John Barnes says being black has damaged his career as a manager

[UnitedinRed]

Fergie lost 9 in his 1st season at Aberdeen.

Not at Celtic though? A team with 40+ league titles?

Its like losing 8 at madrid amd complaining how the Elche manager still has a job despite losing 10.

 

[johnsonsbaby]

Going by some of the comments on here I'd say that racism is going to be with us for some time. It's somewhat disappointing that people who clearly don't understand the argument are boiling it down to something they do understand and rebutting it on that level. The idea that it can be thought that because you haven't witnessed something, it doesn't exist, is disheartening and I'm not talking to the obvious wums here either.

 

[Page_Moss_Kopite]

Not at Celtic though? A team with 40+ league titles?

Its like losing 8 at madrid amd complaining how the Elche manager still has a job despite losing 10.

Man Utd had won a few titles when Fergie joined.

He was ****e for a few years when he started at OT though, had fans chanting "Fergie Out"

Sometimes it pays for clubs to be patient.

 

[Tobes]

Going by some of the comments on here I'd say that racism is going to be with us for some time. It's somewhat disappointing that people who clearly don't understand the argument are boiling it down to something they do understand and rebutting it on that level. The idea that it can be thought that because you haven't witnessed something, it doesn't exist, is disheartening and I'm not talking to the obvious wums here either.

So labelling people who've had the temerity to challenge the unsubstantiated comments from Barnes with reasoned logic and facts, are racists and 'don't understand' the issue as well as intellectual heavy weights such as yourself then.... you pompous, sanctimonious ****ehawk.

 

[Page_Moss_Kopite]

So labelling people who've had the temerity to challenge the unsubstantiated comments from Barnes with reasoned logic and facts, are racists and 'don't understand' the issue as well as intellectual heavy weights such as yourself then.... you pompous, sanctimonious ****ehawk.

You seem to be taking jb's criticism personally Tobes.

But as you're a "usual wum" he didn't mean you.

 

[johnsonsbaby]

You seem to be taking jb's criticism personally Tobes.

But as you're a "usual wum" he didn't mean you.

''Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity'' - MLK Jnr.

 

[Tobes]

You seem to be taking jb's criticism personally Tobes.

But as you're a "usual wum" he didn't mean you.

I don't take a word that 'man' says personally mate, I only reply to him to wind him up, as I know fine well he logs out and back in to read my posts

However, I took exception to that last post, as his intimation about other peoples stance on racism in general was bang out of order, and he was trying (and failing) to put himself on some faux moral high ground, as is his want, the pompous oaf.

 

[Super G Ted'inho]

Man Utd had won a few titles when Fergie joined.

He was ****e for a few years when he started at OT though, had fans chanting "Fergie Out"

Sometimes it pays for clubs to be patient.

Man Utd went 20yrs without a title prior to Fergie arriving.

Celtic won the league two season before Barnes arrived and the season after he left

The English league is a bit harder than the Scottish one too

 

[Page_Moss_Kopite]

Man Utd went 20yrs without a title prior to Fergie arriving.

Celtic won the league two season before Barnes arrived and the season after he left

Fergie dodged the bullet for 6 years before he got it right, sticking with him despite his years of failure more than paid off.

Sacking a manager during the season rarely works but Celtic gave it a go.

 

[Super G Ted'inho]

Fergie dodged the bullet for 6 years before he got it right, sticking with him despite his years of failure more than paid off.

Sacking a manager during the season rarely works but Celtic gave it a go.

I wasn't disagreeing with that. Comparing Barnes' stint at Celtic with Fergie's at Man Utd is ridiculous though. One was in a piss poor league where even when you don't win it, you don't expect to lose eight from twenty-nine matches!

Fergie taking over at Man Utd is more in liking to Rodgers taking over at Liverpool.

 

[Page_Moss_Kopite]

I wasn't disagreeing with that. Comparing Barnes' stint at Celtic with Fergie's at Man Utd is ridiculous though. One was in a piss poor league where even when you don't win it, you don't expect to lose eight from twenty-nine matches!

Fergie taking over at Man Utd is more in liking to Rodgers taking over at Liverpool.

I was fishing for a reaction from UIR with the Fergie stuff but you reacted instead.

 

[Super G Ted'inho]

I was fishing for a reaction from UIR with the Fergie stuff but you reacted instead.

So I gathered but I was bored

 

[carlthejackal]

Going by some of the comments on here I'd say that racism is going to be with us for some time. It's somewhat disappointing that people who clearly don't understand the argument are boiling it down to something they do understand and rebutting it on that level. The idea that it can be thought that because you haven't witnessed something, it doesn't exist, is disheartening and I'm not talking to the obvious wums here either.

There is no doubt in my mind that there is racism in the game still . Among the fans, the owners, the club officials, among the players even. But much less than a few decades ago but still there. The likes of Mackay and Whelan are the tip of the iceberg.

BUT Barnes was on slippery ground. By using his own personal example to demonstrate it he clouded the issue. He was appallingly bad. Celtic is a club that should lose only 2 matches in a season max. That sort of performance stays in people's minds. If he had applied for coaching jobs he could have had a point. But managers jobs? I wouldn't give bobby Charlton a managers job too because I think he was as bad as Barnes as a manager. Is it because I am biased against the mancs? May be he never applied again but he was never manager after Preston because he was simply not good enough.

Just because you were a brilliant player does not automatically mean you should be given other chances.

 

[Page_Moss_Kopite]

I wouldn't give bobby Charlton a managers job too because I think he was as bad as Barnes as a manager. Is it because I am biased against the mancs? May be he never applied again but he was never manager after Preston because he was simply not good enough.

Just because you were a brilliant player does not automatically mean you should be given other chances.

When it became apparent that he was a waste of space as a manager his mother club found a place for him in the boardroom and made him a club ambassador on a salary.
Fair play to Utd looking after him though.

 

[Bodinki]

People who spot racism under their beds at night really piss me off.

''Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity'' - MLK Jnr.

Barnes is blaming everyone else for his failings, thats it.
Your implication that everyone else has some subconscious racist agenda is pathetic mate.
Here are few words John Barnes should heed, in the immortal words of Rocky Balboa:
"Let me tell you something you already know.
The world ain’t all sunshine and rainbows. It’s a very mean and nasty place and I don’t care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it.
You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain’t about how hard ya hit. It’s about how hard you can get it and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That’s how winning is done!
Now if you know what you’re worth then go out and get what you’re worth. But ya gotta be willing to take the hits, and not pointing fingers saying you ain’t where you wanna be because of him, or her, or anybody! Cowards do that and that ain’t you! You’re better than that!"

 

[Page_Moss_Kopite]

People who spot racism under their beds at night really piss me off.


Barnes is blaming everyone else for his failings, thats it.
Your implication that everyone else has some subconscious racist agenda is pathetic mate.
Here are few words John Barnes should heed, in the immortal words of Rocky Balboa:
"Let me tell you something you already know.
The world ain’t all sunshine and rainbows. It’s a very mean and nasty place and I don’t care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it.
You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain’t about how hard ya hit. It’s about how hard you can get it and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That’s how winning is done!
Now if you know what you’re worth then go out and get what you’re worth. But ya gotta be willing to take the hits, and not pointing fingers saying you ain’t where you wanna be because of him, or her, or anybody! Cowards do that and that ain’t you! You’re better than that!"

He never said everyone " has a racist agenda" bod, he's saying like me and others there is undoubtedly still racism within the game irrespective of whether its had an effect on Barnes getting a job or not.
As Dave Whelan found to his cost, yesteryears throwaway racist remarks are not acceptable, you'd be naive to think he's the only one at boardroom level with those old fashioned traits.

btw Rocky is a blueshite so post quotes of his rantings on the Everton board.

 

[Bodinki]

He never said everyone " has a racist agenda" bod, he's saying like me and others there is undoubtedly still racism within the game irrespective of whether its had an effect on Barnes getting a job or not.
As Dave Whelan found to his cost, yesteryears throwaway racist remarks are not acceptable, you'd be naive to think he's the only one at boardroom level with those old fashioned traits.

btw Rocky is a blueshite so post quotes of his rantings on the Everton board.

"Going by some of the comments on here I'd say that racism is going to be with us for some time."
Sounds like thats exactly what he is saying,

There are racists everywhere in the world. But in todays football world, where it is cutthroat and all about the success and the money, do you seriously think that a football club would potentially stop their club achieving success through fear of hiring a black manager?
So you think, if a club thought he was right for them, that they would throw that opportunity away because of the colour of Barnes' skin.
When clubs these days will back players accused of racism (guilty or not), and give contracts to convicted rapists (until peer pressure stopped them), that being black is honestly a stumbling block?

Ethics, morality etc are not their concern, making money is. And I'd wager these clubs would use anyone they thought could bring in the green, whether they be white, black or orange and purple striped.

 

[carlthejackal]

When it became apparent that he was a waste of space as a manager his mother club found a place for him in the boardroom and made him a club ambassador on a salary.
Fair play to Utd looking after him though.

Bobby Charlton is the classical example of a great player who was a very poor manager.

As a player, Bobby >>> Jack his brother but as a manager Jack was hundred times better than Bobby. That should not surprise anyone because the manager's job is totally different to the player's.

It is like a brillant surgeon saying now that I have retired, I want to be the CEO of another big hospital. Even though I have messed up Glasgow Royal Infirmary when given the chance.

 

[carlthejackal]

"Going by some of the comments on here I'd say that racism is going to be with us for some time."
Sounds like thats exactly what he is saying,

There are racists everywhere in the world. But in todays football world, where it is cutthroat and all about the success and the money, do you seriously think that a football club would potentially stop their club achieving success through fear of hiring a black manager?
So you think, if a club thought he was right for them, that they would throw that opportunity away because of the colour of Barnes' skin.
When clubs these days will back players accused of racism (guilty or not), and give contracts to convicted rapists (until peer pressure stopped them), that being black is honestly a stumbling block?

Ethics, morality etc are not their concern, making money is. And I'd wager these clubs would use anyone they thought could bring in the green, whether they be white, black or orange and purple striped.

May be I should charge you a fee for plagiarism

 

[johnsonsbaby]

I wasn't disagreeing with that. Comparing Barnes' stint at Celtic with Fergie's at Man Utd is ridiculous though. One was in a piss poor league where even when you don't win it, you don't expect to lose eight from twenty-nine matches!

Fergie taking over at Man Utd is more in liking to Rodgers taking over at Liverpool.

Three of those losses were in Europe and cup games, they lost 5 in the league under Barnes and a further 4 with Dalglish - compounded by having their 40+ goals per season man Larsson out all season - [who had been top scorer in the previous 2 seasons and the following 4 seasons and on his return season scored 53!] .... but yes it was all down to Barnes I'm guessing the fact you keep going back to his time at Celtic you think it was fair enough it took a further 8 years to get another job.