Gaston.

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I don't particularly think he's right for us, but we're not going to get a deeper squad by selling players.
 
He's on about 25-30k, i'd definitely keep him, showed massive signs of improvement recently and could be really helpful against tight defence where we're struggling to break through. How much would a replacement cost ? And how long would they take to settle in ?
 
fatletiss said:
When we have a run of bad games, will you be one of the people bemoaning that we don't have a plan B?

Also, think about what you are saying...... do we pick the team by the wage bill? No, so again, the wages/cost are irrelevant (to a degree - and that degree is that they are within our budget). If the budget was full and MP needed another player, he may decide to move Gaston on and bring that player in if it was a straight budgetary choice.

You'll be telling me Clyne must play next because he is paid more than Chambers.
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I've highlighted these statements because they are ridiculous. The first, when have I ever alluded to this lack of a "plan B"? The answer; never. Because I am able to see that we are a quality team with a quality manager, who therefore have much more to our game than just a "plan A". So please don't target my argument with a cheap-shot like this. The second statement, wow, where to even start? (btw I'll ignore the patronising tone, and actually give it an answer). Both Clyne and Chambers are excellent young players with fantastic attitudes and will both perform out of their skins no matter who the opposition are, etc, and therefore easily justify their wages. I'm sure, if there is a difference in their salaries, this is due to the fact that Clyne was a Bosman-signing while Chambers was an academy player. So obviously Clyne will be getting more. But the fact is, that when they come to sign future contracts, they will be offered amounts equating to what they offer the club. Which I'd imagine will be roughly similar amounts. And this is what they fully deserve. But with Gaston, we can't do this. We can't just cut his wages from 50-60k to 10k. So we are stuck with a guy who isn't good enough for the first team, but who is eating up a whopping salary!! Great business sense!!

In addition, I just don't know how you can say the wages/cost are irrelevant!! If we cash in on him, then suddenly we have an extra 12 million plus (plus wages) to play with. That is very much relevant.

I can't quite believe the inconsistency of some people. On one thread, some suggest that the season hasn't panned out as well as it should, however, when it comes to people suggesting ways to improve the squad, they get shot down. Brilliant.
 
Why are we even talking about selling him? He's just started to click and could get a whole lot better. Aside from lallana how many other creative players do we have?
 
Black said:
Woah, hold the phone!! In his own words Ramirez claims to be on 2 million Euros per year, net salary!! So while that is around 32/33k, the gross salary is much more likely to be up around 50k.

Please, if I am wrong, then correct me.

Source: http://www.insidefutbol.com/2012/08...get-gaston-ramirez-set-for-southampton/67264/
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I'll say it again. I don't judge a player by his salary.

I notice you chose to ignore my suggestion that you think we should pick the team by wages paid :) Chambers out, Clyne in. Gallagher out Guly in. JWP out Vic/Morgan/Gaston in.
 
Black said:
Yes. But what happened with all of these players? We got rid of them. Sorry, but you can't ignore the fact that he is getting paid 50-60k every week to sit on the bench. You just can't. We're Southampton, not Chelsea.

Simply put, you have to ask yourself, "would Ramirez be in my starting eleven next week against Man City?" - The answer for me is "no". And the answer for Pochettino will also be "no".

Saying all this though, I'm still willing to give him one final chance; We have seven games remaining, with relatively little to play for. Ergo, throw Gaston in at the deep end and give him 2-3 full 90 minutes to see what he can do. And tell him directly; "Final chance, no excuses!" If he is able to impress - not just with pretty flicks etc - but with actual genuine work rate and commitment etc, then happy days. but anything less than this, then its time to get rid. And yes, we could definitely find a decent replacement for the recouped fee/wages.
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You can't just cancel his contract. On the wages he is claimed to be on, we would probably have to subsidise his move.
 
fatletiss said:
I'll say it again. I don't judge a player by his salary.

I notice you chose to ignore my suggestion that you think we should pick the team by wages paid :) Chambers out, Clyne in. Gallagher out Guly in. JWP out Vic/Morgan/Gaston in.
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Then you obviously missed one of my posts.
 
Pretty sure that quote was subsequently confirmed asa bad translation but can't find the article.

As a fan, the conditions of employment are completely irrelevant to me. I'm just concerned by his contribution and that is improving every time he plays
 
I disagree that Gaston doesn't put a shift in and work hard, but he just isn't good at the defensive side of the game as it is not his natural game. He probably has been that "luxury" player for the majority of his footballing life so he isn't going to be great at defending, but this isn't down to lack of effort.

Because of this I think he isn't suited to our style of defend from the front and high press, as he is just a weak link in the system due to defensive frailties. However I also think that he is definitely one of the most talented players in the squad, and there isn't an abundance of players with the same creative talents who also put the effort in he does defensively.

I say keep him if he is happy being an impact sub, or as FLT said earlier, get him back for the full pre-season under MP and see if his defensive side can be improved, and if it can than he would be a starter for me.
 
Saintmagic said:
I disagree that Gaston doesn't put a shift in and work hard, but he just isn't good at the defensive side of the game as it is not his natural game. He probably has been that "luxury" player for the majority of his footballing life so he isn't going to be great at defending, but this isn't down to lack of effort.

Because of this I think he isn't suited to our style of defend from the front and high press, as he is just a weak link in the system due to defensive frailties. However I also think that he is definitely one of the most talented players in the squad, and there isn't an abundance of players with the same creative talents who also put the effort in he does defensively.

I say keep him if he is happy being an impact sub, or as FLT said earlier, get him back for the full pre-season under MP and see if his defensive side can be improved, and if it can than he would be a starter for me.
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Spot on, So often people confuse poor defensive ability with a lack of effort. If as a defender you're a split second too slow in anticipating a run or a pass then you can end up looking stupid and caught out and you scramble to get back. Gaston concedes lots of fouls because of his poor tackling and an anxious need to get the ball back. If he made no fouls it would be a lack of effort.
Sadly because of the world cup he won't have a full pre-season, but if he can stay injury free for the rest of the campaign and keep progressing on that side of his game then i'm sure his contributions will improve
 
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