I'll chime in (sorry, didn't think I'd end up typing all that I did...) First up.. I'm a Muslim.. there I said it... Secondly, my ethnic origin is Pakistani.. I'm born and breed in the UK... Educated (sort of..) don't remember much of Uni... Been working ever since Uni.. not taken a penny from the government I'm married... Two kids, boy and girl... I'm a Liverpool fan.. I have issues supporting the England cricket team when they play against Pakistan (not going great in the ODI's but its the Tests that count ).. otherwise, I'm proud to wear the rose/three lions... I like golf, the only sport I've ever been half decent at.. Anyone back on topic... forgive me, not read through all the comments.. so some points may have been addressed... I'd categorise myself has a moderate western assimilated Muslim.. I don't preach hate (well that's a lie, I've bought up my son to hate Man United..) I'm against taking of lives, be they innocent or ones that some may think "deserve" to die, you know, kiddy fiddlers, serial killers, rapist, George Bush and Tony Blair... I've been bought up that way, by my parents, who, shock horror are Muslims too.. my kids have been bought up with similar values and I hope they take these on board and add to them with good values of their own! As a Muslim, I could do better, I don't always pray five times a day.. I watch the odd bit of Porn... but other than the odd "vice" (excessive amounts of golf) I'm good man (I think), I don't and have never done drugs, smoked, drunk alcohol, that to a certain degree was due to my up bringing as a Muslim, peer pressure was never an issue, to do such things never interested me, plus I saved loads of money not being addicted to that ****e.. I have no issues with Gay people, people of different race (no, I won't use the.. "I've some black/white mates" I do but I won't...), religion or lack of religion, we're all human, we all have flaws, and as long as this flaws aren't fundamentally wrong, then don't hate, learn from one another.. I'm pretty certain that the vast majority of the Muslims in the UK are more like me than the nut jobs that continue to hijack my religion.. What are we as a community doing about IT? Within my extended family, we're doing our best to uphold our beliefs and morals.. Within the mosque I attend. I know the Imam has forever preached to everyone for inclusion, be part of the community for the greater good of the community, be a positive not a negative, be a giver not a taker. I will agree to a certain degree, that some communities tend to keep matters in house, I think that should be stopped, I'd rather my family be "shamed" for handing in a relative with "non-islamic" beliefs than see said person go on to kill one person, I would like to add that this attitude however has nothing to do with Islam but more to do with a cultural up bringing of these communities.. Bit like the IRA not handing in one of their own, or the KKK for banishing a dragon because he dared to look at a black woman and thought, "you know what, I would!" I digress.. Now, if I may, add my grievance to this debate... Am I entilted to have one.. seen some express there's in this thread and its become an "agenda" I have no agenda.. Given the good my mosque tries to do, why is this institution not highlighted more and many others like it in the UK? Not saying don't report on the Mosque that is preaching hate, by all means, do so, but ever heard about balance? The majority of news on Islam/Imams, Mosque's is, for want of a better word, bad, so, the main stream folk, who like their news spoon feed, automatically assume Mosque = Bad = Islam = Terrorist = Bunch of ****s! So by the general tarring of Islam I am a ****? and Islam is full of nut job hate filled terrorists? From my point of view, that couldn't be further from the truth.. Going back to my "Moderate" Islamic practice.. I for one don't preach about it, I simply don't have enough knowledge on Islam, but I'm pretty certain I know more about it than 99% of non-Muslims... Yet whenever IS/Talaban commit an atrocity everyone becomes an expert, that does make laugh, you have no intrinsic knowledge of the religion, you nit pick at certain verses in the Koran similar to the like of IS, you/they take the part they believe benefits them/their agenda/news circulation. A bit back ground on the Koran.. One of the wonders of the Koran was the language it was written in.. its written in a very poetic form of Arabic, a form that if interpreted incorrectly can mean something totally different, now there were four main Imam's, Abu Hanifa, Malik, Al-Shafi and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal they spent their entire lives researching the Koran and its meaning as well as associating the teachings of the Prophet PBUH (otherwise known has Hadith) with the teachings in the Koran itself, you can't have one without the other.. did you know that? Given this, what makes anyone (I include myself in this..) that's not done similar, that doesn't have a grasp on the Arabic the Koran is written in, never spoke to those that were in the company of our Prophet PBUH, as the Imam's I've mentioned above have, how do they become an expert? Because they did a Goggle search, listened Fox News or BBC Middle Correspondent?? My local Imam, who is a lovely humble man, he claims not to know everything about Islam, far from it and on occasions will defer to his teachers (Mufti's) for advice.. Before I go on.. as anyone lost a relative to a terrorist act carried our by the IS/Taliban? I have.. I have lost 4 family members, two uncles, a cousin and a nephew... They didn't blow themselves up... They were fighting the Taliban... For you and me.. Did you light a candle for them? start a Twitter campaign hold a moments silence... these guys were Muslims... The Taliban and IS have killed more Muslims than Westerners! Where's the outrage when they die? Again, I'm a moderate Muslim with good western values, but even I get "outraged" by the blatant double standards in the media in its reporting of events.. Muslims killed by IS/Taliban.. meh... IS/Taliban kill non-muslims, outrage (I'll include myself, I'm outraged too but I'm also outraged when Muslims are killed to, no more no less!) I could go on.. but I need to go post in the Brazilian GP thread... In short, the killings on Friday saddened me, I cried, loss of life is sad time. Do I as a Muslim feel I need to apologies for the actions of these terrorists, no, because its MY BELIEF that the idiots that carried out these actions are not Muslims, they're members of nut job cult that twists the teachings to suit their own beliefs! If I did apologies, would I then be entitled to apology from every one that voted for Labour? After all it was Blair that invaded Iraq on a lie and killed millions of innocent people and lead to the death (unnecessary) of our service men and woman, the same applies to all those that voted in George Bush (twice FFS!) The world is broke, it needs fixing, not sure those in charge have a clue how to do it.. because, those that are in charge are has morally corrupt as those they wish to defeat...
Muhammeds military career is not in dispute. Even you don't deny it. You do however think a feared mulilitary leader didnt use violence. He didn't always, sometimes he gave them a choice. Convert or remain and be treated as a second class citizens. Muslims howecer enjoyed a few perks, like lower taxes etc. I'm a fan of no religion, all have dark histories that the followers like to forget about now as it paints them in a bad light. Except it doesn't, the constant denials and shouts of discrimination do the harm. Muhammed lived 1600 years ago. You may be unaware but people were very different back then.
The left are massive ******s. As big as the far right. Two morons on the opposite side of the same coin.
I stated last night my biggest concern isn't for us here in the west, but of mass murder of Muslims in the middle east.. Not just from Isis but from the many factions. Yesterday I came across an article regarding a feared Shai Muslim fighter, nicknamed the angel of death. He was very happy that he had just cooked and carved an Isis soldier. That is abhorrant and frankly disturbing.
You soft ****, Spurlock gave a first hand account of that being the case from a Muslim point of view.
it's a shame you had to publish a biography and a microscopic view of your daily life and thoughts for some of these people to realise that Muslims are normal people @ johnnykopblaws.
If you had to go to that level to appease people, then surely they should be doing the same. Whats SAFC83, UIR and so on doing about the drones, the friendly rebels etc? "Not in My Name" How are they speaking out and where? Did you guys open a thread for them and show the outrage then?
No because I didn't think it was their fault what the government does...we live and learn though...and maybe someone will. Plus some of them are too busy getting their rocks off mocking faiths and then acting shocked when they get retaliation.
Your definition of a "Brit" is very iffy UIR, in reality Brits come in many colours, shapes, sizes and religions and some even don't believe in religion.
So you dont think people should be brought to justice and to find out why and what went on? Instead we should just wipe them out.
I'm not a religious man, just isn't the way I was brought up. What seems clear to me is that all religious texts, be they Islamic, Christian, whatever, are open to interpretation, and to abuse by those who would twist what has been written for their own aims. Again, I've never read the Quran, but I get the sense from what's been posted here that this is pretty much what ISIS are doing.
