Off Topic Major incident in Southport

[Evil Jimmy Krankie]

I’ve been reluctant to get involved in this side of the discussion but the UK does appear to be a country of choice rather than of necessity to those coming over on the boats.
I don’t know where I heard this, possibly on the Triggernometry podcast but this year alone 28,000 people, mainly fighting age young males, have landed by boat on the south coast. If that is true, I cannot see how that amount of people can be successfully integrated into the country every year without a huge strain being placed on the economy. They appear to be queue jumping and we British hate people who jump the queue!!

 

[Smug in Boots]

I wonder how concerned and vocal Farage will be about this poor girl ...

... as he's unlikely to be able to benefit personally from this incident.

'A 13-year-old girl has been stabbed and six teenagers arrested on suspicion of attempted murder. Humberside Police said she was found at the side of the A63 dual carriageway in Hessle at about 07:00 GMT on Friday. She suffered "lacerations" to her neck, chest and abdomen and her injuries are "life-threatening", the force said. Four boys aged 14, 15, 16 and 17, and two girls aged 14 and 15 were arrested soon after in a wooded area nearby.'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8jy0331mxlo

 

[safc-noggieland]

So it appear, to me st least, that you have fallen fpr the oldest political con going.

The reason ‘our own people’ have problems about food, health, keeping warm and child abuse is caused or even exacerbated by people that have also suffered intolerably.
We should be focusing on the real villains of the peace that not really created this problem and told ‘sorry but we can’t do anything because these other bastards/refugees’ are here.
14 effing years of giving their effing mates millions - without controls - is the reason the can’t/won’t find the money to keep good food on our tables, protect our children etc. etc. etc.
INCOMPETENCE and CORRUPTION are our enemy not fellow human being suffering.

 

[The Norton Cat]

I think what this thread shows is that a lot of people, whether they are pro- or anti-immigration, don't really understand how the asylum system works. A lot of posts are motivated by people's own prejudices and there seems to be little interest in understanding that the whole thing is very complicated.

It's not as simple as just "let them in" or "don't let them in"; there are a variety of factors that have to be taken into account. Belittling someone else's views because they don't align with your own doesn't achieve anything and, because it goes to the very top, is the reason that the political landscape in this country looks so very bleak.

 

[safc-noggieland]

I’ m not questioning you or your post , just thinking you may know the answer to what I don’t understand. “ we are obliged to keep them safe, warm & fed as per good humane international law requires“. So how come in France they are in tents , the French aren’t providing hotels ?

Where did l say anything about the French do ?

All l said and continue to say is ‘ take the blinkers off’ - the slimey incompent government are deflecting your rightful anger and indignation and turning it on to a party that ( in my earnest opinion) are being scapegoated.
The focus should be on the politicians not their patsies.

Their priorities were not the people of the UK nor refugees, their priorities are themselves and their mates.

 

[Pure River Slut]

I’ve been reluctant to get involved in this side of the discussion but the UK does appear to be a country of choice rather than of necessity to those coming over on the boats.
I don’t know where I heard this, possibly on the Triggernometry podcast but this year alone 28,000 people, mainly fighting age young males, have landed by boat on the south coast. If that is true, I cannot see how that amount of people can be successfully integrated into the country every year without a huge strain being placed on the economy. They appear to be queue jumping and we British hate people who jump the queue!!

Fact
In absolute terms, the largest numbers of foreign-born residents (from other EU countries and non-EU countries) were registered in Germany (16.5 million people), France (8.9 million) and Spain (8.2 million)

 

[rooch 3]

Fact
In absolute terms, the largest numbers of foreign-born residents (from other EU countries and non-EU countries) were registered in Germany (16.5 million people), France (8.9 million) and Spain (8.2 million)

In your honest opinion what do you think the German, French and Spanish people think of that, are they happy with it?

 

[marcusblackcat]

I also have empathy for legitimate asylum seekers fleeing persecution and war..

Unless they arrive in the back of a lorry seemingly!

As for “keeping our pensioners warm” you mention above, my parents and in laws are complaining about the same thing, all in there 70s. Yet they drive brand new cars they own outright and go on 2 or 3 holidays a year.

That side of things should be means tested!

 

[rooch 3]

Unless they arrive in the back of a lorry seemingly!

As for “keeping our pensioners warm” you mention above, my parents and in laws are complaining about the same thing, all in there 70s. Yet they drive brand new cars they own outright and go on 2 or 3 holidays a year.

That side of things should be means tested!

Is that not your parents and in-laws fault for being greedy?

 

[The Norton Cat]

In your honest opinion what do you think the German, French and Spanish people think of that, are they happy with it?

As far right parties have made ground recently in those countries, I'd say not. Having studied that kind of thing a little bit, it seems to me that the political conditions in a lot of places are, sadly, conducive to that. One of the best ways to ensure a rise in right wing sentiment is to tell people with a slight concern over things like immigration that they're stupid.

As one side moves away from the centre and attacks the moderates on the other side, so both sides move increasingly further from the sensible middle ground.

 

[WorkyTicketFTM]

I wonder how concerned and vocal Farage will be about this poor girl ...

... as he's unlikely to be able to benefit personally from this incident.

'A 13-year-old girl has been stabbed and six teenagers arrested on suspicion of attempted murder. Humberside Police said she was found at the side of the A63 dual carriageway in Hessle at about 07:00 GMT on Friday. She suffered "lacerations" to her neck, chest and abdomen and her injuries are "life-threatening", the force said. Four boys aged 14, 15, 16 and 17, and two girls aged 14 and 15 were arrested soon after in a wooded area nearby.'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8jy0331mxlo

I wouldn’t be so sure, some rumours surfacing that police were seen visiting a hotel in the area that houses migrants. No idea if it’s true mind could just be **** stirring.

 

[WorkyTicketFTM]

In your honest opinion what do you think the German, French and Spanish people think of that, are they happy with it?

He’s just trolling but be careful, once you start making him look stupid he’ll block you.

The UK surpassed 16% of foreign born nationals this year which is more than Germany, France and Italy. The UK foreign born population has more than doubled from 4.5m to nearly 10m in the last 20 years. Germany has the most foreign born by number but that’s because their population is 20m more than ours, we have a larger percentage. Also worth noting Germany is full of Turkish folk, there’s a huge German/turk population.

 

[Montysoptician]

I think what this thread shows is that a lot of people, whether they are pro- or anti-immigration, don't really understand how the asylum system works. A lot of posts are motivated by people's own prejudices and there seems to be little interest in understanding that the whole thing is very complicated.

It's not as simple as just "let them in" or "don't let them in"; there are a variety of factors that have to be taken into account. Belittling someone else's views because they don't align with your own doesn't achieve anything and, because it goes to the very top, is the reason that the political landscape in this country looks so very bleak.

Very good post Norton and the reason why I rarely get into these discussions.

Whether we like it or not we are influenced by the media and the multi billionaire owners set the agenda of their particular outlet. I don’t see anything wrong with that providing we realise that whichever media outlet we use for our news will have a deliberate slant.

It was interesting to see our then Home Secretary Suella Braverman squirming when she was asked the question by a member of the Home Affairs Select Committee. The truth is there are no safe routes for the majority of countries and an application can only be made for asylum once individuals arrive in the UK.

You must log in or register to see media

 

[Pure River Slut]

In your honest opinion what do you think the German, French and Spanish people think of that, are they happy with it?

No but they probably don’t think they are the only victims of it. It’s tough but there are very few that are horrible. Most just want dj what we do.
Do you think people from Afghanistan are happy they are having to travel, and we left the best of em in the ****e

 

[williebeams]

our gates of toledo

 

[gelders pie]

I’m

Where did l say anything about the French do ?

All l said and continue to say is ‘ take the blinkers off’ - the slimey incompent government are deflecting your rightful anger and indignation and turning it on to a party that ( in my earnest opinion) are being scapegoated.
The focus should be on the politicians not their patsies.

Their priorities were not the people of the UK nor refugees, their priorities are themselves and their mates.

You didn’t say France put them in hotels , I said they didn’t. I’m just curious as to why we do but France doesn’t ? Just wondered if you knew , no worries if you don’t

 

[Pure River Slut]

As far right parties have made ground recently in those countries, I'd say not. Having studied that kind of thing a little bit, it seems to me that the political conditions in a lot of places are, sadly, conducive to that. One of the best ways to ensure a rise in right wing sentiment is to tell people with a slight concern over things like immigration that they're stupid.

As one side moves away from the centre and attacks the moderates on the other side, so both sides move increasingly further from the sensible middle ground.

I also think there needs to be some education and critical thinking on why people travel. Climate change - largely on us industrialised nations, travelling from Afghanistan, Iraq partially on us, Iran, Palestine, Ukraine - due to rogue states. There’s a human and political responsibility. To be honest those saying ‘look after our own’ are a bit ignorant of what goes on in the world, a bit xenophobic, also probably moan about our own getting government hand outs. They just aren’t very human in many cases. That doesn’t discount the fact that the poorest communities here largely face the biggest challenges around integration. That’s a reality and the ‘gated’ or communities cushioned by wealth can manages away the problem and be idealistic. Cooperation with other states has to happen and we need a functional system and we need a mindset of helping others but that burden shouldn’t just land on already impacted communities. I also really think people should be able to work and qualifications be transferable. We create a problem elsewhere in the system by preventing people from making a positive contribution. I remember having a Bengali lad who fled because his family were at risk because of dad’s political opposition. Dad was missing. He was teaching English kids English and maths voluntarily. He got 11 gcse A’s and 5 A level A’s while waiting, then appealing. Couldn’t work. Deported. God knows what became of him. Hardly a threat to British society.

 

[The Norton Cat]

I also think there needs to be some education and critical thinking on why people travel. Climate change - largely on us industrialised nations, travelling from Afghanistan, Iraq partially on us, Iran, Palestine, Ukraine - due to rogue states. There’s a human and political responsibility. To be honest those saying ‘look after our own’ are a bit ignorant of what goes on in the world, a bit xenophobic, also probably moan about our own getting government hand outs. They just aren’t very human in many cases. That doesn’t discount the fact that the poorest communities here largely face the biggest challenges around integration. That’s a reality and the ‘gated’ or communities cushioned by wealth can manages away the problem and be idealistic. Cooperation with other states has to happen and we need a functional system and we need a mindset of helping others but that burden shouldn’t just land on already impacted communities. I also really think people should be able to work and qualifications be transferable. We create a problem elsewhere in the system by preventing people from making a positive contribution. I remember having a Bengali lad who fled because his family were at risk because of dad’s political opposition. Dad was missing. He was teaching English kids English and maths voluntarily. He got 11 gcse A’s and 5 A level A’s while waiting, then appealing. Couldn’t work. Deported. God knows what became of him. Hardly a threat to British society.

There's a lot in there that I agree with. Can't say I agree with your rhetoric though.

 

[Pure River Slut]

There's a lot in there that I agree with. Can't say I agree with your rhetoric though.

Don’t think we should let people be dehumanised because they are ‘outsiders’ for the purpose of political neutrality.

 

[The Norton Cat]

Don’t think we should let people be dehumanised because they are ‘outsiders’ for the purpose of political neutrality.

I don't think anyone is being dehumanised until people start saying that people that don't agree with them "aren't very human". It's not about political neutrality. Its about understanding why people feel the way they do and bringing all sides together to find a way forward, rather than creating division which only results in animosity and backward steps. You don't bring people round to your way of thinking by telling them they're stupid or ignorant.