City transfer thread

[Steven Toast]

I think you need to look at players from a team perspective. Football is a team game. Your not going to play a full midfield of people who get assists and score all the time. For every Geovanni your gonna need an Ashbee in there too. In 2011/12 McKenna played in the midfield mainly with Corry Evans and Koren so it wasn't his job to make that difference attacking wise.

Not all players have to do something individually amazing or standout to make them effective and to help win a football match. Working hard is part of winning the overall battle. Not all players are in the team to specifically score and get assists.

Quinn made his impact in games by helping us keep possession and by hurrying the opposition.

That's exactly what other teams have. Diame aside, how many of our midfielders scored goals last season? It was a major failing in the side and everybody pinned the goal ratio on our strikers, but most other teams had goals coming from other places. I agree you need a 'midfield general', but you need one that influences a game and Quinn just didn't do that enough for me

 

[roseniorhisgranisfromhull]

Wow. Seasons over before we've kicked a ball or signed a player according to mystic meg here.

Obviously missed the words 'personally' and 'expecting'.

Quinn was alright, but I think the reason he got so many MOtM votes is an indictment of Hull as a city. We value hard working players because we're a working class City (which is why I think people on here like Meyler so much), but in reality, for all Quinn's workmanlike running and neat ball control, he never actually stood out in any of the games I saw (which were ALL of last seasons). That's not to say he was bad, but a couple of them (Arsenal at home instantly springs to mind) the other players around him were so poor they made him look good. He never went for goal, he passed sideways all the time (not a bad thing) and his assist count was very low. His actual footballing ability isn't Premier League quality, that's pretty clear and had Diame not been injured he wouldn't have been playing nearly as much as he did. Even as a left sided midfielder, he'd be behind Brady and Snodgrass (who is primarily a RW but he can play LW if needed).

Talk of him being irreplaceable is ridiculous; of course we can replace him, we said the same about Ashbee, Campbell, Myhill, Geovanni, Turner et al and we managed to get promoted. Same can be said of Rosenior. There was no questioning his commitment to our club (which is great) and he is a model professional, but if you think we couldn't find a better RB in today's market then you need to broaden your footballing horizons a little.

We need to shed this irritating reliance on players who work hard but aren't actually up to a standard that match the level we're playing at and start acccepting that we need players who both work hard AND make a real difference on the pitch. Paul McKenna was another one, hard worker and a good tackler, but other than that, what did he actually do to drive us forward or help get us the win? What did James Harper actually do for all his pointing and waving? Richard Garcia, Craig ***an, Will Atkinson... All decent players, all hard workers, but just lacked that cutting edge that allowed them to really influence a game and stand out.

Few points here.

If Quinn only stood out because he was better than everyone else, is that a valid reason to not mind him going? Unless you expect a re-haul involving a full new starting XI then I'd suggest the fact that he looked better than everyone else was certainly not an argument in favour of letting him go.

As stated earlier, his assist count was higher than any of our other central midfielders, and only Diame scored more, returning to the first point, we have no-one better. But I suspect people will ignore that once more as it doesn't suit their argument.

I don't know of anyone who said Turner, Myhill or Geo were irreplaceable, and we've never fully replaced Ash.

The players you bring up there really aren't similar and don't necessarily help your case. McKenna did a job shoring up our midfield when we had no money to spend, Harper was a talentless bastard, Garcia was instrumental in getting us promoted, ***an was good in his first spell and okay in the 2008/09 season when played as a winger, Atkinson played 6 games.

So you list a fairly irrelevant bunch of ex-City players; some of whom were great, some were okay, some were ****e and one barely kicked a ball for us.

 

[roseniorhisgranisfromhull]

That's exactly what other teams have. Diame aside, how many of our midfielders scored goals last season? It was a major failing in the side and everybody pinned the goal ratio on our strikers, but most other teams had goals coming from other places. I agree you need a 'midfield general', but you need one that influences a game and Quinn just didn't do that enough for me

He didn't do that enough for you in the 2012/13 season? I really can't believe anyone who watched us regularly that season would make that claim.

 

[GLP]

Quinn was alright, but I think the reason he got so many MOtM votes is an indictment of Hull as a city. We value hard working players because we're a working class City (which is why I think people on here like Meyler so much), but in reality, for all Quinn's workmanlike running and neat ball control, he never actually stood out in any of the games I saw (which were ALL of last seasons). That's not to say he was bad, but a couple of them (Arsenal at home instantly springs to mind) the other players around him were so poor they made him look good. He never went for goal, he passed sideways all the time (not a bad thing) and his assist count was very low. His actual footballing ability isn't Premier League quality, that's pretty clear and had Diame not been injured he wouldn't have been playing nearly as much as he did. Even as a left sided midfielder, he'd be behind Brady and Snodgrass (who is primarily a RW but he can play LW if needed).

Talk of him being irreplaceable is ridiculous; of course we can replace him, we said the same about Ashbee, Campbell, Myhill, Geovanni, Turner et al and we managed to get promoted. Same can be said of Rosenior. There was no questioning his commitment to our club (which is great) and he is a model professional, but if you think we couldn't find a better RB in today's market then you need to broaden your footballing horizons a little.

We need to shed this irritating reliance on players who work hard but aren't actually up to a standard that match the level we're playing at and start acccepting that we need players who both work hard AND make a real difference on the pitch. Paul McKenna was another one, hard worker and a good tackler, but other than that, what did he actually do to drive us forward or help get us the win? What did James Harper actually do for all his pointing and waving? Richard Garcia, Craig ***an, Will Atkinson... All decent players, all hard workers, but just lacked that cutting edge that allowed them to really influence a game and stand out.

I don't think Richard Garcia should be included in that list of other players you mention. Richard Garcia was quite an integral player for us. He earnt our first point away in the PL v Blackburn by scoring. Integral in our passage to the play off final.

 

[roseniorhisgranisfromhull]

I don't think Richard Garcia should be included in that list of other players you mention. Richard Garcia was quite an integral player for us. He earnt our first point away in the PL v Blackburn by scoring. Integral in our passage to the play off final.

No he just worked hard, I'd much rather have someone like Ramirez or Ben Arfa who are technically great but did **** all to help the team.

Must just be a 'Hull' thing...

 

[GLP]

I think you need to look at players from a team perspective. Football is a team game. Your not going to play a full midfield of people who get assists and score all the time. For every Geovanni your gonna need an Ashbee in there too. In 2011/12 McKenna played in the midfield mainly with Corry Evans and Koren so it wasn't his job to make that difference attacking wise.

Not all players have to do something individually amazing or standout to make them effective and to help win a football match. Working hard is part of winning the overall battle. Not all players are in the team to specifically score and get assists.

Quinn made his impact in games by helping us keep possession and by hurrying the opposition.

RoKo10 has a good understanding of the mechanics of a team. Great post.

 

[Steven Toast]

No he just worked hard, I'd much rather have someone like Ramirez or Ben Arfa who are technically great but did **** all to help the team.

Must just be a 'Hull' thing...

See that's exactly the attitude I'm talking about. The two players you mentioned might not have worked out for us as we'd hoped (boy is that a understatement), but I honestly get the feeling that some people would rather have 11 Quinns and Meylers and get relegated than have some class footballers who are a little lazy and get us promoted. Players can be both hard working and technically good and that's what we need. Huddlestone doesn't run much, but he's head and shoulder's above Quinn in terms of ability. But becuase Quinn runs around more, he's more endearing to the fans.

 

[GLP]

See that's exactly the attitude I'm talking about. The two players you mentioned might not have worked out for us as we'd hoped (boy is that a understatement), but I honestly get the feeling that some people would rather have 11 Quinns and Meylers and get relegated than have some class footballers who are a little lazy and get us promoted. Players can be both hard working and technically good and that's what we need. Huddlestone doesn't run much, but he's head and shoulder's above Quinn in terms of ability. But becuase Quinn runs around more, he's more endearing to the fans.

What and still get relegated? I think you're living in cloud cuckoo land. Players that are hard working and technically good generally play in the Premier League. In case it has escaped your attention we are now in the Championship.

 

[Steven Toast]

What and still get relegated? I think you're living in cloud cuckoo land. Players that are hard working and technically good generally play in the Premier League. In case it has escaped your attention we are now in the Championship.

And to get out of the Championship you need to be better than 22 of the other teams in that league. If you have Championship quality players, that's where you'll be. We need to be getting players in who are too good for this league, like we did last time. We have lads like Chester, Dawson, Brady, Snodgrass, Robertson, Huddlestone and Diame who are too good for this league really and we can build around them.

 

[GLP]

And to get out of the Championship you need to be better than 22 of the other teams in that league. If you have Championship quality players, that's where you'll be. We need to be getting players in who are too good for this league, like we did last time. We have lads like Chester, Dawson, Brady, Snodgrass, Robertson, Huddlestone and Diame who are too good for this league really and we can build around them.

Like Fulham and Wigan?

Bournemouth went up as Champions with players that had little to no experience of the PL. Mostly unknown quantities at Championship level.

 

[Steven Toast]

Like Fulham and Wigan?

Bournemouth went up as Champions with players that had little to no experience of the PL. Mostly unknown quantities at Championship level.

Dan Gosling, Andrew Surman, Junior Stanislas, Ian Harte, Artur Boruc and Kenwyne Jones all had plenty of Premier League experience between them. Regardless of whether they'd played at the top level or not, their ability as footballers was better than that of the average Championship player, hence their promotion. They didn't get promoted by simply running around a lot and hassling the opposition, they got promoted by outplaying the other teams.

 

[Fettis the striker]

and back to transfers

 

[Fettis the striker]

hull daily mail reporting ince set for talks with city tomorrow

 

[roseniorhisgranisfromhull]

See that's exactly the attitude I'm talking about. The two players you mentioned might not have worked out for us as we'd hoped (boy is that a understatement), but I honestly get the feeling that some people would rather have 11 Quinns and Meylers and get relegated than have some class footballers who are a little lazy and get us promoted. Players can be both hard working and technically good and that's what we need. Huddlestone doesn't run much, but he's head and shoulder's above Quinn in terms of ability. But becuase Quinn runs around more, he's more endearing to the fans.

I suspect you missed me taking the piss.

If Huddlestone is head and shoulders above Quinn why did Quinn create more chances, score more goals and have more assists to his name?

If the options are Quinn and Meyler or Ramirez and Ben Arfa, then you're right, I'd take the former pair every day of the week.

If that means I have a 'Hull' attitude to you then so be it. For the record, Quinn isn't a workhorse at all, he's a tidy central midfielder who links play well, exceptionally well in the Championship. The fact that he works hard and gives a **** is merely a bonus.

 

[Steven Toast]

I suspect you missed me taking the piss.

If Huddlestone is head and shoulders above Quinn why did Quinn create more chances, score more goals and have more assists to his name?

If the options are Quinn and Meyler or Ramirez and Ben Arfa, then you're right, I'd take the former pair every day of the week.

If that means I have a 'Hull' attitude to you then so be it. For the record, Quinn isn't a workhorse at all, he's a tidy central midfielder who links play well, exceptionally well in the Championship. The fact that he works hard and gives a **** is merely a bonus.

You would in hindsight, but I don't think anybody (Newcastle fans aside) thought they'd be as ineffective as they were, otherwise SB wouldn't have bothered signing them. If you found out we were signing a French and a Uruguayan international tomorrow, both of whom have very good pedigrees as footballers, you wouldn't be gutted, would you?

As for Huddlestone, he had a very average season last year, but the year before that, he was good. I don't base how good players are on one season, it's how good they've been throughout their careers. Once a player picks up a skill, they don't lose it. Tom's passing ability, shooting and vision are far superior to Quinn's, that much I'm sure of. We didn't see much of it last season for one reason or another, but it doesn't mean it's gone all together. Quinn, for all his dogged determination and play linking just isn't effective enough in games for me. Again, I don't think he's a bad player, but if we want to be getting promoted again and staying there, we shouldn't be saying daft things like "he's irreplaceable" or "he's our best midfielder", it's a massive over-exaggeration and it's completely unnecessary.

 

[BillyBobBallbag]

Quinn was alright, but I think the reason he got so many MOtM votes is an indictment of Hull as a city. We value hard working players because we're a working class City (which is why I think people on here like Meyler so much), but in reality, for all Quinn's workmanlike running and neat ball control, he never actually stood out in any of the games I saw (which were ALL of last seasons). That's not to say he was bad, but a couple of them (Arsenal at home instantly springs to mind) the other players around him were so poor they made him look good. He never went for goal, he passed sideways all the time (not a bad thing) and his assist count was very low. His actual footballing ability isn't Premier League quality, that's pretty clear and had Diame not been injured he wouldn't have been playing nearly as much as he did. Even as a left sided midfielder, he'd be behind Brady and Snodgrass (who is primarily a RW but he can play LW if needed).

Talk of him being irreplaceable is ridiculous; of course we can replace him, we said the same about Ashbee, Campbell, Myhill, Geovanni, Turner et al and we managed to get promoted. Same can be said of Rosenior. There was no questioning his commitment to our club (which is great) and he is a model professional, but if you think we couldn't find a better RB in today's market then you need to broaden your footballing horizons a little.

We need to shed this irritating reliance on players who work hard but aren't actually up to a standard that match the level we're playing at and start acccepting that we need players who both work hard AND make a real difference on the pitch. Paul McKenna was another one, hard worker and a good tackler, but other than that, what did he actually do to drive us forward or help get us the win? What did James Harper actually do for all his pointing and waving? Richard Garcia, Craig ***an, Will Atkinson... All decent players, all hard workers, but just lacked that cutting edge that allowed them to really influence a game and stand out.

Halfway through your post I was thinking Craig ***an, but come on Garcia was class.
First city player to play at a world cup

 

[TigerRoo]

Halfway through your post I was thinking Craig ***an, but come on Garcia was class.
First city player to play at a world cup

Richard is with his 8th Club (Perth Glory) where he signed a 2 year contract last year so, at 33 years of age, this will probably be his swan-song.
His best performances were with Hull City and he has gone on record to say that this was the most enjoyable time of his career.

Meanwhile, this bloke looks like yet another 'accident waiting to happen' so we will probably bring him in:

http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/780547226?-1899:1000:3

 

[Fez]

might

Might?!?!?

 

[Fez]

He isn't. He's a RB or a RWB.

He's not a RB, but he will be played there. What is a RWB? When played by Bruce, he spends very little time defending and when defence becomes the imperative we change to 4-4-2 with no wing-backs and, yes, you've guessed it, full-backs.

 

[Fez]

I think you need to look at players from a team perspective. Football is a team game. Your not going to play a full midfield of people who get assists and score all the time. For every Geovanni your gonna need an Ashbee in there too. In 2011/12 McKenna played in the midfield mainly with Corry Evans and Koren so it wasn't his job to make that difference attacking wise.

Not all players have to do something individually amazing or standout to make them effective and to help win a football match. Working hard is part of winning the overall battle. Not all players are in the team to specifically score and get assists.

Quinn made his impact in games by helping us keep possession and by hurrying the opposition.

Decent post.