Match Day Thread Southampton FC v Brighton - Monday 26th December 2022 - 15:00 ko

[SotonOldBoy]

Want to like this comment. I just can’t for the life of me understand how a decent manager watches videos of all our players, and then picks Lyanco over ABK, Djenepo over Stuie, Diallo over anyone, and so on.

I fully expect Jones to make mistakes. It’s how he reacts to them is how I will judge him. If he sticks with the same players, I give up.

He found Ralphs play book in the dustbin and thought he would give it a try

 

[SotonOldBoy]

I'm not having a pop at Lincoln for criticising, I was laughing with him not at him, but come on, He wanted owners to spend money, they did, he wanted owners to sack Ralph they did and now they're **** because the manager hasn't been at Real Madrid and things didn't get better after one league game.

Its not Lincoln, its this silly idea that we deserve ANYTHING from the game. We are fans and we all want to see winning performances but acting like entitled brats and demanding fans take action and heads roll (projecting and paraphrasing sorry) just sounds ridiculous. We are not going to make the top 10 this year, likely not next, we are very likely to get relegated, we are very likely to continue to sign unknown players and managers and if you can't look for the positives in that then you are going to be bloody miserable for the forseeable future.

Great respect to you for going to the games and I would likely be a lot less accepting if I paid a season ticket but I did buy an away shirt for Xmas and it's bloody lovely. See, positives, not even you and Lincs could complain about the away shirt, right?

It depends who's wearing it, Diallo yes I will complain.

 

[garysfc]

We are bottom of the table. Looking a certainty for relegation.
We have been a premier league club for a long time, yet we have pissed all that money up the wall. We’ve won 3 games all season, and like 7 all calendar year?

It’s not ****ing acceptable from anyone involved. Ralph, the board, whoever. It’s absolutely piss poor. No one person is to blame. It’s a cluster **** of bad decisions from multiple people.

And as fans who love the club we are entitled to point out the ****ing obvious without being told we may as well support city/Liverpool. I was there in league one. I will be there again if it comes to it. But I will also be honest in my assessment when we are being run into the ground. Lincoln is spot on.

I will back NJ, he deserves time now he is here, I personally will never boo in the ground. But the club deserves all the abuse it gets right now.

 

[LincolnSaint]

I'm not having a pop at Lincoln for criticising, I was laughing with him not at him, but come on, He wanted owners to spend money, they did, he wanted owners to sack Ralph they did and now they're **** because the manager hasn't been at Real Madrid and things didn't get better after one league game.

Its not Lincoln, its this silly idea that we deserve ANYTHING from the game. We are fans and we all want to see winning performances but acting like entitled brats and demanding fans take action and heads roll (projecting and paraphrasing sorry) just sounds ridiculous. We are not going to make the top 10 this year, likely not next, we are very likely to get relegated, we are very likely to continue to sign unknown players and managers and if you can't look for the positives in that then you are going to be bloody miserable for the forseeable future.

Great respect to you for going to the games and I would likely be a lot less accepting if I paid a season ticket but I did buy an away shirt for Xmas and it's bloody lovely. See, positives, not even you and Lincs could complain about the away shirt, right?

I don't think it's entitlement (certainly not from me anyway) it's an expectation that our club is not used as some sort of football vanity project where the smug men at the top believe they can reinvent the wheel because they're just oh so clever. The buy low sell high model has been tried umpteen times before and failed. Are they really that arrogant to think they know better? That somehow it will work for them?

The appointment of NJ IMHO was a massive **** you to the fans. Its the board telling us exactly how special they think they are. There's not one positive aspect of Jones, we're now bottom of the table- what players are going to want to come here in Jan, he's not exactly a draw is he?

Did you actually see the Lincoln and Brighton games? Did you watch them entirely? We were really really bad, Jones has actually made us worse. Its not one game, he's had the squad for the best part of 2 months and still doesn't know what he's doing. He's massively out of his depth and shouldn't be anywhere near the club.

 

[thereisonlyoneno7]

I take on the “Rome wasnt built in a day” line normally, but to me NJ has had 8 weeks (from when he was appointed ) and a full 5-6 weeks with the squad intensive training and he has made us worse than under Ralph. Maybe because he did it before (a few times) but I would trust Ralph 100% more to keep us up this year with the cards he has been dealt.

 

[Le Tissier's Laces]

I don't think it's entitlement (certainly not from me anyway) it's an expectation that our club is not used as some sort of football vanity project where the smug men at the top believe they can reinvent the wheel because they're just oh so clever. The buy low sell high model has been tried umpteen times before and failed. Are they really that arrogant to think they know better? That somehow it will work for them?

The appointment of NJ IMHO was a massive **** you to the fans. Its the board telling us exactly how special they think they are. There's not one positive aspect of Jones, we're now bottom of the table- what players are going to want to come here in Jan, he's not exactly a draw is he?

Did you actually see the Lincoln and Brighton games? Did you watch them entirely? We were really really bad, Jones has actually made us worse. Its not one game, he's had the squad for the best part of 2 months and still doesn't know what he's doing. He's massively out of his depth and shouldn't be anywhere near the club.

I do sort of agree (and am about to do a Sportato post about it all), but disagree that the buy low sell high model is a failure - Brighton do it brilliantly, Dortmund do it brilliantly. The painful part is that Brighton learned how to do it from a certain South Coast club a few years back, who used to do it incredibly well...

Now, purely using data to make your decisions, including managerial appointments - yes, that smacks of arrogance that is so all-encompassing, it blinds you to the obvious. But that's another story.

 

[Saintmagic]

I do sort of agree (and am about to do a Sportato post about it all), but disagree that the buy low sell high model is a failure - Brighton do it brilliantly, Dortmund do it brilliantly. The painful part is that Brighton learned how to do it from a certain South Coast club a few years back, who used to do it incredibly well...

Now, purely using data to make your decisions, including managerial appointments - yes, that smacks of arrogance that is so all-encompassing, it blinds you to the obvious. But that's another story.

Football is pretty cyclical with the teams outside the top 6/7 and Everton having good and bad spells where they may go down/be best of the rest/relegation fighters/spend a few years outside the top flight/mid table nobodies. The one constant is the big teams are at the top and everyone else muddles around a bit

 

[Osvaldorama]

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[RSS]

The only highlight was the return of Maya

 

[garysfc]

I don't think it's entitlement (certainly not from me anyway) it's an expectation that our club is not used as some sort of football vanity project where the smug men at the top believe they can reinvent the wheel because they're just oh so clever. The buy low sell high model has been tried umpteen times before and failed. Are they really that arrogant to think they know better? That somehow it will work for them?

The appointment of NJ IMHO was a massive **** you to the fans. Its the board telling us exactly how special they think they are. There's not one positive aspect of Jones, we're now bottom of the table- what players are going to want to come here in Jan, he's not exactly a draw is he?

Did you actually see the Lincoln and Brighton games? Did you watch them entirely? We were really really bad, Jones has actually made us worse. Its not one game, he's had the squad for the best part of 2 months and still doesn't know what he's doing. He's massively out of his depth and shouldn't be anywhere near the club.

Definitely agree we’ve been worse in the last 2 games. Fulham & Forest will tell us exactly where we are; no question. With that said, it might be very hard on NJ to judge him after 5x games & couple months to bed in but that’s the reality. Tough.

 

[Libby]

Has he really made us worse than Ralph or is that hyperbole? I don't see that at all tbh, think people are conflating Ralph's entire tenure with this season where we've been absolutely tragic for the majority of it.

Sunday was by no means our worst performance of the season. We were just as bad in Ralph's last game v Newcastle and much worse in matches vs Everton and (especially) Villa.

 

[SaintinNZ]

I don't think it's entitlement (certainly not from me anyway) it's an expectation that our club is not used as some sort of football vanity project where the smug men at the top believe they can reinvent the wheel because they're just oh so clever. The buy low sell high model has been tried umpteen times before and failed. Are they really that arrogant to think they know better? That somehow it will work for them?

The appointment of NJ IMHO was a massive **** you to the fans. Its the board telling us exactly how special they think they are. There's not one positive aspect of Jones, we're now bottom of the table- what players are going to want to come here in Jan, he's not exactly a draw is he?

Did you actually see the Lincoln and Brighton games? Did you watch them entirely? We were really really bad, Jones has actually made us worse. Its not one game, he's had the squad for the best part of 2 months and still doesn't know what he's doing. He's massively out of his depth and shouldn't be anywhere near the club.

Yep, I watched the entirety of both games. The cup game I was hugely disappointed to see how little difference there was between Ralph's strategies and NJ. You are overstating how poor we were against Brighton IMO. We lost 3-1, two of those were literal gifts, one was a worldy we wont see again for 2 years on past evidence. This season has been, and is going to be, one of nearly but not quite. We were very poor in the first half but credit to NJ, he can only play the players he has at his disposal, he was positive with the game management and there were some good positive signs in the second half. Its a lot easier to be dispassionate watching from afar on the TV I will say.

Re NJ - I agree that he isn't going to draw anyone to the club, the ones he can draw fans will be irate about. He's 2 games in though, hardly a fair crack of the whip by anyones measure. Patience is required here, let him try and build a team from the very odd blocks he's been given to work with. Don't be surprised to see an underwhelming signing or two come in January, they'll be looking for some experience, spirit and heart to supplement the young talent we've got in abundance.

My throw away comment about go support City and Newcastle was serious in so far as they are what you measure us against, state owned super clubs with the resources to do whatever they want and get whoever they want. We aren't that and very very likely never will be. The squad is the one we've got, the manager is the one we've got, the owners are the one's we've got and we are the club we are.

 

[St. Luigi Scrosoppi]

Having watched a cup final the Queen was asked who she thought had played well.

Her immediate answer was the Royal Marines Band.

I felt the same on Saturday with regards to the Saints Marching Band.

What does worry me though is that it was always said that the team that was bottom at Christmas always went down.

That is us scuppered then.

 

[Osvaldorama]

Yep, I watched the entirety of both games. The cup game I was hugely disappointed to see how little difference there was between Ralph's strategies and NJ. You are overstating how poor we were against Brighton IMO. We lost 3-1, two of those were literal gifts, one was a worldy we wont see again for 2 years on past evidence. This season has been, and is going to be, one of nearly but not quite. We were very poor in the first half but credit to NJ, he can only play the players he has at his disposal, he was positive with the game management and there were some good positive signs in the second half. Its a lot easier to be dispassionate watching from afar on the TV I will say.

Re NJ - I agree that he isn't going to draw anyone to the club, the ones he can draw fans will be irate about. He's 2 games in though, hardly a fair crack of the whip by anyones measure. Patience is required here, let him try and build a team from the very odd blocks he's been given to work with. Don't be surprised to see an underwhelming signing or two come in January, they'll be looking for some experience, spirit and heart to supplement the young talent we've got in abundance.

My throw away comment about go support City and Newcastle was serious in so far as they are what you measure us against, state owned super clubs with the resources to do whatever they want and get whoever they want. We aren't that and very very likely never will be. The squad is the one we've got, the manager is the one we've got, the owners are the one's we've got and we are the club we are.

So what you’re basically saying is that no one is allowed a negative opinion because we are who we are?

They can sell who they like, charge what they like. Saints are saints, sorry. Ticket prices go up, results get worse and worse.. don’t care shut up and accept it.

Sorry, but that’s utter bollocks. You don’t need to be owned by the state to make good decisions.

I can name about 10 awful decisions just off the top of my head that have lead to us being bottom of the league. None of which needed unlimited resources to fix. Just to assess the squad correctly.

We will never compete with the big six but we don’t need to be anywhere near this ****

 

[LincolnSaint]

Yep, I watched the entirety of both games. The cup game I was hugely disappointed to see how little difference there was between Ralph's strategies and NJ. You are overstating how poor we were against Brighton IMO. We lost 3-1, two of those were literal gifts, one was a worldy we wont see again for 2 years on past evidence. This season has been, and is going to be, one of nearly but not quite. We were very poor in the first half but credit to NJ, he can only play the players he has at his disposal, he was positive with the game management and there were some good positive signs in the second half. Its a lot easier to be dispassionate watching from afar on the TV I will say.

Re NJ - I agree that he isn't going to draw anyone to the club, the ones he can draw fans will be irate about. He's 2 games in though, hardly a fair crack of the whip by anyones measure. Patience is required here, let him try and build a team from the very odd blocks he's been given to work with. Don't be surprised to see an underwhelming signing or two come in January, they'll be looking for some experience, spirit and heart to supplement the young talent we've got in abundance.

My throw away comment about go support City and Newcastle was serious in so far as they are what you measure us against, state owned super clubs with the resources to do whatever they want and get whoever they want. We aren't that and very very likely never will be. The squad is the one we've got, the manager is the one we've got, the owners are the one's we've got and we are the club we are.

What was a good positive sign in the second half? We conceded another goal, and Brighton took their foot off the gas. He brought on some subs, so what? They did nothing to change the game. NJ has absolutely nothing going on which makes me think he has the ability to set us up right. Nothing. We (the club and the fans) don't have time to show him patience and to be honest I'm not sure why we owe him any.

Yep City, Newcastle etc have funds we're never ever going to compete with. However if we're spending 12 million on a keeper don't spunk it on a kid who was playing in league 1 and couldn't catch a cold, because your special little computer says you'll be able to sell him on for lots more in a few seasons. Don't spend money on the likes of Mara and Larios. Spend the money you do have on players who make the squad better. A revolutionary idea I know. I'm not expecting ****ing Haarland.

This isn't a pop directly at you, but your attitude is exactly why the club think they can sign managers like NJ. They know the vast majority of our fans will just lap up any old bollocks and make excuses for whoever is in charge. It was a massive insult to the fans recruiting Jones, stunningly obvious that it wouldn't work but everyone is banging on about giving him a chance. Madness.

 

[SaintinNZ]

What was a good positive sign in the second half? We conceded another goal, and Brighton took their foot off the gas. He brought on some subs, so what? They did nothing to change the game. NJ has absolutely nothing going on which makes me think he has the ability to set us up right. Nothing. We (the club and the fans) don't have time to show him patience and to be honest I'm not sure why we owe him any.

Yep City, Newcastle etc have funds we're never ever going to compete with. However if we're spending 12 million on a keeper don't spunk it on a kid who was playing in league 1 and couldn't catch a cold, because your special little computer says you'll be able to sell him on for lots more in a few seasons. Don't spend money on the likes of Mara and Larios. Spend the money you do have on players who make the squad better. A revolutionary idea I know. I'm not expecting ****ing Haarland.

This isn't a pop directly at you, but your attitude is exactly why the club think they can sign managers like NJ. They know the vast majority of our fans will just lap up any old bollocks and make excuses for whoever is in charge. It was a massive insult to the fans recruiting Jones, stunningly obvious that it wouldn't work but everyone is banging on about giving him a chance. Madness.

Don’t change Lincoln, I’m starting to enjoy being ****. How boring it would be if we were City.

 

[SaintinNZ]

So what you’re basically saying is that no one is allowed a negative opinion because we are who we are?

They can sell who they like, charge what they like. Saints are saints, sorry. Ticket prices go up, results get worse and worse.. don’t care shut up and accept it.

Sorry, but that’s utter bollocks. You don’t need to be owned by the state to make good decisions.

I can name about 10 awful decisions just off the top of my head that have lead to us being bottom of the league. None of which needed unlimited resources to fix. Just to assess the squad correctly.

We will never compete with the big six but we don’t need to be anywhere near this ****

Mate, stop being so effing defensive anytime I respond, think what you like. I never told you what to think, It was a basic statement of facts.

If you want to rage at someone take some cardboard down to st Mary’s and stamp around outside.

 

[AberdeenSaint]

New manager bounce is a bit of a myth - off the top of my head, Man U didn't get one from Ten Hag, Newcastle didn't from Eddie Howe, and Leeds didn't from Jesse Marsch. I don't think I can recall a new manager ever having been dropped into as deep an end as NJ! I don't actually think he can take a single bit of blame atm. All he could have done is reject the job offer.

I`m thinking of the likes of Gary O`Neil, as a recent example.

 

[Lovelocum]

So what you’re basically saying is that no one is allowed a negative opinion because we are who we are?

They can sell who they like, charge what they like. Saints are saints, sorry. Ticket prices go up, results get worse and worse.. don’t care shut up and accept it.

Sorry, but that’s utter bollocks. You don’t need to be owned by the state to make good decisions.

I can name about 10 awful decisions just off the top of my head that have lead to us being bottom of the league. None of which needed unlimited resources to fix. Just to assess the squad correctly.

We will never compete with the big six but we don’t need to be anywhere near this ****

Yes, it’s not unreasonable to ask that we’re not the worst team in the league.

 

[Lovelocum]

What was a good positive sign in the second half? We conceded another goal, and Brighton took their foot off the gas. He brought on some subs, so what? They did nothing to change the game. NJ has absolutely nothing going on which makes me think he has the ability to set us up right. Nothing. We (the club and the fans) don't have time to show him patience and to be honest I'm not sure why we owe him any.

Yep City, Newcastle etc have funds we're never ever going to compete with. However if we're spending 12 million on a keeper don't spunk it on a kid who was playing in league 1 and couldn't catch a cold, because your special little computer says you'll be able to sell him on for lots more in a few seasons. Don't spend money on the likes of Mara and Larios. Spend the money you do have on players who make the squad better. A revolutionary idea I know. I'm not expecting ****ing Haarland.

This isn't a pop directly at you, but your attitude is exactly why the club think they can sign managers like NJ. They know the vast majority of our fans will just lap up any old bollocks and make excuses for whoever is in charge. It was a massive insult to the fans recruiting Jones, stunningly obvious that it wouldn't work but everyone is banging on about giving him a chance. Madness.

I suspect you might be right, but what makes you so sure he won’t be able to set us up right? We’ve only really had 2 games.

I didn’t see either match, what are the specific issues you see with NJ at this early stage?