Saints expelled from Play Offs by EFL

[SR get out of my club]

So if, as expected, the appeal fails, it came to light earlier that we couldn't pursue a legal challenge.

Now I thought that was referring to CAS, and not a legal challenge through the courts for damages against the EFL.

Anyone have any insight to this, as surely we can do the latter even if CAS is off the table.

All CAS would do would be to have the power to reinstate us to the final, I thought.

 

[Libby]

The more I think about this the more annoyed I am about it.

As much as I don't want promotion I've spent the best part of 4 grand on this season, not to mention the time I could have spent with my nipper, and for the club to basically chuck the whole season away ****ing stinks.

They'll be wanting more money from me within a month too.

Shower of ****s.

 

[thereisonlyoneno7]

The more I think about this the more annoyed I am about it.

As much as I don't want promotion I've spent the best part of 4 grand on this season, not to mention the time I could have spent with my nipper, and for the club to basically chuck the whole season away ****ing stinks.

They'll be wanting more money from me within a month too.

^^This is where I am at. Without the £4k

 

[Puck]

One thing someone’s just mentioned to me. I think most people agree that we wouldn’t have just spied on Oxford, Ipswich and Boro, these were just the cases they had evidence for in a short space of time.

If other clubs wanted to dig deeper with more time to do it and find evidence we did do it more than the 3 games, then we could potentially be punished more? Could it lead to lawsuits if we get caught doing it on multiple occasions so the likes of Wrexham could say we shouldn’t have been in the playoffs because of the points deduction? Or possibly a -2 per game (as per the -4 penalty already given) so we start next season -40 or something

I suspect other clubs don't want to open that can of worms because a lot of them do the same thing to some extent. As far as I know the evidence relating to Ipswich and Oxford has come from Saints - the messages on staff phones.

 

[Pelletron]

The more I think about this the more annoyed I am about it.

As much as I don't want promotion I've spent the best part of 4 grand on this season, not to mention the time I could have spent with my nipper, and for the club to basically chuck the whole season away ****ing stinks.

They'll be wanting more money from me within a month too.

Shower of ****s.

But they're our ****s!

 

[SaintElliot]

One thing someone’s just mentioned to me. I think most people agree that we wouldn’t have just spied on Oxford, Ipswich and Boro, these were just the cases they had evidence for in a short space of time.

If other clubs wanted to dig deeper with more time to do it and find evidence we did do it more than the 3 games, then we could potentially be punished more? Could it lead to lawsuits if we get caught doing it on multiple occasions so the likes of Wrexham could say we shouldn’t have been in the playoffs because of the points deduction? Or possibly a -2 per game (as per the -4 penalty already given) so we start next season -40 or something

That would be almost impossible to prove with any certainty from a legal standpoint, I'd imagine. You'd then have every club looking at every player who cheats to win a penalty that influences the result, or arguing that a team should forfeit the match because one of your players scored a game winning goal whilst on PEDs etc.

 

[Ronnie Hotdog (MLsfc)]

Hull owner has confirmed they are talking to lawyers as it is unfair to have their opponents suddenly changed with such short notice. EFL have had a nightmare

 

[DMD]

You must log in or register to see media

 

[SaintElliot]

The more I think about this the more annoyed I am about it.

As much as I don't want promotion I've spent the best part of 4 grand on this season, not to mention the time I could have spent with my nipper, and for the club to basically chuck the whole season away ****ing stinks.

They'll be wanting more money from me within a month too.

Shower of ****s.

You just have to think of the players (not in terms of their finances, they'll be fine, but in terms of their play on the pitch over the last 35+ games). I want the final to go ahead because the players have absolutely nothing to do with this. I don't care if we sack Tonda and the first team staff and have no manager on the side-lines, or if we play the game with 10 players and lose 5-0 to Hull. The EFL sanctioned two games of football after we were charged and need to be held accountable as well.

 

[st_brendy]

Hull owner has confirmed they are talking to lawyers as it is unfair to have their opponents suddenly changed with such short notice. EFL have had a nightmare

And if we don't get reinstated (which we won't), I hope that Hull take action against the EFL and succeed.

Throwing us out didn't need to equate to reinstating Boro, especially at such sort notice. It's hugely unfair on Hull. Just award them the play-off promotion spot.

 

[SaintElliot]

You must log in or register to see media

I'd be more than ok with this. Middlesbrough don't deserve a bye to the final after the EFL sanctioned two games to be played, when they could (and should) have postponed the games if they had any idea that this was going to be the punishment.

 

[RSS]

Hull owner has confirmed they are talking to lawyers as it is unfair to have their opponents suddenly changed with such short notice. EFL have had a nightmare

If Hull didn't do that, then I'd assume the punishment was pre-arranged by the EFL and the independent enquiry was all for show tbh and they'd already told Hull to prepare for Boro. Hull should be mad. It is a **** show. Both us and Boro could prepare for Hull. Hull have done nothing wrong and spent a week preparing to play us only for it to be changed a few days beforehand whilst Boro who didn't even win their semi have known it was Hull or no-one and so now have an advantage. **** show. It's one reason why I really didn't think they would kick us out. Just like they twiddled their thumbs and hoped Boro would beat us in the Semi finals, they'll now be twiddling their tumbs hoping Hull beat Boro. What a fantastic bunch of useless twats run the EFL.

 

[Libby]

And if we don't get reinstated (which we won't), I hope that Hull take action against the EFL and succeed.

Throwing us out didn't need to equate to reinstating Boro, especially at such sort notice. It's hugely unfair on Hull. Just award them the play-off promotion spot.

Must admit I don't get this argument. Surely every time a team is chucked out of a cup competition the team they beat goes through?

The short notice thing is more than a bit unfair, but Boro going through seems to just be standard for how things normally work.

 

[Libby]

Theres an example from this season actually. Luton won the EFL trophy despite losing in an earlier round.

Has it ever not worked that way domestically in England?

 

[Shandy_top_89]

I am 100% on the SR are responsible bandwagon for this, but I have to say seeing ****ing scousers having digs online makes me laugh.

The tapping up and database hacking club getting all pious.

 

[st_brendy]

Must admit I don't get this argument. Surely every time a team is chucked out of a cup competition the team they beat goes through?

The short notice thing is more than a bit unfair, but Boro going through seems to just be standard for how things normally work.

For me it depends on why you're being chucked out. Take Swindon this season - fielding two ineligible players in their win vs Luton has a far bigger impact on that result, in my opinion. I think it's fair enough that Luton got reinstated.

But I don't think it automatically has to be that the defeated team gets reinstated. That should always be a decision to be made on a case-by-case basis. And in this case, I just think it creates too much unfairness on Hull.

 

[DMD]

Must admit I don't get this argument. Surely every time a team is chucked out of a cup competition the team they beat goes through?

The short notice thing is more than a bit unfair, but Boro going through seems to just be standard for how things normally work.

Really not wanting to stir any pots, but where do you draw the line for that argument? Would the teams that missed out on the play offs have a hat in the ring too?

 

[SaintElliot]

Theres an example from this season actually. Luton won the EFL trophy despite losing in an earlier round.

Has it ever not worked that way domestically in England?

But going through to a final must be different? You could argue at an earlier round that Luton still had to beat teams to get to the final.

 

[Ronnie Hotdog (MLsfc)]

Theres an example from this season actually. Luton won the EFL trophy despite losing in an earlier round.

Has it ever not worked that way domestically in England?

Swindons offence didnt occur before the game, so the efl had no chance to take action prior. This is completely different, they allowed the fixture, and then 2nd leg, to be played, then waited a week before taking action.

Plus there would have been other fixtures before the team in the next round played luton/swindon, so their preparations wouldnt have been impacted.

 

[Libby]

For me it depends on why you're being chucked out. Take Swindon this season - fielding two ineligible players in their win vs Luton has a far bigger impact on that result, in my opinion. I think it's fair enough that Luton got reinstated.

But I don't think it automatically has to be that the defeated team gets reinstated. That should always be a decision to be made on a case-by-case basis. And in this case, I just think it creates too much unfairness on Hull.

I think that confuses things too much personally. What if the ineligible player has a terrible game? Also I think the impact on our tie isn't quantifiable so we can't say for certainty it had less impact.

For me the point is there is a strong precedent for the defeated team going through. Is there a single example of that not happening and the club they draw next getting a bye instead?

Not saying there hasn't btw, genuinely curious.