Absolutely nothing to do with the manager…

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Kalman said:
What, like creating societies that people risk their lives on rubber dinghies to come to? Lmao.
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I think you’ll find that we live in a society that is the product of multiculturalism. Probably wouldn’t be anywhere near as good if all the racist Brits had gotten their way though!
 
Help! said:
I think I'm broadly on the same side as you in this debate, but as someone from Hull who's origins at least are working class I would say that HIGNFY demonstrates almost perfectly how hard it is to get right.

It's a while ago now, and I honestly don't intend this to be a political point per se (and I'm no fan of the bloke either), but seeing privileged public school educated Ian Hislop ripping the piss out of working class lad made good John Prescott week in week out didn't feel particularly like punching up, but far more like trying to put the upstart oik back in his box.
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Yeah there's a lot nuance to it. You could argue that even though he's done good. His public figure opens him up to ridicule. But I get your point
 
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Howdentiger2 said:
Yer TBF you're right, some races have done way worse things then whites. But this isn't a competition. Absolutely every races in the history of mankind ( sorry humankind) have done awful things, for some reason it's just embedded into humans
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...and some continue to do so. But for some reason it's overlooked .
Just one example, anybody bought any products made in China recently? Only feel faux outrage when it suits eh? Brits or 'whites' the devil? Gtf
 
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zimozimo said:
That’s like comparing Manchester United with Wrexham in terms of footballing success. Completely different levels.

Also, because it sends the racist posters on here into meltdown. Which is fun.
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Skill issue.
 
Random but
Anyone been kotor, montenegro?
Think its legit a hidden gem
Looks incredible

And no you nerds
It doesnt mean knights of the old republic
 
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HCAFCHangout said:
Mocking people of Middle Eastern origin (given most of the -istan countries are from there) is inherently racist. To add on the fact that they struggle to speak English is the typical tropes you see alongside it is also racist.

You can try jump round the fact it isn’t by stating it’s not aimed at a particular country but that not how it works.

If you want try make that joke in front of those respective people and see how it goes?
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Why, are they violent or something? Seems like a racist insinuation.
 
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bradymk2 said:
Random but
Anyone been kotor, montenegro?
Think its legit a hidden gem
Looks incredible

And no you nerds
It doesnt mean knights of the old republic
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Lovely place, some great motor biking roads in that area when they are not chocka with tourists, service in bars and restaurants can be slow and poor.
 
Heimdallr said:
These types of arguments/discussions don't do anyone any favours and leave everyone grubbier.
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What do you suggest instead? Because unfortunately, this forum has to reckon with the fact that there are posters on here that regularly post racist comments, and that is not okay. There should be no tolerance for it whatsoever. Visibly challenging people on their abhorrent and outdated views shows to other members – and potential members – that people here don’t accept these offensive views and that this is a space accepting of all people. If posters stay silent, it shows that ignorance is tolerated, we all become complicit, and everyone loses until this community dies.
 
Tiger15 said:
Let’s not use semantics to get some people off the hook. Punching-down means targeting people in a less privileged position than yourself. Understanding your privilege and another groups hardship is very different from thinking you’re better than those people. By your logic, which I disagree with, I could look at your post and pick you up for using sub-group as the prefix sub, by definition, places something as lesser or smaller then something else. Of course, I wouldn’t, because the logic is idiotic, as is your justification for not liking the term punching-down.
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I consider it more a philosophical point than a semantic one. You've ignored the last line of my post and just gone in with the tribal ****e like most people do, and I knew it was coming from someone. At no point have I condoned the comment, so I'm not 'letting anyone off the hook'. I'm deliberately not taking any part in condemning or condoning the original comment. I'm definitely not supporting it and I'm definitely not looking to shame anyone for it either. I've not touched it. I haven't alluded to my thoughts on it other than the fact I questioned the legitimacy of something said against it.

What I don't agree with is the notion of punching down and where I believe it subconsciously comes from. True equality will only come from harmony in my opinion, which stupid comments, nor fighting about them will ever achieve. Personally I believe in individuality, not group identity - I'm just trying to explain my rhetoric.

In terms of 'sub', it literally just means smaller, or off-branching when referring to groups, as you've essentially said yourself... Which is literally what I'm referring to when I talk about sub-groups. There's no alternative superiority suggestion there - it's a fact that sub-groups are smaller than 'groups', plain and simple, smaller meaning in the minority. 'Punching down' however, connotes causing damage from a position of superiority, whether we're talking literally or metaphorically.

In terms of 'privilege' I have no more or less rights than anyone else here, so we must be talking about either 'historic privilege', which is literally history, or instead referring to 'wealth/affluence'. I'm yet to see anyone make a legitimate argument for a single specific special advantage or specific human right that I have that others in the same country as me currently don't, based solely on the colour of my skin. Real advantages purely come from wealth, and thankfully anyone has the ability to become wealthy through a variety of different means. Some are born into wealth, yes, and they tend to have more opportunities to transition into their own wealth. This has nothing to do with ID factors or groups in my opinion. There are wealthy, influential, powerful people from all different backgrounds and religions in the UK.

I've gone on about wealth a bit much there, but I've always found when people talk about privilege that's quickly where it goes to, and as of right now, I'm not convinced there's any other genuine factor that could legitimately be considered as someone having more or less privilege than someone else. I believe anyone has the ability to be the best they can be and 'get theirs' should they have the aspiration and determination to do so. I don't think people are prevented from wealth accrual based on their nationality, skin colour etc.

I shouldn't have to, but I'll clarify again, I'm not saying racism is OK. Best way to be - treat people how you want to be treated and leave it at that.
 
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