go hunting for an immediate incoming striker? Hell, Levy could even have tried to pull the price down a bit if we weren't getting him now, and put the extra funds towards another striker even if it was a purely short term fix.

Ultimately I fear for us if Kane is our only striking option. It would be bad enough seeing Son or Chadli or Clint playing a one off game to give Kane a rest (there are no easy games now anyway), let alone if we had to rely on one of them for a longer period of time.
 
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The Huddlefro said:
I still don't understand the whole Dembele II situation. We clearly wanted him and were mere details away (medical passed, terms agreed seemingly) from getting a player we wanted for a price everybody was happy with. If we wanted him anyway for the long term why didn't we just buy him once it was clear he would have to stay at Fulham regardless, then go hunting for an immediate incoming striker? Hell, Levy could even have tried to pull the price down a bit if we weren't getting him now, and put the extra funds towards another striker even if it was a purely short term fix.

Ultimately I fear for us if Kane is our only striking option. It would be bad enough seeing Son or Chadli or Clint playing a one off game to give Kane a rest (there are no easy games now anyway), let alone if we had to rely on one of them for a longer period of time.
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I wonder if there isn’t some combination of forwards that would work out well. I’m less worried about playing, say, Dier, Dembélé, Chadli, Eriksen, Son and Alli when there is fixture congestion than I am about trying to play Kane every single game from now on.
 
I'm not convinced by the argument that we absolutely need to sign a striker in this window. Yes of course it would be better to have direct cover for Kane but in reality that's not quite possible anyway. This Spurs squad has several great qualities, it's young, it's flexible, it's interchangeable, and it appears, happy. The 'NEW STRIKER' has to fit into the group and he would be bought to score goals. We have goals in this squad already we have the joint best goal difference in the league we have goalscorers in abundance:

Kane 16
Lamela 8
Ali 6
Eriksen 6
Chadli 5
Son 5
Dembele 4
Dier 4
Carroll 3
Toby 2
Mason 1
Walker 1

Those figures alone suggest the squad is more important than the individual. Not forgetting the not unimportant point that a new striker could come in like Soldado not click and reduce our abilities not improve them.

Many of our posters invest a lot of interest in the transfer potential available and what it could do for us, best placed to make these judgements are Levy & Pochettino.
 
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redwhiteandermblue said:
Okay, I now have my hopes up that we’ll have a deal for Berahino fall through at the last moment.

In fact, I don’t want him for half the price we’d likely pay for him. I don’t like his attitude, I don’t think he’d be a good fit for our system, and I would rather take my chances with Alli/Son/Chadli. I’m disappointed we didn’t get Dembélé junior, not because I prefer him to any/all of those for the remainder of this year, but because I think 5 million or so would be good business, and provide us with someone who could be better than who we have next year.

I’m also a little annoyed that after a window where we did business early, we’re back to the old scrambling around. Another point is that while I don’t think improving our striker situation is feasible this window, I think we could have done so last window, and we could have gotten a Stambouli type to give Dier the rest he never gets.

On the other hand: we have an excellent group of talented young players who are all eager for playing time, and who have played together under Pochettino for at least half a year. While we don’t have adequate cover at DM or striker, there’s something to be said for playing players out of position rather than bumping players looking for minutes farther down the pecking order. My hope is that Pochettino will be resourceful and flexible in how he uses this squad. Somehow, some way, he has to avoid burning out Kane and Dier. Dier’s the harder one of the two to replace, I think. If we got a decent right back, Alderweireld might be able to do the job. I think we know at this point that nobody else could, with the exception of Dembélé, who shouldn’t replace him due to his injury history.
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Haha for what it's worth mate I really can't see it happening but just passed on the text I got. I believe that maybe we did offer a deal but I think Peace rejected it, if anything we could've really done with Saido having a mare against Peterborough the other night but seeing as grabbed a brace I think he's sort of reminded Peace and everyone that he is indeed a good striker and therefore WBA will only sell for premium dollar or wait until the Summer.

The Dembele deal was a weird one, I get a feeling Fulham changed stances on it, I reckon we were set to sign him immediately as Fulham had a replacement lined up which likely failed and therefore demanded Dembele stayed til the Summer which we didn't want.

I have faith in Chadli or Son to produce up top, obviously not to the levels of Kane but the talent is there for the pair of them to step up as the lone striker. The midfield has a lot of goals in them anyway, Kane grabs a lot of headlines because he's our poster boy and England's wonderkid but the likes of Chadli, Son, Lamela, Eriksen and Alli are more than capable of finding the net and as we've seen recently Tommy Carroll and Dembele are also capable of chipping in too. In fact so is Dier... And Toby!!! <laugh>.

I think Mason is probably best to replace Dier, not because he's anywhere near as defensively sound but he's more industrious than the other midfielders, I'd say he covers more ground than the other guys and so I'd entrust him to use his work rate in the hope it helps out defensively for when we need to rest Dier, he also doesn't make sloppy passes in our own half like Bentaleb has done at times this season. Either way, whoever plays, Poch has them grafting their arses off and that's all I ever ask for from a Spurs player, as long as I know the effort is there then I can appreciate that. It's also worth remembering that Mason and Bentaleb were our pairing last season which saw us finish 5th, so while they're currently seen as backups to Mousa and Dier, they're not really of a much poorer calibre that makes me believe we'll be massively weakened if either are needed to step into Dier's position.
 
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Didn't dembele have a medical with us at the weekend? If so, it's probably worth remembering that if that's been taken care of, that deal could literally go to the wire. There's still hope!
 
Spurf said:
I'm not convinced by the argument that we absolutely need to sign a striker in this window. Yes of course it would be better to have direct cover for Kane but in reality that's not quite possible anyway. This Spurs squad has several great qualities, it's young, it's flexible, it's interchangeable, and it appears, happy. The 'NEW STRIKER' has to fit into the group and he would be bought to score goals. We have goals in this squad already we have the joint best goal difference in the league we have goalscorers in abundance:

Kane 16
Lamela 8
Ali 6
Eriksen 6
Chadli 5
Son 5
Dembele 4
Dier 4
Carroll 3
Toby 2
Mason 1
Walker 1

Those figures alone suggest the squad is more important than the individual. Not forgetting the not unimportant point that a new striker could come in like Soldado not click and reduce our abilities not improve them.

Many of our posters invest a lot of interest in the transfer potential available and what it could do for us, best placed to make these judgements are Levy & Pochettino.
Click to expand...

My concern about Kane isn't that nobody else in the squad scores goals, your stats above prove we have plenty of goals around the team. My concern is that Kane is so central to how we play that without a similar figure in that position, the effectiveness of other players is diminished. Chadli is probably the one who would play up there as he has the best physical presence and I just do not have the confidence in his ability to play as a striker.

Berahino or Dembele II would bring different qualities to that position true, and the former might even play with Kane on occasion, but they're more or less specialist strikers who are used to linking up with other players from that position, whereas with Chadli or Son up there we'd be playing without a focal point (but with even more fluidity than usual, true) and it would completely change the dynamic of the team in my opinion, in a way that we haven't really played with a lot of consistent success yet.

We of course need the RIGHT striker, I'm not saying we sign anyone for the sake of it, but I'd feel more comfortable with a specialist to back up Kane even if they'd be a slightly different type of player.

Late bid for Jay Rodriguez anyone?
 
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Roo said:
Didn't dembele have a medical with us at the weekend? If so, it's probably worth remembering that if that's been taken care of, that deal could literally go to the wire. There's still hope!
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Very true mate, probably all that's needed is a fax/ email between the two clubs confirming the transfer...




Which will get done at 11:01pm and thus miss the deadline <laugh>
 
The Huddlefro said:
My concern about Kane isn't that nobody else in the squad scores goals, your stats above prove we have plenty of goals around the team. My concern is that Kane is so central to how we play that without a similar figure in that position, the effectiveness of other players is diminished. Chadli is probably the one who would play up there as he has the best physical presence and I just do not have the confidence in his ability to play as a striker.

Berahino or Dembele II would bring different qualities to that position true, and the former might even play with Kane on occasion, but they're more or less specialist strikers who are used to linking up with other players from that position, whereas with Chadli or Son up there we'd be playing without a focal point (but with even more fluidity than usual, true) and it would completely change the dynamic of the team in my opinion, in a way that we haven't really played with a lot of consistent success yet.

We of course need the RIGHT striker, I'm not saying we sign anyone for the sake of it, but I'd feel more comfortable with a specialist to back up Kane even if they'd be a slightly different type of player.

Late bid for Jay Rodriguez anyone?
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Completely agree. If we believe that we don't need Kane in every game, why's he always there? Colchester was the perfect opportunity to try it but he still played. Strikers are not just about goals, especially lone strikers. Without aspecialist spearhead I see the ball coming back at us over and over again as we fail to hold onto it. Just like the latter part of the 2nd half at Leicester when we brought Kane off the bench to help us retain the ball.
 
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KingHotspur said:
Someone please tell me another club that only has one striker?

I don't just mean in the Premier League, I mean at any level.
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Could makes cases with:

Arsenal with Giroud.
Barca with Suarez.
Real with Benzema.
Bayern with Lewandowski.

They all have players that can score goals from wide positions or play as an emergency forward though but then in fairness so do we.
 
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Spurs or Sex? said:
Could makes cases with:

Arsenal with Giroud.
Barca with Suarez.
Real with Benzema.
Bayern with Lewandowski.

They all have players that can score goals from wide positions or play as an emergency forward though but then in fairness so do we.
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I would argue that Arsenal have Walcott who is probably better as a central striker than Chadli or Son, Barca are effective as long as 2 of the 'MSN' are playing (especially if one of those is Messi), Benzema is also not Real's main goal threat by a long shot, and Bayern have players like Muller who can fill in as a 9, or they can play without a striker and still dominate teams in their domestic league. Kane is not the best player on that list but I would argue he is as important, if not more important, to the success of Spurs as any of the above are to their teams.
 
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