The Wenger Criticism Thread

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lazarus20000 said:
It seems to me when we were in financial constraints, we were more likely to play our youth players. Now, we seem to just buy them. If we had the money then I doubt Wilshere would have made the team. Most of our best youth players were shop bought - Walcott, OXO, Chambers, Ramsey.....
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To be fair Walcott joined at 16 and has been with us almost ten years now, I think we can take some credit for developing him lol

Or do we not take any credit for fabregas either? Despite the fact he never would of had the opportunity to develop into the player he is without joining us.

It's very difficult to know which young players are going to make it, I reckon the odd playerreallystands out even as a kid but most you won't know of they are going to be good enough until they are well into there teen years. It's no surprise to me that so many youth products don't make it at the top.

Also when you consider that we have, or have had, a very young squad, you could hardly see us trying to play more inexperienced youths than we have over the last five years. So it will have been rather difficult for others to get a chance.

I'd like to see more youth players make it rather than just wilshere and Gibbs, but I'd be interested to look at the other top teams and see how many of there first eleven are developed youth players. Utd have none bar the two defenders they are being forced to play by having loads of defenders injured (basically players around bellerin level of development), city have none, Chelsea have terry, no-one who is currently under 30.

Yes, there are teams like Southampton with very good academies who bring through a lot of talent, but they are a team playing at a slightly lower level than we are who are forced to rely on youth due to financial constraints. Would those players who look good at Southampton make it at Chelsea or city if they where part of the youth setup there? Who knows, but it isn't a simple issue.

Also @omogooner - chambers isn't a natural CB, he is a RB who we have used as a CB, so your comment about using chambers out opposition is incorrect, we are currently playing him in the position he has played throughout his short career. We don't have the players to not play at lest one player out others natural position in defence. It's a toss up between bellerin the youth getting game time with chambers moved to CB (ie out of position) or monreal plays out of position at CB. I prefer the bellerin option to be fair as chambers looks comfortable at CB rather than the odd rush of blood to the head.
 
Also worth mentioning that out of the current crop we have: zelalem, gnabry, bellerin, toral and Campbell all on the edge of the first team squad.
 
I'm not sure about that - we used to develop young players even before the financial landscape was changed by Chelsea, and before we started building the stadium and had some money to spend.

I think it's a more worrying trend where Wenger, for so long putting his faith in youngsters, only to see them fall at the final hurdle, has maybe now in the last 3 seasons (before the financial constraints were lifted) decided he needs experienced players to rely on, maybe because he's felt under pressure? As a result we've bought Monreal, Merts, Kos, Giroud, Sanchez, Ozil, Cazorla, Arteta, Flamini, Debuchy, Ospina. The only exceptions seem to be Chambers and Welbeck (if you can call him a youngster). The only youngsters to really come through in that time have been Gnarby and maybe zelam (who hasn't got a great deal of playing time) and Oxo.
 
lazarus20000 said:
It seems to me when we were in financial constraints, we were more likely to play our youth players. Now, we seem to just buy them. If we had the money then I doubt Wilshere would have made the team. Most of our best youth players were shop bought - Walcott, OXO, Chambers, Ramsey.....
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Agreed.<ok>
 
afcftw said:
To be fair Walcott joined at 16 and has been with us almost ten years now, I think we can take some credit for developing him lol

Or do we not take any credit for fabregas either? Despite the fact he never would of had the opportunity to develop into the player he is without joining us.

It's very difficult to know which young players are going to make it, I reckon the odd playerreallystands out even as a kid but most you won't know of they are going to be good enough until they are well into there teen years. It's no surprise to me that so many youth products don't make it at the top.

Also when you consider that we have, or have had, a very young squad, you could hardly see us trying to play more inexperienced youths than we have over the last five years. So it will have been rather difficult for others to get a chance.

I'd like to see more youth players make it rather than just wilshere and Gibbs, but I'd be interested to look at the other top teams and see how many of there first eleven are developed youth players. Utd have none bar the two defenders they are being forced to play by having loads of defenders injured (basically players around bellerin level of development), city have none, Chelsea have terry, no-one who is currently under 30.

Yes, there are teams like Southampton with very good academies who bring through a lot of talent, but they are a team playing at a slightly lower level than we are who are forced to rely on youth due to financial constraints. Would those players who look good at Southampton make it at Chelsea or city if they where part of the youth setup there? Who knows, but it isn't a simple issue.

Also @omogooner - chambers isn't a natural CB, he is a RB who we have used as a CB, so your comment about using chambers out opposition is incorrect, we are currently playing him in the position he has played throughout his short career. We don't have the players to not play at lest one player out others natural position in defence. It's a toss up between bellerin the youth getting game time with chambers moved to CB (ie out of position) or monreal plays out of position at CB. I prefer the bellerin option to be fair as chambers looks comfortable at CB rather than the odd rush of blood to the head.
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I stand corrected on the Chambers position. However, I have seen him play at CB and he seems more accomplished in that role. I would much rather play Chambers at CB and Bellerin at right back rather than Monreal at CB.

You also compare us to Chelsea and Mancity and even United with respect to not growing talent. Well Chelsea and City do not shop in the same market as us. They can afford to blow 20mill on a player and not blink. They can bring in quality players at will, so really, they do not have to rely on either developing or signing almost made players. You have to be a Messi or a Ronaldo to shine through the Chelsea Academy, it seems. Sagna, a regular starter at ours is a bit part player at City. These teams can throw money at it recklessly....We are not quite at that level, and quite frankly I love it when we bring in these almost made players and take them to the next level, the issue we always had was keeping hold of them....

I am not complaining about us not using the youth, we have whinged for so long about the need for experience, but the issue with some of the experience we brought in, is that they are not top top quality.
 
[video=youtube;znobkQ43BeE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znobkQ43BeE[/video]

Although this video is just taking the piss, it's all kind off true though, which is what many of us have been saying, that Wenger has turned us into a joke, and it is really comical when you think of the shambles he has managed to create over the past few years.

He will be a legend, but the fact is he has hurt his reputation and legacy with what's happened over the past few years, everyone will always mention his accomplishments with a big BUT, and then mention the second half of his reign, which really wasn't something very good. He should have just retired last year on a high, instead he sticked on, sticked to his stubborn old failed ways, and has continued to soil his legacy and continued to add more ammo and talking points to his negatives.
 
Say what you want about Wenger but the fact that he managed to sell Vermaelen in his conditions demands respect. Poor lad is out for 6 months now.
 
That video is a crock of **** in my opinion. Very selective it basically ignores everything that has happened since 97/98 and jumps straight to a few poor results and to players like Nasri and RVP. ****ing wow, tell us something we don't know ! Ignoring the FA cup win last season, the most current thing that video could have added tells me it is made by a ****tard <ok>
 
PISKIE said:
That video is a crock of **** in my opinion. Very selective it basically ignores everything that has happened since 97/98 and jumps straight to a few poor results and to players like Nasri and RVP. ****ing wow, tell us something we don't know ! Ignoring the FA cup win last season, the most current thing that video could have added tells me it is made by a ****tard <ok>
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Yup that video is pretty ****
 
Old_Faithfull said:
No way José. We need someone with a proven, tried & tested record in management. The head MUST rule the heart when it comes to selecting our new manager.

I'm leaning more & more towards Martinez :)
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I wouldn't see Henry replacing Wenger, that would be a gamble too far that I think even the more negative fans would say would be too risky. But he wants to come to Arsenal in a coaching role, which would be a perfect step on the ladder for him. Henry is the new Mr Arsenal and I think one day he could make a very passionate and dedicated manager.
 
PISKIE said:
I wouldn't see Henry replacing Wenger, that would be a gamble too far that I think even the more negative fans would say would be too risky. But he wants to come to Arsenal in a coaching role, which would be a perfect step on the ladder for him. Henry is the new Mr Arsenal and I think one day he could make a very passionate and dedicated manager.
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You can be the one to tell DB10 not to bother applying then :p
 
As much as I love Henry. Bergkamp is my first choice ex Player to replace Wenger if that opportunity presented itself. Bergkamp is also the more realistic option in terms of coaching badges. Henry as assistant is simply a dream. Saying that I think Bould and Bergkamp would produce promising results. Boulds hands are currently tied imo under Wenger but with more freedom to implement a defensive strategy under a less Draconian personality could yield good results.
 
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