Article: Full Fat Formula 1. | Formula 1

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SgtBhaji

SgtBhaji

Well-Known Member
Mar 31, 2011
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Little Rock, AR.
My wife put an interesting question to me this evening while I was reminiscing about F1 cars of the late 80s/early 90s. The question was this: “Would you want to take anything from the cars of the current era and apply it to the cars of the late 80s/early 90s?” Other than safety features, I couldn’t think of one single thing that I’d want to apply to them.

Some of the thing she put to me were: DRS, KERS. tyres, aero, anti stall, ride height, reliability to name a few… and all came up as a big fat NO for me.

It set me thinking about how F1 used to feel to me, and this also made me realize that I really don’t feel the same about the sport as I once did.

Watching a car being rolled to its grid spot once felt very different to me. It wasn’t just a car that was being pushed out there. It was a living, breathing, temperamental animal that had to be fought, wrangled and tamed in to submission by the pilot. Something that could bite back and very frequently did.

Not so long ago, F1 cars balanced on a very fine edge between performance and disaster. They would either not be able to take the punishment of a full Grand Prix and erupt in a display of exhaustion or simply buck their drivers off the track in defiance. F1 cars of the modern era are engineered for supreme reliability, limited in overall performance, controlled from red facing their drivers with anti-stall and all but homogenized clones of one another.

Although I’m extremely grateful for the safety developments in the sport… I miss the character of both car and driver. This may be the romantic in me, but I think that F1 has not only lost the character in its pilots, but also in the vehicles themselves.

Give me Full Fat F1!
 
SgtBhaji: This thread is one I will watch with interest!
No further comment for now, other than you obviously have a very understanding wife, willing to indulge your passion! :)
 
cosicave said:
SgtBhaji: This thread is one I will watch with interest!
No further comment for now, other than you obviously have a very understanding wife, willing to indulge your passion! :)
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Heheheheh. Well unlike me, my wife is a native of these Americanshire lands and grew up watching NASCAR. Although she doesn't follow it so much these days (cos it's gone a bit pants) she was a big Dale Earnhardt and Jeff Gordan fan. She became quite a big supporter of F1 when we were living in Enlgand... So she can put up with me most of the time. :)

I must add that you'll be disappointed to know that she's a Schuey supporter. :p
 
SgtBhaji said:
My wife put an interesting question to me this evening while I was reminiscing about F1 cars of the late 80s/early 90s. The question was this: “Would you want to take anything from the cars of the current era and apply it to the cars of the late 80s/early 90s?” Other than safety features, I couldn’t think of one single thing that I’d want to apply to them.

Some of the thing she put to me were: DRS, KERS. tyres, aero, anti stall, ride height, reliability to name a few… and all came up as a big fat NO for me.

It set me thinking about how F1 used to feel to me, and this also made me realize that I really don’t feel the same about the sport as I once did.

Watching a car being rolled to its grid spot once felt very different to me. It wasn’t just a car that was being pushed out there. It was a living, breathing, temperamental animal that had to be fought, wrangled and tamed in to submission by the pilot. Something that could bite back and very frequently did.

Not so long ago, F1 cars balanced on a very fine edge between performance and disaster. They would either not be able to take the punishment of a full Grand Prix and erupt in a display of exhaustion or simply buck their drivers off the track in defiance. F1 cars of the modern era are engineered for supreme reliability, limited in overall performance, controlled from red facing their drivers with anti-stall and all but homogenized clones of one another.

Although I’m extremely grateful for the safety developments in the sport… I miss the character of both car and driver. This may be the romantic in me, but I think that F1 has not only lost the character in its pilots, but also in the vehicles themselves.

Give me Full Fat F1!
Click to expand...

I agree wholeheartedly about F1 losing it's soul. When i started watching it as a child in the mid 90's, you still had the limited driver aids, the big V10 engines, the hopeless pay drivers, everything that gave the sport a bit of character.
 
SgtBhaji said:
…I must add that you'll be disappointed to know that she's a Schuey supporter. :p
Click to expand...
Oh how unfortunate. You have my commiserations for her partial (rather than impartial) knowledge!
No further comment for now. Hang on a sec'; didn't I just say that?…
:)
 
Wow, well my first reaction was: 'your wife lets you reminisce about F1?!!! That's love!' ;)

My second thought was: how much of this is age, I wonder? I mean, I'm so old I remember when F1 cars had skirts and fans! And Bernie was a relatively minor player. But seriously, as a child in the late 70s/early 80s, I had no idea of the cynical side, the power plays and the machinations. And I forgot stuff too: I knew at the time Jean-Marie Balestre was a c... but I had completely forgotten until 'Senna' came to the cinemas last year. I mean, that man made Max Mosley look like an angel!
 
MaxWhiplash said:
Wow, well my first reaction was: 'your wife lets you reminisce about F1?!!! That's love!' ;)

My second thought was: how much of this is age, I wonder? I mean, I'm so old I remember when F1 cars had skirts and fans! And Bernie was a relatively minor player. But seriously, as a child in the late 70s/early 80s, I had no idea of the cynical side, the power plays and the machinations. And I forgot stuff too: I knew at the time Jean-Marie Balestre was a c... but I had completely forgotten until 'Senna' came to the cinemas last year. I mean, that man made Max Mosley look like an angel!
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Oh, I'm quite aware that it may be(is) age kicking in. :)
 
Well Bahji, I started going to F1 races in 71 actually started following during mid 60s, stood next the original Lotus 49 and Graham Hill in the paddock at Brands I think, that was the moment I was hooked, what a beautiful creation that car was and its still my favorite car, Lotus green, beautifully welded chrome suspension links, with Coventry Climax engine, basically two Hillman Imp engines blended together, originally taken from a lightweight portable fire pump I believe, later to be fitted with the glorious Cosworth V8.

That was and still is the essence of F1 for me, my wife and I went to the Goodwood Revival this year and guess what, there was a Lotus 49 with same engine etc, magic moment as they say, got the picture on my mobile as background.

The one impossible thing I would like to be able to see is all the WDCs over the years driving the same car in the same race, say Monaco, driving any JPS Lotus.

There are three driver's who I believe would come 1,2,3, but I wont mention their names for fear of ruining this thread.
 
If I'm honest I think it's gone too safety conscious, ok we don't wanna see people dying year on year, but I wanna see balls out racing in conditions like canada with no safety car bought out to help people with fast cars but little talent, if you can't handle it, pull into the pits and cry.


Safety cars for no reason
 

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Yeah, I think when they race in awful conditions all the heroism and romance of the sport at its best comes back. There's no doubt in my mind that it's pretty sanitised nowadays; and the corporate stuff has really taken over too. If you're young though, you won't know any differently; you can look at old races and it must look exotic and romantic, as the past tends to, but I think your young experience becomes the benchmark against which you measure all that follows; generally speaking, of course ;)
 
There was a certain romance to the barbaric cars, hustling along with brute force having to be tamed and controlled! For me the turning point was the period when we lost the V10's and the slicks - thats when it all went pear shaped.

I still enjoy (immensley) but it feels more contrived and manipulated, nut I suppose you become used to it!
 
Miggins said:
If I'm honest I think it's gone too safety conscious, ok we don't wanna see people dying year on year, but I wanna see balls out racing in conditions like canada with no safety car bought out to help people with fast cars but little talent, if you can't handle it, pull into the pits and cry.


Safety cars for no reason
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The safety features currently utilised in F1 are almost its undoing, we have all seen several incidents whereby a driver will deliberately create situation to take another driver out, abusing the very rules and devices that were created to stop participants getting killed.

And it provides drivers with creative minds occasion to try maneuvers which could be considered adventurous in the extreme, negating the very purpose of the safety changes. !!!!!

 
I think the run offs create more pf a problem these days, being able to cut a chicane, run wide on a corner and out break themselves and still be able to rejoin without losing track position or much time.
 
Smithers said:
I think the run offs create more pf a problem these days, being able to cut a chicane, run wide on a corner and out break themselves and still be able to rejoin without losing track position or much time.
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True, the consequences of making what could be called a deliberate mistake, should at least cause a visit to the pits, but such incidents sometimes pass without barely a mention, perhaps some spikes on the kerbs would encourage more attention to detail.
 
Noughties kid looking back from a childhood of watching Murray Walker videos about old F1 - apologies in advance.

The problem is the golden age of racing - and you can say this of pretty much any sport which is at least partially reliant on technology - came when people had boundaries to push, back when data could only be mapped out to a small extent. Back when people were pushing the limits of tech, when we had fan cars and turbos. (Incidentally, return of turbos = A Good Thing. You can cry foul about the V4 engines but the turbos? Can't see any fault with that.)

Nowadays, however... F1 is probably the most noticeable culprit, but you could accuse many other sports (I'd nominate rowing as an example) that the technology has got too good. Engineers can plan well in advance the airflow under and over a car, the amount of grip provided by the tyres - tyres designed to be perfect in every way. The FIA had to push Pirelli to make deliberately defective tyres just to make the racing more exciting.

That is why the "golden age" will never return. You can return the aerodynamics to 70s levels - the teams will just use the data and make the suspension more planted. You can make a calendar consisting of the most exciting race tracks of all time (and the obligatory race in Bahrain to please Bernie) - the teams will check every single bump and tune the suspension accordingly. The power race of computer chips is what has brought down F1.
 
Smithers said:
I think the run offs create more pf a problem these days, being able to cut a chicane, run wide on a corner and out break themselves and still be able to rejoin without losing track position or much time.
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I agree on this even though I accept the need for them. A mistake by a driver isn't punished in the same way anymore. These days you can flub up and there is little consequence, and certain tracks even promote using outside run off to the advantage of a faster lap time. They should put carpet tacks on the run off areas. :p
 
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