Pelle: Does anyone still doubt him.

[Archers Road]

Back to goal is a very difficult game to play, so inevitably he will have good days and not so good. When he is on his game he would be an asset to most sides. Is he top four? As much as Giroud is..

Interesting comparison. Would I swap Pelle for Giroud? Nope, definitely not.

Apart from Aguero, I can't think of too many PL strikers I definitely would swap him for.

 

[fatletiss]

Pelle is not the offense.

When we weren't scoring, it wasn't all his fault. Now that we are doing well, it's not because he's made some miraculous turnaround and is suddenly awesome.

Honestly, Chelsea's defense was horrible. Everyone on Saints had their way with them.

A game or two from now, we might run into tough side away who chooses to park the bus and then if we don't score I suppose Pelle will be a lazy, terrible player again.

My critique of Pelle started a long time back and was based on what I saw at the games. He was making some basic errors that anyone who had played a half decent level or been coached at a decent level would see. It was happening a lot.

Your comment about back to being lazy, is a lazy post )) My comments about him doing this were from the West Brom game and united second half, not every game.

Let's start being sensible and not taking a brush, covering it in one or two analysis and then tarring all views from someone with that one brush. Some people forget that it is possible to see different things from the same player in the same game and from game to game. I have always felt that for months he tried the flick too many time sand too often - you don't do 7 or 8 hoping one comes off, you do it at the right time. In the last few games, he has not done that, maybe trying a couple a game. That's good centre forward play. He holds it up when into feet so much better now.

my post above says it for me. 8 games. 2 great games, one half a great game. 2 games where he did stop working - I was there, saw it with my own eyes and discussed it with people around me at the time. The TV cameras may have been looking the other way. It is possible.

Anyway, I'm hoping that he has been spoken to by Ron and got his act together. The player who worked so hard against Chelsea and Swansea (and united first half), certainly wasn't looking like the bloke at West Brom.

 

[fatletiss]

I've never doubted him, I think he is a fabulous CF.

I think he does his job extremely well, and gets a lot of unfair criticism from fans because of occasional off games which are typical of most players that lead the line. Apart from the great players at the big teams, not many are that consistent in this position. It's a bloody tough job and he is bound to get frustrated when the team are playing badly or he's not having a good game.

Frustration doesn't excuse not working. I've witnessed him do that this season. If people haven't, then fine. Maybe I watch more off the ball stuff than others. Maybe I follow football differently. It is possible..

 

[fatletiss]

I'll just say this. Back, when I first started supporting Saints, Ron Davies was the man. In retrospect he is loved and people often wax lyrical about how high he used to climb and then how unexpectedly good he was on the deck too, considering he was supposed to be **** at ground zero.

Well, the unvarnished truth is that, half the time he wasn't Superman. And, as a kid I couldn't believe the amount of moans and groans I would hear directed towards my first football hero. Supporters expect superhuman performances and nothing less will do - especially now that they are paid superhuman salaries. But they're just the same, only fitter and richer. So when I watch the games and see Pelle isolated up front during away games and he gets discouraged I kind of sympathise with him because I know he's quite hard on himself anyway. He isn't he best player in the world, but he heads the ball as good as anybody else these days, and he manages to do it without stirring a hair on his head - some achievement. And, for such a unit of a bloke [if a bit weedy in the chest area] he has a fantastic touch that isn't 100% perfect. On the days it is, it's superb. On the days it isn't, well let's hope Sadio has a good 'un. But he makes goals, scores goals, looks good and he's all ours. Now carry on.

I agree with this TSS. It's a really good analysis, although I don't think his touch is fantastic with his feet.

 

[fran-MLs little camera]

Forget the past, forget that Man Utd have signed Martial.

Hypothetical question for the present day: Who would you rather lead the line in your team... Pelle or Rooney?

I thought about this when watching Arsenal beat United. I would rather have Pelle, though it is possible that Rooney would have more success if he played in a side that suited him. I am not a Rooney hater....I think he is a 100% player for team and country, but would have been better if he didn't have to do everything for himself. Pelle (like Lambert) is a skilful player that looks even better when he plays for Saints. And he's more adorable than Rooney (adorability being one of the main factors the Black Box considers ).

Reminded me of his answer when asked about a brace of goals for Tadic: I am happy for him, but would be more happy if it was me.

 

[fran-MLs little camera]

P.s. If Pelle was perfect in all ways, he wouldn't be here.

 

[----HistoryRepeating----]

His hair resents that!

 

[saintkitch]

I'm a massive fan of Pelle not sure if i've mentioned that before . As people have already said there are not many in the premier league i would swap him with. Yes he has his off times but lets be honest its a bit unfair to expect every player to be on it 100% of the time. It frustrates me when i hear negative comments about him as it seems to me some fans are desperate for him to have an off period so they can get on his back, i don't see these fans doing the same to other players when there performances are not 100%, The Utd game was a perfect example of this yes his second half performance didn't match his first but i think its since come out that he was carrying a knock and he still scored a good goal.

I think maybe Koeman relies too heavily on Pelle in that he would rather play a 80% fit Pelle than leave him out, i also think that maybe an 80% fit Pelle may just not be up for it as much as he should be and this sometimes comes across to fans as lazy and uninterested. Not sure if thats a Pelle attitude problem or a Koeman not having confidence in Pelle replacement problem.

 

[Archers Road]

On the subject of the poor 2nd half vs man utd, it was a poor team performance.

We hardly got out of our half for 30 minutes, and had virtually no sustained possession at all. It did seem a bit perverse to me at the time that the striker who scored 2 goals was singled out for criticism in a game which, imo we lost because we had a disjointed midfield and no experienced full backs; but yeah, we all see different things.

 

[Beddy]

There should be no doubt as to Pelle's ability. Like all fans we want to see him do the business game in game out. The truth should be obvious to us all though that with the best will in the world no player no matter how brilliant is going to be able to do that. He like all strikers will have his "golden days" and his very dark days. Come the end of the season though I wouldn't mind betting he will be among the top half a dozen scorers in the premier league. We need to add more from the others thats for sure. However it is my view Pelle will be up there with the best or not far off!

 

[ChilcoSaint]

I'll just say this. Back, when I first started supporting Saints, Ron Davies was the man. In retrospect he is loved and people often wax lyrical about how high he used to climb and then how unexpectedly good he was on the deck too, considering he was supposed to be **** at ground zero.

Well, the unvarnished truth is that, half the time he wasn't Superman. And, as a kid I couldn't believe the amount of moans and groans I would hear directed towards my first football hero. Supporters expect superhuman performances and nothing less will do - especially now that they are paid superhuman salaries. But they're just the same, only fitter and richer. So when I watch the games and see Pelle isolated up front during away games and he gets discouraged I kind of sympathise with him because I know he's quite hard on himself anyway. He isn't he best player in the world, but he heads the ball as good as anybody else these days, and he manages to do it without stirring a hair on his head - some achievement. And, for such a unit of a bloke [if a bit weedy in the chest area] he has a fantastic touch that isn't 100% perfect. On the days it is, it's superb. On the days it isn't, well let's hope Sadio has a good 'un. But he makes goals, scores goals, looks good and he's all ours. Now carry on.

Spot on TSS. If you compare Pellè with any of our "target man" style strikers from Ron Davies onwards: players like Beattie and of course Rickie (although Rickie was much more than a target man he did play the role a lot), none of them were brilliant all the time. The times they were on song made up for all the times they weren't, and the same is true for Graziano. I'll put up with an occasional lack of effort, like against West Brom, if more often than not he has a good one. Plus, of course, performances like on Saturday, scoring one and making a couple more.

 

[Le Tissier's Laces]

I'm a big fan of Pelle's and have no doubt at all in his ability. Considering the rumours when he signed that basically we may as well have carried on playing Brett Ormerod up front, and considering what he cost, he's been nothing short of a revelation.

I don't want to go over the MU game as it's been done to death, but just want to point out that of course on TV they follow the ball, and when you're at the game you have a broader perspective of what's happening across the pitch, and particularly off the ball. Players will always have bad games, sometimes they'll have bad periods within games where ultimately they play brilliantly (funnily enough, I didn't think Sadio had a hugely effective first 25 or so against Chelsea, then he exploded into life). There's a difference though between playing badly (it happens) and having a less than excellent attitude (that's less acceptable, particularly as a fan). That was the only question in forty minutes of that game. People shouldn't be barracked for expressing an frustration when a player seems not to be trying. It also absolutely doesn't mean you have something inherently against a player.

But, as has been said, perhaps RK saw that too (who would have thought) and has had a word - since then he's been incredible, and in answer to one of the questions, there are very few strikers I'd swap him for when he plays like this, particularly with a team set up as ours is. He's the perfect foil.

The most encouraging thing is as well, I think he's getting better too.

 

[Le Tissier's Laces]

I'll just say this. Back, when I first started supporting Saints, Ron Davies was the man. In retrospect he is loved and people often wax lyrical about how high he used to climb and then how unexpectedly good he was on the deck too, considering he was supposed to be **** at ground zero.

Well, the unvarnished truth is that, half the time he wasn't Superman. And, as a kid I couldn't believe the amount of moans and groans I would hear directed towards my first football hero. Supporters expect superhuman performances and nothing less will do - especially now that they are paid superhuman salaries. But they're just the same, only fitter and richer. So when I watch the games and see Pelle isolated up front during away games and he gets discouraged I kind of sympathise with him because I know he's quite hard on himself anyway. He isn't he best player in the world, but he heads the ball as good as anybody else these days, and he manages to do it without stirring a hair on his head - some achievement. And, for such a unit of a bloke [if a bit weedy in the chest area] he has a fantastic touch that isn't 100% perfect. On the days it is, it's superb. On the days it isn't, well let's hope Sadio has a good 'un. But he makes goals, scores goals, looks good and he's all ours. Now carry on.

Excellent post TSS.

 

[fran-MLs little camera]

Mane walks on water at the moment, so no one notices his quiet spells. TBH most fans appreciate Graziano. He is usually full of joie de vivre (or the Italian version of it), but the flipside is that he can also be dramatically moody (on rare occasions). The way to keep Pelle happy is to give him the ball in the right position and let him keep on scoring. Special note: he hates not scoring if everyone else is...after first 4-5 goals, Graziano must be given the ball at all times or pent up frustration may make his quiff droop (if indeed it is really hair).

 

[fatletiss]

I'm a massive fan of Pelle not sure if i've mentioned that before . As people have already said there are not many in the premier league i would swap him with. Yes he has his off times but lets be honest its a bit unfair to expect every player to be on it 100% of the time. It frustrates me when i hear negative comments about him as it seems to me some fans are desperate for him to have an off period so they can get on his back, i don't see these fans doing the same to other players when there performances are not 100%, The Utd game was a perfect example of this yes his second half performance didn't match his first but i think its since come out that he was carrying a knock and he still scored a good goal.

I think maybe Koeman relies too heavily on Pelle in that he would rather play a 80% fit Pelle than leave him out, i also think that maybe an 80% fit Pelle may just not be up for it as much as he should be and this sometimes comes across to fans as lazy and uninterested. Not sure if thats a Pelle attitude problem or a Koeman not having confidence in Pelle replacement problem.

I have been one of the critics no doubt. Just to put the record straight, I am so far from desperate that he has a bad game, that you won't believe it. Please remember I am a Saints fan. I am also one of those fans who defended his signing against those that slaughtered him before he'd even played, as pointed out by someone yesterday.

I am absolutely desperate for him to carry on trying to play the way he has the last two games (I understand that level can't be achieved all the time). Trying to do the right things makes me happy. Doing the right things makes me ecstatic! To me, he has been trying to do the right things recently.

Let's hope he continues as he is and this can be left, as believe me that is what I want. To suggest otherwise is a little silly.

 

[fran-MLs little camera]

I have been one of the critics no doubt. Just to put the record straight, I am so far from desperate that he has a bad game, that you won't believe it. Please remember I am a Saints fan. I am also one of those fans who defended his signing against those that slaughtered him before he'd even played, as pointed out by someone yesterday.

I am absolutely desperate for him to carry on trying to play the way he has the last two games (I understand that level can't be achieved all the time). Trying to do the right things makes me happy. Doing the right things makes me ecstatic! To me, he has been trying to do the right things recently.

Let's hope he continues as he is and this can be left, as believe me that is what I want. To suggest otherwise is a little silly.

But you are a reasonable person, FLT (by football forum standards anyway ). There have been players in the past who could do no right in fans eyes....must be harder for such fans to find someone to blame in the present team.

 

[Le Tissier's Laces]

But you are a reasonable person, FLT (by football forum standards anyway ). There have been players in the past who could do no right in fans eyes....must be harder for such fans to find someone to blame in the present team.

Tends to be Maya or Martina these days!

 

[......loading......]

I think we need to stop harping on about FLT and LTL's post-match comments after Man U. They were a critique, not a barracking, and therefore valid. Yes, to some of us it seemed to be a critique of lesser import than why the whole team folded, but it was still a valid critique.

The main thing to remember is that we all like Pelle and we are all allowed to be frustrated when he waves his arms around rather than actually track the man himself. I do think Koeman has told him he is to save his energy for going forward rather than back so perhaps that aspect of his game isn't really his fault. The silly flicks? I hate them when they're bad and laud them when they come off. You see, I'm a hypocritical, passionate and totally pigheaded football fan.

 

[saintkitch]

I have been one of the critics no doubt. Just to put the record straight, I am so far from desperate that he has a bad game, that you won't believe it. Please remember I am a Saints fan. I am also one of those fans who defended his signing against those that slaughtered him before he'd even played, as pointed out by someone yesterday.

I am absolutely desperate for him to carry on trying to play the way he has the last two games (I understand that level can't be achieved all the time). Trying to do the right things makes me happy. Doing the right things makes me ecstatic! To me, he has been trying to do the right things recently.

Let's hope he continues as he is and this can be left, as believe me that is what I want. To suggest otherwise is a little silly.

Yeah sorry completely worded that wrong i know no fan is desperate for him to fail, ok in my view some fans jump on Pelle's back alot quicker than other players. He seems to be a figure that some find very easy to criticise.

 

[St. Luigi Scrosoppi]

Yeah sorry completely worded that wrong i know no fan is desperate for him to fail, ok in my view some fans jump on Pelle's back alot quicker than other players. He seems to be a figure that some find very easy to criticise.

There is nothing wrong with Pelle but there is a lot wrong with some of our fans especially the blokes who sit behind me.