WAR! What is it good for?

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Archers Road said:
I don’t thinking anyone here admires Hamas tbh. I haven’t seen anyone describe them as noble or heroic. They’re a terrorist organisation, the question for Israel is whether fighting terror with terror is going to solve anything.

Do you think that if a U.K. government had responded to IRA atrocities by levelling East Belfast, the ‘troubles’ would have been over sooner? Bit of a moot point of course, because the Yanks would never have allowed that. One has to wonder how much unequivocal support the US will continue to extend to Israel in the current conflict; Anthony Blinken appears to be hinting that there may be limits on the number of civilian casualties in Gaza they’ll turn a blind eye to.
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^^^^ this

The Yanks are getting nervous now - the UN is starting to dig heels in, not least because hospitals are filling up with women and kids, not injured Hamas militia ... and it's being broadcast by International news agencies ...
 
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Archers Road said:
I don’t thinking anyone here admires Hamas tbh. I haven’t seen anyone describe them as noble or heroic. They’re a terrorist organisation, the question for Israel is whether fighting terror with terror is going to solve anything.

Do you think that if a U.K. government had responded to IRA atrocities by levelling East Belfast, the ‘troubles’ would have been over sooner? Bit of a moot point of course, because the Yanks would never have allowed that. One has to wonder how much unequivocal support the US will continue to extend to Israel in the current conflict; Anthony Blinken appears to be hinting that there may be limits on the number of civilian casualties in Gaza they’ll turn a blind eye to.

The best hope for neutralising Hamas btw, may be through the Iranian people removing their own deeply unpopular government; it’s never good when fundamentalists of any stripe are in power.
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would have a certain bantz to it as the east is mainly prod :bandit:
 
FosseFilberto said:
Very true ... but very few Govmts would also authorise 48 strikes on UN refugee camps either ... now about that proportional response thingy...
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few UN refugee camps have armed fighters who are firing rockets .

Considering all the "knowledge" on here it is amazing so many expected a proportional response from Israel considering how they normally react
 
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Solid_Air 2 said:
few UN refugee camps have armed fighters who are firing rockets .

Considering all the "knowledge" on here it is amazing so many expected a proportional response from Israel considering how they normally react
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Iran & Hamas knew exactly how they would react, which is why they did what they did, the more dead Palestinian kids on TV the better for them.
 
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It always made sense to make deal with Ireland though, because no one gave a shhite about NI and we were getting blown up for something we didn't actually care about, when deep down we wanted the same outcome as them, a United Ireland. Finally someone had worked out, that if you leave it long enough (peace that is) that the generations would eventually work towards being an undivided Ireland, they just had to wait for the Munster party and some Northern Irish dinosaurs to die out. Only problem that occured was some stupid ****er called Cameron popped along and thought it would be a great idea, to give the English dinosaurs a chance of brexit, and it sort of upset the apple cart a bit and opened old wounds, but fook 'em.
 
Feels like the protests are taking an uglier turn now. It’s clearly gone well beyond any sort of sympathy for Palestine and has become just an excuse to vandalise **** and be abusive in a mob for a growing minority (still a minority, I’d hasten to add).

A white English kid of no more than 18 was being nicked for trying to rip down the one Israeli flag 50 yards from the Palestine protest as I arrived yesterday. We’ve got Braverman stoking the fire desperate for it to kick off this weekend. I think it’s inevitable somebody gets badly hurt.

FWIW I think there’d be more sympathy for the marches if they took a break this weekend. It’s too late for that to happen now even if they wanted to.

A side issue but a very peaceful protest to free the hostages went basically unreported relative to everything else in London. Nobody even abused a family buying their kid a happy meal.
 
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brb said:
It always made sense to make deal with Ireland though, because no one gave a shhite about NI and we were getting blown up for something we didn't actually care about, when deep down we wanted the same outcome as them, a United Ireland. Finally someone had worked out, that if you leave it long enough (peace that is) that the generations would eventually work towards being an undivided Ireland, they just had to wait for the Munster party and some Northern Irish dinosaurs to die out. Only problem that occured was some stupid ****er called Cameron popped along and thought it would be a great idea, to give the English dinosaurs a chance of brexit, and it sort of upset the apple cart a bit and opened old wounds, but fook 'em.
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The UN should get Feargal Sharkey on the case. Seriously

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Archers Road said:
The UN should get Feargal Sharkey on the case. Seriously

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Yup. I hear people constantly say about a two state solution, but for me that's part of the problem, the wording of it in itself creates division. As we found with Ireland, the language used is very important. You see what people are like English v Welsh, Scottish v English, which is great for football and the bantz, but sadly in real life these divisions can have very serious consequences, especially when you use labels such as Israel or Palestine, people tend to choose a first team kit to wear. Even with attempts of unification you could end up being dragged back to the past and into the USSR, and every time people hark on about history they become part of the problem, and there sure are a lot of people that bang on about history in here.
 
brb said:
Yup. I hear people constantly say about a two state solution, but for me that's part of the problem, the wording of it in itself creates division. As we found with Ireland, the language used is very important. You see what people are like English v Welsh, Scottish v English, which is great for football and the bantz, but sadly in real life these divisions can have very serious consequences, especially when you use labels such as Israel or Palestine, people tend to choose a first team kit to wear. Even with attempts of unification you could end up being dragged back to the past and into the USSR, and every time people hark on about history they become part of the problem, and there sure are a lot of people that bang on about history in here.
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It’s good to learn about the past. It’s not good to live in it.
 
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Not sure why you’d have a two state solution. Just have one big state for the whole Middle East if not a bit further afield with Netanyahu in charge.
 
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Solid_Air 2 said:
few UN refugee camps have armed fighters who are firing rockets .

Considering all the "knowledge" on here it is amazing so many expected a proportional response from Israel considering how they normally react
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So that justifies it?... perhaps in your world, but not in mine ... another 200 deaths over night, again the majority kids and women ... Israel lost 1,400 innocents on 7th October - terrible horrible stuff - but killing 5x + that number in innocent Palestinian women and children is not a just and proportionate response ... it's way beyond.
 
Archers Road said:
It’s good to learn about the past. It’s not good to live in it.
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Spot on ... it needs a modern solution ... but that will never be Israel ruling in Palestine ... as the current resistance to Israel's attempts at occupation in the West Bank and East Jerusalem prove ... that's not history ... it's daily.
 
FosseFilberto said:
So that justifies it?... perhaps in your world, but not in mine ... another 200 deaths over night, again the majority kids and women ... Israel lost 1,400 innocents on 7th October - terrible horrible stuff - but killing 5x + that number in innocent Palestinian women and children is not a just and proportionate response ... it's way beyond.
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So if they’d stopped at 1400 it would’ve been grand?
 
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FosseFilberto said:
Nope... in your arrogance you think you understand my world view ... you don't ... I was appalled by what Hamas did ... I've said it again and again ... but I was also frustrated with the inevitability of it ... and yes that came out at the time ... I readily admit ... but that didn't in any way mean that I condoned what Hamas did or was not appalled, disgusted and in complete sympathy for the families of those that were either killed or had loved ones taken hostage ...

Hamas, or whatever iteration comes next, will never go away whilst Israel continues with policies of suppression, illegal occupation and the establishment of illegal settlements ...
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Hamas will not go away until there's no money in it, regardless of what Israel do.
 
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