View from the opposition

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Paulpowersleftfoot said:
I don't believe you can finish 2nd and be in the FA cup final without any team spirit
Have you been reading the Daily Mail?
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Not at all. It's a ghastly rag!. However, your performance against us lacked any kind of spark, when the chips were down. I have sensed for some time that there was something lacking at City. You can throw around all the money you like - buy whoever you like. But, getting them to perform as a team requires something else.

Yes, you will finish second, but second by a long, long way. Is that really good enough considering the money that your owners have spent?
 
City have been inconsistent in patches throughout the season ie losing to Saints and scrambling a very poor 1-0 win over Wigan in the 83rd minute. City won something like one match in sixteen against us up until a couple of years ago so with Spurs playing well and after a good rest and City playing inconsistently the win did not surprise me. All the signs were there for a home win. Good thread Paul.
 
Paulpowersleftfoot said:
I don't believe it's the players particularly
Very poor manmanagent and consistently being outcoached like yesterday has an awful lot to do with it
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Maybe so. However, I still would have expected more from such an array of talented players.

If, as you seem to suggest, Mancini and his team are the root of the problem, then I suspect that your owners will be parting company with him in the very near future.
 
I'm not going to rub your nose in it on this most glorious of nights, PPLF, but you know City lack Utd's focus, drive, determination, team spirit, will to win etc. You deservedly won the title last season, but it was gifted to you. We conceded an 8 point lead in the last 6 games; that charity was never going to be repeated this time. The PL is not a game of "Top Trumps"; I'm sick of fans of other clubs (Chelsea especially) who say how good their team/squad is on paper. Nothing is won on paper. No team, no player performs at their best all the time. The best in any sport produce it when it matters, under the greatest pressure. City have shrunk from the challenge on half a dozen occasions, Chelsea double that. But lets ignore that and blame the refs instead. City have a squad whose motivation to rise to the challenge again is questionable. Most are experienced players on big contracts; it's easy just to take the money. People quickly forget how Tevez didn't even want to be at the club (or in the country) not so long ago. Utd have a lot of hungry, improving young players- de Gea, Rafael, Jones, Smalling, Buttner, Cleverley, Welbeck, Hernandez, Kagawa.....
No power shift.
 
Paulpowersleftfoot said:
Mancini is correct in his summing up of there not being much between City and Utd
Ferguson would've walked the league by as much if not more than the current points total
Don't ever remember seeing Utd out scrapped at Everton or Sunderland like we are every year
We had a must win game at Southampton where we meekly surrendered the title,it was pitiful
The general consensus in the stands is keep Mancini,he's won 3 trophies in 3 years after decades of nothing

However,given a similar squad and transfer kitty to work with even Big Sam would've done equally as well and not alienated so many players with his pissy attitude
Still expect to see him at the helm next season and will hypocritically sing his name every week
It's what we do isn't it,as fans?
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Are you including the Charity shield in the 3 or a second FA Cup before it's won?

Mancini's undoubtedly done poorly this year but the grass isn't always greener and all that, the new man would make mistakes too and so I think it's worth keeping Mancini to see whether he's learnt from them next year. As much as he's had a lot to spend at City, there wasn't enough control on his spending at the start and then to crack down on transfers so drastically after winning the title was hard for Mancini to adjust to. He's still a young manager and can learn a lot and improve so long as he's not too stubborn. I think your board need to force him into making some big decisions as to which senior players stay and which go, you need younger and cheaper players as backup to lessen the cost of a bloated squad, giving Balotelli's squad place to Guidetti was a good start but he needs to trust those younger players he's bringing in and get rid of the likes of Kolarov, Richards, Toure/Lescott, Nasri and Dzeko then he will find he can sign a couple of new players that can help make a real difference and get in another few talented youngsters too.
 
Paulpowersleftfoot said:
Ferguson is the difference
If Mancini and ferguson swapped squads it would've been over weeks ago
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Agreed once more. The surprise, to me, may be less City's indifferent performances than Man U's focus. It's hard to keep twenty something gazillionaires focused on winning, it will keep getting harder, and it may be more surprising that Ferguson still can keep a team on the straight and narrow than that Mancini can't.

I've never been a Mancini fan. His man-management is putrid. Little as anyone may like it, almost everyone but Ferguson (including Mourinho) need to be very good at staying on the right side of their players and coaxing them in the right direction. Mancini tells them to **** off anytime he feels like it, and I'm surprised Man City haven't done the same to him.
 
We've been here many times before, but the old "my way or the highway" style of management just will not wash with today's multi-millionaire players - they are far too likely to just tell the manager to **** off.

Despite his carefully cultivated reputation for being a fearsome ogre to any player who dares to disobey him, there is obviously far more to Ferguson's man management repertoire than that. His players, for the most part, clearly like and trust him to look out for them. They WANT to play for him. AVB seems to have some of that about him in that our squad seems to have that team spirit that hasn't always been there.

I don't feel this with City. I don't believe that many of his players could give a flying toss about Mancini. He does nothing to inspire loyalty, and gives the impression that he would metaphorically stick the knife between your ribs without a second thought. Players are people too ( well, there are certain exceptions! ) if you, as the leader, don't inspire confidence and trust in those in your charge, you can hardly expect them to bust a gut for you, in return.
 
The subs definitely changed the game. For 55/60 minutes City were the better team, not by a long distance but City definitely deserved to be ahead. Then we started to pick up a bit and the subs that came on completely turned it around. We then started to become pretty dominant in possession, Huddlestone was pinging the balls out wide with pin-point precision and Holtby added really neat passes and flick-ons to speed up our play. The last half hour we were a different team, as if we were possessed and from then on we all know the "3 goals in 7 minutes" story. Perhaps a harsh score line on City but we've had a bit of a rough ride with you guys of late (5-1 at home last season, Balotelli's stamp on Parker then scoring a late pen last season, last minute winner for Dzeko this season) so to take home 3 points with a very nice score line against a world class side certainly made Sunday a brilliant day in the sunshine for me especially as the result itself has kept up the pressure on our rivals.
 
I certainly DO NOT consider City as a world class side when we take into account their woeful performances in the CL. Apart from the 1-5 there's been little to separate the teams in matches as you said last minute penalty etc. City world class? Far from it.
 
They have world class players, but don't play as a world class team. There's too many names who are signed for their individual quality and because they are a "star", but how that individual links up with the other players in the squad is overlooked. Just because someone is individually brilliant, it doesn't mean that things will click. The fact that city have the type of stubborn manager they do, doesn't help matters either.

There are players in united's team who I personally wouldn't say have the ability of some of city's. But they slot in much better at United, by fulfilling the "team player" need withing a squad, as well as being taught by one of the best people in the world.

Team spirit and togetherness counts for so much in football.
 
Roo said:
They have world class players, but don't play as a world class team. There's too many names who are signed for their individual quality and because they are a "star", but how that individual links up with the other players in the squad is overlooked. Just because someone is individually brilliant, it doesn't mean that things will click. The fact that city have the type of stubborn manager they do, doesn't help matters either.

There are players in united's team who I personally wouldn't say have the ability of some of city's. But they slot in much better at United, by fulfilling the "team player" need withing a squad, as well as being taught by one of the best people in the world.

Team spirit and togetherness counts for so much in football.
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But Milner and Barry still get games, and i don't consider them good enough to even play for England
 
The Mighty Thor said:
I certainly DO NOT consider City as a world class side when we take into account their woeful performances in the CL. Apart from the 1-5 there's been little to separate the teams in matches as you said last minute penalty etc. City world class? Far from it.
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Champions League performances haven't been great but I'd still call them a world class side. They won the best league in the world last season and are second in it this season. That's no ordinary side, even if recent matches between the two of us bar the 5-1 defeat have been close.
 
Spurs or Sex? said:
Champions League performances haven't been great but I'd still call them a world class side. They won the best league in the world last season and are second in it this season. That's no ordinary side, even if recent matches between the two of us bar the 5-1 defeat have been close.
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I'm not sure the Premiership has the best teams in the world. Apart from the fact that the current CL tells you that, in my opinion either Real or Barca would take City apart. I reckon they'd struggle against Atletico too!..
 
NowsufferinginSpain said:
I'm not sure the Premiership has the best teams in the world. Apart from the fact that the current CL tells you that, in my opinion either Real or Barca would take City apart. I reckon they'd struggle against Atletico too!..
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I didn't say England have the best teams in the world, just that the likes of City (and Utd) are world class teams.
In regards to current CL, I think this is first time where an English side wasn't in the last 8 for something like 15 years, so to me that signals English sides have always been up there with the best hence why I always consider the top 2/3 teams over here can be classed as world class... Of course I appreciate opinions will be divided on the matter but for me personally, City is a world class team, even if sometimes they fail to look like one.

totsfan said:
the only world class players they have imo,are,Ya Ya Toure and David Silva,maybe Augero.
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I'd say Yaya, Silva, Aguero, Kompany and Zabaleta are world class. Tevez and Hart are also of a very good standard in my opinion. Nastasic looks like he could become really good too, didn't realise he was only 20 until a week or so ago!
 
Zabaleta doesn't have the pace to be considered a world class right back
Kompany of last season looked the real deal but he's got a mistake in him,seen far more often this year than last where I believe Lescott & Kompany read each others games really well and covered up each others errors
Nastasic doesn't have the experience to anticipate defensive mistakes so they have been more exposed when he's been alongside Kompany
 
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