The Wenger Criticism Thread

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cini65 said:
I haven't dismissed them anywhere as 'nothing special'. But his achievements were a long, long time ago now.

Manager of the decade just for winning 2 league titles and 2 FA cups?? It's not as if we were a rubbish team on December 1999 and AW suddenly made us top draw in that decade.

To suggest anyone other than Fergie is deluded in my opinion.
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Lol you gave me 2 choices. Maureen i dismissed and Fergie I agreed with so thats hardly deluded.

I think you have shown delusion on an incredible scale with some of your comments on this thread but hey don't let that get in the way of a good bit of banter/discussion.
 
But my scenario was if you were guaranteed that manager for 10 years. In which case you can't discount Mourinho. And he has definitely been a better 2000 - 2009 manager than Wenger.

So I'd say in order of managerial brilliance:
Ferguson
Mourinho
AVB
Fat Sam
Wenger
Ancelotti
 
cini65 said:
But my scenario was if you were guaranteed that manager for 10 years. In which case you can't discount Mourinho. And he has definitely been a better 2000 - 2009 manager than Wenger.

So I'd say in order of managerial brilliance:
Ferguson
Mourinho
AVB
Fat Sam
Wenger
Ancelotti
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HAHAHA! brilliant!
 
Smirnoffpriest said:
Why do you actually support the team? I'm struggling to see it - I mean you don't want us to be in a position to sign better players, you don't want us to be in the top club competition in world, don't want us to be at the top part of the league, don't think we should have improved and expanded our stadium (which if we hadn't we'd be in a hugely worse position now).

But in spite not wanting us to do any of the above, you want us to what? Would you be happy for us to be a mid table club? Or do you think without a modern, income generating stadium, the money and prestige brought in by the CL, the players attracted by CL football, the Sponsors attracted by being a top club in the PL and in the CL. Do you think without all this we'd be in a stronger position to compete for the PL and CL?
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This <ok>

All I hear from Cini65 is moaning, without any idea about what exactly he would do differently (we've been down this road before and he said this forum wasn't for talking about football, just for moaning about Wenger). Yet all the things the club are doing to set us up to compete, he dismisses as being pointless. The idea that without all of those things we'd be no worse off is unbelievably naive and it makes you relived that the club don't listen to nutters like this when they moan about everything that's wrong with Arsenal.
 
PISKIE said:
he said this forum wasn't for talking about football, just for moaning about Wenger
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Please show a quote where I've said that word for word.

PISKIE said:
Yet all the things the club are doing to set us up to compete, he dismisses as being pointless.
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I've said that they're pointless if we don't compete. Which we aren't doing now.

PISKIE said:
The idea that without all of those things we'd be no worse off is unbelievably naive
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Again, where have I stated that explicitly? I've said that what's the point in getting all the money if we don't challenge or compete with it. It's circular. We get money to make more money to make more money. But we're only ever 4th. We get more and more money to achieve the same result. Red queen hypothesis.

PISKIE said:
and it makes you relived that the club don't listen to nutters like this when they moan about everything that's wrong with Arsenal.
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Don't worry PISKIE, I'm sure they listen to your views instead.
 
cini65 said:
Please show a quote where I've said that word for word.


I've said that they're pointless if we don't compete. Which we aren't doing now.


Again, where have I stated that explicitly? I've said that what's the point in getting all the money if we don't challenge or compete with it. It's circular. We get money to make more money to make more money. But we're only ever 4th. We get more and more money to achieve the same result. Red queen hypothesis.


Don't worry PISKIE, I'm sure they listen to your views instead.
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To Compete:

to strive consciously or unconsciously for an objective (as position, profit, or a prize) : be in a state of rivalry

I think your wrong again Cini :)
 
cini65 said:
But we finished 4th from 2006 - 2013 on limited funds without buying these £30m+ players. Do we still need to be spending these obscene amounts to still only finish 4th? Should we be expecting more than 4th with the money we're spending? Look at this year for example. Only Chelsea have been anything other than inconsistent. £30m+ players should be helping us win the league, not help us struggle to 4th. Again.
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So you (on purposely?) miss the point I've yet again made - I said without building the new stadium. And in the last 10 years the playing field has altered significantly, or hadn't you realised? (I've even pointed out how).

But I can tell that me, Piskie and Begkampspilot are on a losing battle trying to talk sense to you. I'm just glad your not in charge otherwise we'd have Fat Sam in charge and wouldn't sign any good players, wouldn't have moved into a new stadium, wouldn't generate any money to compete or enter any competition we weren't going to win. But you'd be the one person still expecting all the above to make us more likely to compete...
 
What are you suggesting we are competing for exactly?

I'd agree we are competing for 4th place. That's what we strive to achieve. It seems clear that that's the only league target that the board sets that Wenger has to meet.

We are not striving to win the league.

Anyway, I'm tired of this. CBA with it. I annoy too many of you so I'll leave you all in peace and this will be my last post on Not606. Enjoy Arsenal all.
 
I've been very consistent with my views on Wenger on this forum. I think he's a good manager, but not infallible. He makes mistakes (show me a manager who doesn't) and tactically he can be caught out with playing the 'Arsenal way' although you can see why he wants his teams to play that way. I'm not opposed to change, it's going to happen soon enough anyway. I'm certainly not one of the supposed Wenger can do no wrong brigade or whatever label people want to put on it, but when we do change manager it will be one of the biggest culture changes at Arsenal since, well, Wenger himself.

Rightly or wrongly, he has had control over so much of the club (It has got us to where we are today) so when we do change we will have to think about whether that new manager takes on the coaching, man management, scouting, financial decision making, transfers, etc or whether we bring in two or three new roles. If we do the former, the person has to be of outstanding calibre in all of those fields, if we chose the later, then we have several appointments (or promotions from within the club) to get absolutely right.

Make no mistake about this: All of those calling for Wenger to go have to be sure that whoever we replace him with can do all of those things that Wenger does well and put right all of the things he gets wrong. Otherwise it will be a counter productive move.
 
I pity you spineless fools .

week after week , season after season ....and you STILL claim he is the best man for the job .

get some gonads .

what ever will you do when he leaves i do not know.

You will be like little lost kiddies that have lost their big cuddly uncle Arsene .

<laugh><laugh>
 
Not PC enough said:
I pity you spineless fools .

week after week , season after season ....and you STILL claim he is the best man for the job .

get some gonads .

what ever will you do when he leaves i do not know.

You will be like little lost kiddies that have lost their big cuddly uncle Arsene .

<laugh><laugh>
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So, if a new manager has you in 9/10th place and still no trophys will you feel much happier?
 
cini65 said:
What are you suggesting we are competing for exactly?

I'd agree we are competing for 4th place. That's what we strive to achieve. It seems clear that that's the only league target that the board sets that Wenger has to meet.

We are not striving to win the league.

Anyway, I'm tired of this. CBA with it. I annoy too many of you so I'll leave you all in peace and this will be my last post on Not606. Enjoy Arsenal all.
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Another one bites the dust. Graveyard's are going to have more activity than this board in the coming weeks. And on that note, this is also my last post on this board.
 
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