Ok, I'll stay calm. Question: do you think he can be good enough? If yes why and if no, why?
Summer 2013 Transfer Rumour Thread
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Ok, I'll stay calm. Question: do you think he can be good enough? If yes why and if no, why?
That's what is frustrating. They are both quality footballers. One gets slated the other not. If I had to say which one had a better chance of proving it in the prem, Ramirez would edge it for me. They both showed flashes of brilliance and both failed to deliver on occasions.
To think of selling either now is crazy, with the exception of Joe's point of a really big financial return.
Joe has already touched on this. The difference with Ramirez is the money you could potentially get for him. You could make a big defensive signing with the money or look for a better replacement.
I agree that he's not so much a 'key' player right now, but it was his small minded 'we score more without him therefore he's ****' approach that annoys me. Ramirez showed flashes of class throughout the season, admittedly inconsistently but I think given another season and he will start to earn his place in the XI. Of course I could be wrong, but he's not completely messed up and he should be given a fair chance.
Which suggests you think he won't come good? I believe with the right additions to make us better defensively, Ramirez will shine. Thierry Henry, Robert Pires and all were poor in their first seasons. I'm saying I think it would be a waste to move on such a talented player now, because in two or three years time we could be crying out for a skilful technical player to unlock defences. He had several good games and scored five goals in a season which some people think he was crap! It doesn't make sense to me.
True, Ramirez would fetch more. It's because he's better, and younger.
In the same way, you shouldn't tolerate being poor just because there is a lower sale value. I don't Ramirez was that bad.
He's also a good investment for the future, in my eyes, but his season could be described as below par at times.
I've said before that he'll be gone by the end of next season. For him, it's make or break; if he shows his true potential then he'll be off to a top club, if he doesn't then he'll be surplus to requirements and will be cashed in.
Think you've got to ask why these other clubs are rumored to be thinking of paying enough for us to turn a profit after a "poor" season.
It's probably because they understand that a class talent at 21 will not be consistent every game and will take time to hone his craft.
****. Why couldn't I come up with a calm, reasoned and very sensible post like that?
What he said.
Probably right. I said after one or two games that he wouldn't be here long. One thought though: what if the unthinkable happens and we are really pushing top 6 or even 4? I'm not saying we will, but what if?
The financial return is kind of a pretty massive factor, as is the fact that Lallana has been at the club for 13 years and Ramirez for one. I agree that Lallana was no better than Ramirez last season, and I agree than Ramirez probably has more potential, but Lallana wouldn't command anything near £20m and he's been here so long that he's part of the identity of this team and selling him couldn't possibly be worthwhile in my mind. He'd also happily spend his entire career at Saints, and I'd be very surprised if Ramirez would.
If I was Cortese and had received a £20m offer from Fiorentina for Ramirez, had identified a great replacement and felt assured I could get him, and was in agreement with the manager that this new guy would be more than adequate, then I'd probably accept the offer and leave it up to Ramirez to decide whether he'd rather be in Southampton or Florence. If he chooses Southampton, cool, we've got us a loyal and dedicated player; if he chooses Florence, fair enough, take the money and sign this new guy.
Obviously there are a lot of ifs in there, and unless they're all met then I'd do all I could to hang onto Ramirez. Change for the sake of change isn't good.
I think in his prime, Ramirez would fit extremely well into a top 6 club. If one day we do want to be one, I think he is the kind of player we need to be holding on to. He's young, he's obviously talented, he just needs to turn that into consistency then I believe we do truly have a world class player on our books.
Ramirez is a quality player. Anyone watching him play can see that. He will be even better next season.
If we want to be a top side then we need top players - in depth.
There is nothing to be gained by slating him. We don't need to sell to buy, so let's chill out and watch Poch and The Don assemble a quality side this summer.
If we want to be a top side then we need top players - in depth.
There is nothing to be gained by slating him. We don't need to sell to buy, so let's chill out and watch Poch and The Don assemble a quality side this summer.
Getting away from the Ramirez argument (i think he is class on his day btw) there is a rumour on twitter that Saints have a presser Thursday, has anyone else heard this?
I checked it out, it's not true. Certainly not known to people who should know... make your own conclusions from that.
I never said he was ****. No need to lie.
Who are you quoting with "poor" season? I said he had an average season, lol. Both of you need to learn to read in future. The difference with a luxury player at CAM is he needs quality players with plenty of pace to thread through balls to. Top teams are the only teams that have that. We also play with wingers that like to cut or drift inside crowding the middle of the pitch, Lambert drops deep and created more chances in open play than anyone in the league other than Suarez I believe so we can't replace him to get more out of Ramirez. If we want to see if Ramirez can come good we need to sign someone like Aubameyang and play him at right or left wing in our formation with Rodriguez on the other side.
Thursday! But I want it now!!!! If they had something to announce wouldn't they just get on with it? Oh, hold on, this is Saints, carry on.
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