Article: Saints v Cardiff match thread | Southampton FC, Football

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Cardiff have kept only 2 away clean sheets and won one away game before our game. Ouch.

So what? Historical references like that are irrelevant really. It's 11 vs 11 each time. On the day they got lucky, then defended well. We didn't execute our superiority on the day. Onwards and upwards.
 
'There's something to be said for veteran instincts. Gazzaniga did nothing wrong but Boruc might have "cheated" on it.

Boruc saves that shot maybe 5% of the time, Gazzaniga saves it 0% of the time. Basically it would have been one of the 2-3 goals a year that Boruc saves and almost no one else can, which is why he's back there despite the questionable decision making and poor distribution. So there's really no way to blame Gazzaniga for that goal.

Gazzaniga's first half was poor, but his second half was fine. His save on Zaha was very good. It seems like crosses and when there is traffic in the box is when he's bad. Really, really bad. The rest of his game is alright.
 
So what? Historical references like that are irrelevant really. It's 11 vs 11 each time. On the day they got lucky, then defended well. We didn't execute our superiority on the day. Onwards and upwards.

True. Fighting for our lives, we have got surprising results in our earlier incarnation. Can never predict results for certain. Any team can lose by one goal...the only surprise was us not scoring (but then we are adjusting to the loss of JRod).
 
To put it in perspective, we were only marginally (1 goal) more ineffective vs Cardiff than Arsenal were against Wigan, and there's a full division between those two clubs. It's hard when a team puts 10 men behind the ball.
 
'There's something to be said for veteran instincts. Gazzaniga did nothing wrong but Boruc might have "cheated" on it.

Boruc saves that shot maybe 5% of the time, Gazzaniga saves it 0% of the time. Basically it would have been one of the 2-3 goals a year that Boruc saves and almost no one else can, which is why he's back there despite the questionable decision making and poor distribution. So there's really no way to blame Gazzaniga for that goal.

Gazzaniga's first half was poor, but his second half was fine. His save on Zaha was very good. It seems like crosses and when there is traffic in the box is when he's bad. Really, really bad. The rest of his game is alright.

Poor first half? He had one shot to deal with that he punched out, and two very difficult inswinging, near post corners that he dealt with. They were very tricky and he was decisive in getting from the back third of his goal to the near post to block them through a crowd of players. He also had one cross he punched clear. I can't recall one moment where his distribution was poor it shaky during the first half, so how do you say he was poor?

We all know that he isn't a top keeper today, but why try and find something had that wasn't there.
 
To put it in perspective, we were only marginally (1 goal) more ineffective vs Cardiff than Arsenal were against Wigan, and there's a full division between those two clubs. It's hard when a team puts 10 men behind the ball.

Now Archers, yo know that you can't apply reason and logic when Saints don't win :)
 
I don't think anyone has hit on the real reason for our defeat today. We approach every game the same way, and it's great that we have such positive intent, but our opponents know exactly what we're going to do. The Newcastle game is a perfect example of an opponent completely failing to deal with our attacking threats. The Cardiff game is a perfect example of an opponent setting up to defend against those threats and doing so successfully. Credit should go to their back line for cutting out most of our crosses at the source (full backs) and being well positioned to deal with the few that did make it into the box. Once you get that right, all you have to do is ensure we can't play it into the box through the middle of the pitch, which is something we often struggle with anyway, and they did that by simply holding a deep line and playing Medel in an anchoring position. I say fair enough, they got it right. They got lucky with their goal, but they earned the clean sheet. Next season we need some extra options for games like this.

Absolutely spot on.

The only thing I would add is that if our two 18 year old full backs had been maybe 25% better with their crossing, then we would have had the perfect way to deal with teams like that. You have to have some one who can drive at them down the middle (Gaston tried a couple of times), or you get round the back with the full backs. Luke in particular was in that position several occasions and failed each time to get it right.

I only hope he wasn't thinking about chocolate bars
 
Best team lost on the day guys. Cruel game, but we needed that more than you. We are still going down without doubt
 
Best team lost on the day guys. Cruel game, but we needed that more than you. We are still going down without doubt

“Never give in. Never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.” ― Winston Churchill

Read this for inspiration: http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/news/features/great-escapes-from-relegation.html

Vin
 
“Never give in. Never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.” ― Winston Churchill

Read this for inspiration: http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/news/features/great-escapes-from-relegation.html

Vin

Well, yeah. Except that Winston Churchill, despite being a great wartime figurehead (cometh the hour, cometh the man) was an absolute disaster as both a politician and a soldier. The man behind the slaughter at Gallipoli and Anzio is not someone you'd rush to take advice from.
 
One of those days. I didn't see any lack of effort but maybe a lack of urgency. It was as if we knew we were going to win and it was a matter of when we were going to score rather than "if".

I also think we missed Rodriguez, no-one else was making any significant runs to try and find space where it counts. On top of that the crosses from both fullbacks weren't great. The amount of space that Shaw was given in particular, I felt he should have done a bit better. In fact he can be a bit frustrating in that there is often a massive amount of space in front of him but he seems to prefer a square ball than one he can attack (of course that could be down to the midfielders not giving that kind of pass).

What else? Ramirez. A fairly good show from him. He wasn't trying to do too much as he sometimes does when he comes on for a cameo. He did fade as he often does but shows that he does have the ability.
 
Well, yeah. Except that Winston Churchill, despite being a great wartime figurehead (cometh the hour, cometh the man) was an absolute disaster as both a politician and a soldier. The man behind the slaughter at Gallipoli and Anzio is not someone you'd rush to take advice from.

Even if I were to take your revisionist, cartoonish take on Churchill at face value, do you mean people should give up? That's what you're suggesting when you say we shouldn't take his advice.

The most stupid, venal and evil person in the world could tell you it's raining outside. Doesn't mean that you shouldn't take your umbrella. It's a pointless argument, such a common logical fallacy that it has its own name in the lexicon of logic - ad hominem.

Vin
 
Even if I were to take your revisionist, cartoonish take on Churchill at face value, do you mean people should give up? That's what you're suggesting when you say we shouldn't take his advice.

The most stupid, venal and evil person in the world could tell you it's raining outside. Doesn't mean that you shouldn't take your umbrella. It's a pointless argument, such a common logical fallacy that it has its own name in the lexicon of logic - ad hominem.

Vin

If he did, I'd check. Twice.
 
Over 90 minutes we played poorly.

Different view then CbK. I'd say over 90 minutes we weren't clinical or creative enough. We certainly weren't 'poor' in my opinion. We've been poor this year, but not yesterday. Last 30 minutes we were too pedestrian, but no worse than that.
 
We are rarely poor...shame that football involves putting the ball in the net at one end and keeping it out at the other. You could take highlights from games where we lost and games where we won and could scarcely tell the difference.
 
They were very tricky and he was decisive in getting from the back third of his goal to the near post to block them through a crowd of players.

He made them look tricky, they really weren't. All the corners were to the near post. Why would Gazzaniga be positioned at the far post?

They took three in a row near half time. The first one he could have easily collected had he not reacted late (and thus eliminated the other two from ever being taken). It might even have been a goal kick had he done nothing. He just stood rooted to the spot and then at the last minute kind of flopped over and knocked it out. The second one he came out late on and I don't think he ever touched it. The third one he did a good job on and punched out.

The shot he punched was an easy save he should have collected.
 
He made them look tricky, they really weren't. All the corners were to the near post. Why would Gazzaniga be positioned at the far post?

They took three in a row near half time. The first one he could have easily collected had he not reacted late (and thus eliminated the other two from ever being taken). It might even have been a goal kick had he done nothing. He just stood rooted to the spot and then at the last minute kind of flopped over and knocked it out. The second one he came out late on and I don't think he ever touched it. The third one he did a good job on and punched out.

The shot he punched was an easy save he should have collected.

Sitting in the Chapel meant that I really didn't have a great view of those three successive corners, so I cannot comment too much on whether Gazza was at fault at all or not (but I can say that the punches did make me and those around me very nervous!).

But at the same time, sitting in the Chapel gave me an excellent view of Mutch's shot from behind Gazza - and without a doubt I was 100% happy with Gazza punching that one away. The way that ball was travelling, it was all about just ensuring it didn't go in the back of the net nor spilt out for a tap in. And neither happened.